aussie_ironborn Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 It's not the rape that is the problem, it's that it happens to a STARK. Lord eddards daughter is not for Ramsay Snow and he never should have been allowed near her on the show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The One And Only Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 There was enough in the last two books to make for some really stellar TV. It's like they didn't plan the show at all and just glossed over the books last year before production started. Something with a congruent story line could have been fashioned because the people behind this are supposed to be professional writers. You put more emphasis here, take some away there, and set the entire series up so that the stuff in this season is compelling and within the realm of possibility. And people come to these threads to rant on a show they used to like about a series of novels they love. That is why. Stop asking. Then they can stick to the book part of the forum. The books haven't changed. Brienne, Jamie, and Sansa's storylines from the last 2 books would have made pointless television. And they had to combine characters to not make the show go too slow with all of the additions from the books. I have yet to see somebody show me a better version of what the show could have done with 10 episodes based on all of that content. Because they couldn't do better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bb1180 Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 Like it or not, LF's plan makes sense. He is playing the Boltons and Stannis off against each other and setting matters up so that he can march an army in from the Vale to defeat whoever survives the battle. And unlike both Stannis and the Boltons, he will have the support of the North fighting to save the last surviving Stark. Actually, his plan doesn't just make sense, it was actually brilliant. He was trying to use Sansa to lure Cersei into sending the remaining Lannister forces to Winterfell and make that into a three way battle of already-weakened forces. LF would then march in at the tail end and annihilate whomever was left standing with the Vale armies, which are still at full strength. It might well have made him the most powerful man left in Westeros, from a military standpoint, aside from perhaps Doran Martell. In the end, Cersei balked at sending an army north, but he's still in a position to take out two contenders with little risk to himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faint Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 Not sure how to rate this episode. I would give the Arya and Sansa portions a 9; the Jorah and Tyrion show an 8; the King's Landing part a 7; and the Dorne scenes a -3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Ermesande Hayford Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 What nobleman is going to want a women whose virtue was taken via rape, repeated at that? With Jeyne Pool this was never a question, but it is now. Sansa, for all intents and purposes, is done as a major player. There's no Dragons around for her to link her fate to. A nobleman that wants to be the lord of winterfell... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sillent Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 Ermagawd, I was fine watching people eaten by dogs, tortured, castrated, raped and murdered -- but if Sansa gets raped after volunteering to marry Ramsay instead of Jeyne Pool who was abused even more and had no choice in marrying Ramsay I will be outraged to the point of pretending to quit watching the show. Yes because skipping the Vale storyline and replacing Jeyne Pool with Sansa had nothing to do with streamlining and keeping viewers interested instead of finding a way to invest in them caring about characters they've never seen before when extras are so routinely abused on the show was done ALL for the shock factor of this one scene. Give me a break. Dorne has been such a collosal disaster though. So so disappointed I don't think anyone can find that section interesting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drogon's Personal Trainer Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 I am admittedly in disbelief about how bad Dorne has been so far. They need to focus the rest of the Dornish scenes on Alexander Siddig and Indira Varma. I am hoping that they do the "Princess in the Tower" chapter with Ellaria Sanda rather than Arianne Martell. At least give me that.Dorne is so bad that it's making Season 2 Qarth look like Shakespeare! I am a reader who loathed everything Iron Born in Feast and Dance, and yet I find myself wishing they'd gone with that storyline rather than Dorne. And there's only 4 episodes left to rescue this debacle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hear Katy Roar Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 look i get that there is a way to spin this as empowering for sansa but actions speak louder than rosy speculation or optimistic conjecture. I am horrified. Sansa was every nice guy's dream, a damsel who has been subjugated. Perhaps this yields some kind of power over Ramsey on a go-forward basis and I HOPE IT DOES but in a vacuum this is deplorable. I mean shocking, totally shocking, disgusting and shocking. They need to rescue this story line in a big way or else - not for nothing - the actress will be remembered for this scene forever, and maybe that's my own narrow perspective taking, but I just am heartbroken they subjected her to this. it makes my skin crawl. women should never be treated this way. MEN should never be treated this way. You know what else makes me feel like a creep? That i feel like UNBRIDLED VIOLENCE is the only way to make this right. and that's no solution, either. ugh. perfectly controversial. but controversy for the sake of controversy makes my blood boil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wee-Bey Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 Then they can stick to the book part of the forum. The books haven't changed. Brienne, Jamie, and Sansa's storylines from the last 2 books would have made pointless television. And they had to combine characters to not make the show go too slow with all of the additions from the books. I have yet to see somebody show me a better version of what the show could have done with 10 episodes based on all of that content. Because they couldn't do better. Please explain to me how Brienne, Jamie, and Sansa's stories are any more relevant in the show? The Dorne storyline is embarrassing, Brienne's been repeating the same lines and chasing the same trail for three seasons, and Sansa is now on object of rape whereas in the book's she'd finally found a safe haven. I'm supposed to be entertained by sexual abuse? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The One And Only Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 I see they actually did it. A friend of mine stopped watching after the Red Wedding and I will now do the same. They have always treated rape extremely casually and at this point it's just sexploitation. Worse than that, sexploitation by rape. Seriously, which female character has not been raped at this point?The show will get a shitstorm for this and the moment it calms they are humiliating a nude Cersei in "bitch finally got what she deserved" -style. I'd be surprised if this doesn't affect their ratings.But in all honesty, I'll still watch Drogon's return on youtube. That is laughable. The show introduced rape in the very first episode. The book has introduced rape on multiple occasions (Dany, Ramsey's Mom,Jayne). It is part of what the show is, for better or worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1234567 Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 Exactly. The changes in the Sansa plot arc are necessary because the actress does not want to spend a season eating lemon cakes.LOL: let's reduce the entire Vale plot line to eating lemon cakes shall we. You know the Vale could have worked well. It does involve plotting etc and they could have added extra plots there with Lyn Corbay or the Mad Mouse or brought forward what is happening in the TWOW. Instead they choose to have a main character whose entire characterisation has been reduced to being a victim, who is now brutally raped, which will no doubt be the catalyst for her to get revenge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wee-Bey Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 A nobleman that wants to be the lord of winterfell... Winterfell has an heir. It isn't Sansa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lancerman Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 It's not the rape that is the problem, it's that it happens to a STARK. Lord eddards daughter is not for Ramsay Snow and he never should have been allowed near her on the show. So basically it's okay that the character we don't really care about got treated far more horrifically in the book to the point where I wouldn't even call what happened to Sansa on the same stratosphere, but because the character that a far less egregious action happened to was a character we actually have been following it's worse? In the books it happened to a girl they were trying to pass off as a Stark, now it's actually a Stark. And because of it they did a lot less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TyrionsFlagon Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 How sure are you that it will be Theon or Sansa that kills Ramsay? It would make for good TV, IMO. I'm going 90% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Mormont Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 I have yet to see somebody show me a better version of what the show could have done with 10 episodes based on all of that content. Because they couldn't do better. This is such a stupid thing to say. You said it in the last episode's thread. How many other versions have you seen? Oh, whats that? No other versions? Because there are not any other versions? Right, stfu with your idiotic nonsense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfie Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 This. And This. Actually, Sansa's arc in this season is very similar to Dany's in the first season. - Last daughter of a ruined house. - On the run from the current regime. - Sold by an ambitious so-and-so for political gain. - Honeymoon: Hard to find a strong enough word. I always thought Sansa and Dany had very similar storylines, now this year it seems more apparent. The difference is Sansa was never really given the power to really rule like Dany has and in the SoIaF she's only 2 years younger than Danny. Though with Danny they really used her sexuality for her favor after her rape scene, I don't think they'll give Sansa that. Sansa does have a loyalty from the North that has been established over 8,000 years as opposed to Dany who's iffy dynasty of only 300 years and mostly held through fear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaimereborn Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 Then they can stick to the book part of the forum. The books haven't changed. Brienne, Jamie, and Sansa's storylines from the last 2 books would have made pointless television. And they had to combine characters to not make the show go too slow with all of the additions from the books. I have yet to see somebody show me a better version of what the show could have done with 10 episodes based on all of that content. Because they couldn't do better. I think people can make their own choices about which parts of the forum they'll use. And yes I'm sure noone in the entire world could have done a better job than D&D....... :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barristan Whitebeard Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 I see they actually did it. A friend of mine stopped watching after the Red Wedding and I will now do the same. They have always treated rape extremely casually and at this point it's just sexploitation. Worse than that, sexploitation by rape. Seriously, which female character has not been raped at this point?The show will get a shitstorm for this and the moment it calms they are humiliating a nude Cersei in "bitch finally got what she deserved" -style. I'd be surprised if this doesn't affect their ratings.But in all honesty, I'll still watch Drogon's return on youtube. Then, I guess that you will be quiting the books too, right? They're full of casual rape and the "humiliating a nude Cersei in bitch finally got what she deserved" -style comes from Mr. Martin's book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nationalanthem91 Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 FROM EW.COMMy first question to Cogman was what would he say to fans who ask: “How could you do this to Sansa?” Cogman seemed to take this question very seriously and took a moment to consider his response. “This is Game of Thrones,” he said soberly. “This isn’t a timid little girl walking into a wedding night with Joffrey. This is a hardened woman making a choice and she sees this as the way to get back her homeland. Sansa has a wedding night in the sense she never thought she would with one of the monsters of the show. It’s pretty intense and awful and the character will have to deal with it.”I read that and was rather upset...but it's whatever. What's done is done. EW also posted an interview that Sophie Turner did this weekend regarding episode 6, and basically, it just says how she "loved" the horrific scene and that the rest of the season is Sansa trying to figure out Ramsay's intentions and her trying to please him. Not sure what that exactly means, but it sounds like from her interview that she'll be staying in WF for at least the remainder of S5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaimereborn Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 Then, I guess that you will be quiting the books too, right? They're full of casual rape and the "humiliating a nude Cersei in bitch finally got what she deserved" -style comes from Mr. Martin's book. Actually seeing of it from Cersei's POV in the book deliberately made you question whether anyone deserves that sort of treatment and finally made the character seem human Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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