Dragon Steel

[RumHam]

Well there is one other Valyrian steel sword in the far north (Darksister).

We do not know this. It would be really strange for Aegon V to return Dark Sister to Bloodraven when he allowed him to join the Watch rather than be executed.

The Long Night predates the Valyrians so its safe to assume the dragonlords werent the first to craft valyrian steel but infact taught?

Valyrian Steel is the name for high quality magical steel forged in dragonflame and woven with spells by the Valyrians. I suspect it's the dragonflame aspect that makes Valyrian Steel a type of Dragonsteel. But not the only type. It's possible one of the eastern civilizations was using dragon flame to forge swords long before the Valyrians.

The Great empire of Dawn had the first dragonlords in the World.

Again, we do not know this. In fact according to the intro to the Dunk & Egg books the Valyrians were the only race to tame and ride dragons. I don't think you'd need to tame a dragon to make use of it's flames in a forge, chaining the dragon up could work. But you wouldn't call someone who captured a dragon but couldn't ride it a dragonlord.

[GHOSTSTARK]

Haven't people in the books discussed the possibility that the valyrian steel swords are able to kill the White Walkers?

In AFFC&ADWD Jon and Sam talk about Dragonglass and VS but aren't sure if theyre the same. Sam knows dragonglass can kill a White but no one has tested VS against a White

[Lady Blizzardborn]

I'm still hoping that VS and Dragonsteel are different and the show just put them together for the sake of simplicity.

I have no problem with the humans having three options for fighting the Others. They need all they can get. There's only so much VS in the world; they may not be able to get enough obsidian from Dragonstone, or get it in time. So unless the CotF have a magic obsidian well and have been holding out on everybody...which in this series is entirely possible.

[Lady Blizzardborn]

We do not know this. It would be really strange for Aegon V to return Dark Sister to Bloodraven when he allowed him to join the Watch rather than be executed.

<snip

That's funny. The last known holder of Dark Sister happens to BE Bloodraven. Members of the Watch need good swords too. And don't forget that Aegon knew about the prophecy of TDtwP and may well have understood that BR was heading into dangerous territory and needed all the help he can get.

[Lady Blizzardborn]

The Long Night predates the Valyrians so its safe to assume the dragonlords werent the first to craft valyrian steel but infact taught?

There's a great deal of speculation that Azor Ahai Original figured out the process, which I find interesting given that LB does not sound like VS really. But...the process could be similar. In fact, with their AAR prophecy, the people in Asshai (and by extension other nearby cultures) might have created VS while trying to find the recipe for LB.

[RumHam]

That's funny. The last known holder of Dark Sister happens to BE Bloodraven.

I know that, and don't really get why this is funny.

Members of the Watch need good swords too.

I'd say they need them more than anyone. But it's not common for someone to take their family's ancestral sword with them when joining the Watch. Especially joining the Watch as a criminal. I think it's very likely Bloodraven lost the sword when he was thrown in the Black Cells. I really can't see Aegon giving it back to him. But hey if Martin needs it to be there for Bran & co then anything's possible.

And don't forget that Aegon knew about the prophecy of TDtwP and may well have understood that BR was heading into dangerous territory and needed all the help he can get.

I actually must have forgotten this. I certainly think it's likely he knew the story about The Prince who was Promised, but I don't remember getting that confirmed anywhere. Anyway unless I'm wrong we don't even know what that story is. It could be incredibly vague and not indicate that the threat comes from the far north.

[Ghosts Lunch]

Posted this is a DS = VS? thread but it's relevant to this conversation

Could be there is a certain magic spell which I'll call magic spell X, could be that Dragonglass has Magic Spell X which kills White Walkers, but Valyrian Steel swords have Magic Spells X, Y, Z (eg anti Other, permanently edged blade and perfectly light to wield).

Valyrians weren't as glorious as the Dawn Empire and so presumably not as knowledgeable, so even if they learned some of the "old" magics maybe not all of them, so perhaps Dragonsteel has Magic Spells X, Y, Z but also W - eg maybe Spell W is where it is like what Thoros is imitating in that they are permanently on Fire or can alight upon magical command as well so they can cleanly cut through both Wights and White Walkers with ease.

There is something about Oathkeeper derived from Ice which is black, so it could have Magic Spell V in it as well causing this effect, eg Spell V allows it to kill Upper caste members or Ice Spiders or something? Given it came from a blade called Ice though and it has gone to Brienne who failed to protect Renly is tied to Jaimie who killed a Targ Dragon King, I actually reckon the black colouring and Spell V probably really relates to a layer that may be able to cleave through Shadow babies...

Then there's Dawn which is a category into itself, which could have Magic spell X along with Y, Z in it along with some other funky stuff coming from Magic Spell A, B, C etc which is otherwise unheard of, this probably heralds from the Empire of the Dawn, and can probably counter R'hlorr Dragon magics as much as Others magic,

So all in all I still think there's a chance that in the books at least there's a possibility the weapons are tiered and that Dragonglass, and Valyrian Steel + Dragon Steel despite being very similar may be cousin blades and not fully interchangeable

I reckon the show though is just streamlining everything and making it a simple VS kills White Walkers,

I will be fascinated to know about the Others blades, and whether they are tiered, they obviously shatter Regular weapons for a start but it would be interesting to understand more,

[Khal Porno]

I didn't realize this was a "theory," and people were speculating; I thought it was obvious from reading the book.