Angry Got Fan AMA with GRRM.

[Werthead]

 

• GRRM is "not perfectly happy" with the TV show.

​me too!!!!!!!!

 

 

He goes on to say that it's due to budgetary and time constraints. He's not suddenly wailing on D&D.

 

Is sothoryos the ASOIAF version of Australia? Everything that can kill you lives at Australia

 

Sothoryos is the ASoIaF version of Africa. There isn't an Australia analogue, but in terms of general direction it'd be Ulthos.

 

He was in need of the money?

 

Very much not. GRRM was pretty financially secure long before HBO came after the rights. He already had two houses (both paid off, I believe) and was doing very well from the books alone.

[Mother of Dragons]

Let's not turn this into a book/show discussion but

That's not really fair now is it?

"Let me quote you, but don't respond, ok? I'm going to have the last word because we shouldn't discuss this"
 

 

HBO doesn't feed GRRM. His books do. He's been writing books for 30 years: that's what has made him famous and rich.
 
It's HBO the one who is profiting from his work.

Even more reason not to sell your rights until you're done, then. I didn't say he got rich off anything, books or show, I suggested selling when you finish the story if his stance is that he doesn't want the show to deviate from his book. IF that's the case, and GRRM is unhappy with the show for that reason. Or, don't sell your story rights, because, when you do, you are selling the right to create fan fiction of your work. As Drekinn said, we don't know what he said, or the context. We're going off a random person's Twitter feed.

Maybe someone else at the event will show up and post something.

[JonCon's Red Beard]

Even more reason not to sell your rights until you're done, then. I didn't say he got rich off anything, books or show, I suggested selling when you finish the story if his stance is that he doesn't want the show to deviate from his book. IF that's the case, and GRRM is unhappy with the show for that reason. Or, don't sell your story rights, because, when you do, you are selling the right to create fan fiction of your work. As Drekinn said, we don't know what he said, or the context. We're going off a random person's Twitter feed.

Maybe someone else at the event will show up and post something.

 

Even if GRRM had been done with the books, HBO could have changed the whole thing at their will. Look at the Hobbit.

[Lord Ravenstark]

Does he said anything about the IT remaining intact? It can last until the end with the Crownlands, West, Stormlands and Reach, maybe the Vale. The IT would exist, just full Westeros.

[Crannog-Mage]

Do we know this Angry GoT fan is legit?  With that type of name and how he's reporting GRRM feels about the show kinda makes me wonder.  

 

Also, has anyone else mentioned anything about this "event"? He just starts his tweets with --Just spent 2 hrs with GRRM, AMA!--

[LmL]

Personally, I think these supposed "SSM's" are more over-interpreted than the text. At least the text is a work of art, which is supposed to be considered thoughtfully. These SSM's aren't even reliable or verifiable half the time, and they are almost ALWAYS misinterpreted. 

Is there any verification of this supposed conversation? Also, this all seems like summaries of George's answers, which hold about as much weight as Wun Wun's opinion on Dornish wine. 

[Lord Varys]

George has said multiple times that more people will sit on the Iron Throne before the end of the series, and that he knows who'll sit on the throne in the end. But that doesn't mean it won't be destroyed. The correct answer to 'Who'll sit at the Iron Throne in the end?' could be: 'No one'. And George might already be knowing that. However, I find that a very unlikely scenario. 

[JonCon's Red Beard]

AngryGoTFan is real.

 

GRRM was in a con called Bubonicon (lol) and AGT has pictures with him, also a video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=l771t4XNWZk&app=desktop

[Colton Casados-Medve]

Rampant show hate from book fans is something that is really bothersome. The show and the books both exist for a good reason. You do not have to accept the books as show canon or the show as book canon if you don't want to. 

 

I likely would have started reading ASOIAF somewhere down the road in life, but the show made me research them sooner, so that I can actually be a part of the dialogue (theories, interviews while two books still have to be released, etc) instead of coming to the series when its all said and finished. 

 

D&D had a monumental task. The character list of ASOIAF is so immense that no TV show could realistically do it without committing to something like 20 seasons, and with the cost of producing such a high-quality show from HBO, that is just not going to happen. If you're going to make a sitcom out of it and go Big Bang Theory or That 70's Show status with the budget, or make it another Syfy Original Series then sure, maybe it would have been possible to include everything. 

 

There is a reason the first four seasons seem so much better than the fifth. A Game of Thrones, a Clash of Kings, and A Storm of Swords (the material of which comprises most of the major events of the first four seasons of the show) had tighter writing, a more paced plot, and a cast of characters that, while interesting, aren't necessarily important to give major screen time to (I'm talking about the huge host of bannermen on all sides of the War of the Five Kings). This allowed them to adapt the novel fairly truly, in my opinion. 

 

A Feast for Crows and A Dance with Dragons hugely expanded the number of geographically independent characters and their plot-arcs. There are more Greyjoys, there is Aegon and his motley crew, there is a host of events going on in Dorne. 

 

While I wish Season 5 of the show could have been more faithful, there was no way they could include the Iron Islander plots, the Dornish plots, the Meereneese plots, the Wildling plots (like Val and such), while still giving major screen time to all of the major characters that were still around from Season 1 (Jon, Cersei, Jaime, Tyrion, Danaerys, Stannis, etc). Even with just those few names that I listed, you could give them each their own episode in the season, a full hour, and that would leave you with only five more episodes to include all of the stuff from the books that was cut. Its impossible. 

 

So they merged where they could. Sansa took fArya's role because it was likely the plot in the Eyrie would take too long to unfold or not matter much in the grand end-scheme of the books/show. 

 

People forget that GRRM told them the fates of the major characters in his books. Granted this does not mean that GRRM won't change his mind regarding those characters, but it at least means that the show writers are not completely directionless in their writing. They have end-games in mind and they have to write a truncated version of the story to get the major characters to that point. 

 

You can like the books better than the show, or the show better than the books, but to judge the show based on how they adapt the books and say they are purposely not doing it justice or are just incompetent is taking it a bit far. Every season of the show (even season five) has received strongly favorable reviews. As a piece of television its a masterpiece. 

 

The reason season five hurts us so much is because we have all these complicated plots going on regarding those characters that to see them befall an alternate fate in the adaptation might hurt us on some emotional level. But that does not change the fact that the show is doing what it has to do to keep going and see the series through to its completion. 

 

And GRRM has also remarked several times at how surprised he was at what the show is able to do. Is he a little upset that they have to take things a different way to do the constrictions of the television format? Yes of course, he is probably more attached to his characters than all of us. But he's worked in television, and he understands. The fan hate is far more extreme and baseless than GRRM expressing the aspects he doesn't like about the adaptation.

 

./rant off

[Jasta11]

I dunno what's the whole "sad puppies" thing (nor I want to know) but if you think GRRM is bashing the show... well... you haven't see him actually bashing something :dunno:

 

For sure. I still remember that time when he literally bashed a fan's guitar because they were singing a bad song about how he should release the books faster. The man is not known for being coy when he has a strong opinion.

 

That being said, I do think he applies some restraint towards HBO, out of professionalism if nothing else (and because, while he is financially independant, the GoT money must still be nice). But I don't think he hates the show as much as some people do, albeit he almost certainly dislikes several stories either due to time/budget cuts or just because they're bad. We're not in his head however.

[kissdbyfire]

 

For sure. I still remember that time when he literally bashed a fan's guitar because they were singing a bad song about how he should release the books faster. The man is not known for being coy when he has a strong opinion.

 

That being said, I do think he applies some restraint towards HBO, out of professionalism if nothing else (and because, while he is financially independant, the GoT money must still be nice). But I don't think he hates the show as much as some people do, albeit he almost certainly dislikes several stories either due to time/budget cuts or just because they're bad. We're not in his head however.

 

Martin has a great sense of humour, that's what the guitar-bashing was all about! 

[Colton Casados-Medve]

 

For sure. I still remember that time when he literally bashed a fan's guitar because they were singing a bad song about how he should release the books faster. The man is not known for being coy when he has a strong opinion.

 

That being said, I do think he applies some restraint towards HBO, out of professionalism if nothing else (and because, while he is financially independant, the GoT money must still be nice). But I don't think he hates the show as much as some people do, albeit he almost certainly dislikes several stories either due to time/budget cuts or just because they're bad. We're not in his head however.

 

I'm pretty sure the guitar bashing as done in good fun. 

http://www.blastr.com/2013-7-19/watch-grrm-smash-guitar-those-guys-who-sang-he-should-write-faster

[JonCon's Red Beard]

This is why I meant by discussing the show.

 

GRRM is not pleased with it. That's a fact. He cannot say "I hate this idiots", and he tries to be as kind as he can ("they do the best they can") but it's obvious S5 has him very displeased.

 

For once, there are a lot of articles saying "the show is better now that it has grown apart from the books" or "this is better than the books". That's is pretty much insulting Martin on his face by people who hasn't even bothered to read such books.

 

Creating a character takes time, even love. He loves his characters and D&D are simply using their names to violent them. I think he has every reason in the world to be pissed.

 

Now, let's move on.

[Colton Casados-Medve]

This is why I meant by discussing the show.

 

GRRM is not pleased with it. That's a fact. He cannot say "I hate this idiots", and he tries to be as kind as he can ("they do the best they can") but it's obvious S5 has him very displeased.

 

For once, there are a lot of articles saying "the show is better now that it has grown apart from the books" or "this is better than the books". That's is pretty much insulting Martin on his face by people who hasn't even bothered to read such books.

 

Creating a character takes time, even love. He loves his characters and D&D are simply using their names to violent them. I think he has every reason in the world to be pissed.

 

Now, let's move on.

 

That's a huge leap of logic. 

 

"Because he doesn't say how displeased he is, its proof of how displeased he is!" 

 

I'll wait until the show is done and over for Martin to write his opinion on how it turned out. We can't really know how pleased he is with it until he says so himself. A remark about being displeased with some of the changes in S5 is in no way his overall opinion of the show's direction. 

 

Martin knew, and even told us, from the very beginning that the show and the books would have differences and that they would be separate universes. 

[JonCon's Red Beard]

 

That's a huge leap of logic. 

 

"Because he doesn't say how displeased he is, its proof of how displeased he is!"

 

 

Well, he has just said it. :)

[JonCon's Red Beard]

And btw, I also loved that logic behind "GRRM is wrong by not respecting HBO but HBO is fine disrespecting his work because I like the show and it's not that bad, and show = books".

 

Why would Martin -or any of us- respect HBO's version and the people behind it when it's clear they NEVER intended to respect the books and their themes and only wanted it for the violent shocking scenes, specially when Martin himself has said "I am not ok. with people raping characters from my books"? (yes, that quote exists. It's in his not a blog).

 

Ask or go and google any other writer/producers involved in adapting books into tv/movies and they at least pretend they care and want to pay the author and his/her work some respect by reading the books and trying to maintain everything as close to the original source.

 

Or go and read any of Cuaron's interviews. Because, while he is a director that likes to put his own perspective and approach in the books he adapts, he still feels it's his duty to respect the original source.

 

So, can we not talk about "let's not bash HBO!" or "GRRM is a baby!" because HBO is the one who does nothing but bash, insult and disrespect ASOAF, not to say that D&D have proved themselves to have the mentality of toddlers? :dunno:

[Tyrell_like_Squirrel]

Rampant show hate from book fans is something that is really bothersome. The show and the books both exist for a good reason. You do not have to accept the books as show canon or the show as book canon if you don't want to. 

 

I likely would have started reading ASOIAF somewhere down the road in life, but the show made me research them sooner, so that I can actually be a part of the dialogue (theories, interviews while two books still have to be released, etc) instead of coming to the series when its all said and finished. 

 

D&D had a monumental task. The character list of ASOIAF is so immense that no TV show could realistically do it without committing to something like 20 seasons, and with the cost of producing such a high-quality show from HBO, that is just not going to happen. If you're going to make a sitcom out of it and go Big Bang Theory or That 70's Show status with the budget, or make it another Syfy Original Series then sure, maybe it would have been possible to include everything. 

 

There is a reason the first four seasons seem so much better than the fifth. A Game of Thrones, a Clash of Kings, and A Storm of Swords (the material of which comprises most of the major events of the first four seasons of the show) had tighter writing, a more paced plot, and a cast of characters that, while interesting, aren't necessarily important to give major screen time to (I'm talking about the huge host of bannermen on all sides of the War of the Five Kings). This allowed them to adapt the novel fairly truly, in my opinion. 

 

A Feast for Crows and A Dance with Dragons hugely expanded the number of geographically independent characters and their plot-arcs. There are more Greyjoys, there is Aegon and his motley crew, there is a host of events going on in Dorne. 

 

While I wish Season 5 of the show could have been more faithful, there was no way they could include the Iron Islander plots, the Dornish plots, the Meereneese plots, the Wildling plots (like Val and such), while still giving major screen time to all of the major characters that were still around from Season 1 (Jon, Cersei, Jaime, Tyrion, Danaerys, Stannis, etc). Even with just those few names that I listed, you could give them each their own episode in the season, a full hour, and that would leave you with only five more episodes to include all of the stuff from the books that was cut. Its impossible. 

 

So they merged where they could. Sansa took fArya's role because it was likely the plot in the Eyrie would take too long to unfold or not matter much in the grand end-scheme of the books/show. 

 

People forget that GRRM told them the fates of the major characters in his books. Granted this does not mean that GRRM won't change his mind regarding those characters, but it at least means that the show writers are not completely directionless in their writing. They have end-games in mind and they have to write a truncated version of the story to get the major characters to that point. 

 

You can like the books better than the show, or the show better than the books, but to judge the show based on how they adapt the books and say they are purposely not doing it justice or are just incompetent is taking it a bit far. Every season of the show (even season five) has received strongly favorable reviews. As a piece of television its a masterpiece. 

 

The reason season five hurts us so much is because we have all these complicated plots going on regarding those characters that to see them befall an alternate fate in the adaptation might hurt us on some emotional level. But that does not change the fact that the show is doing what it has to do to keep going and see the series through to its completion. 

 

And GRRM has also remarked several times at how surprised he was at what the show is able to do. Is he a little upset that they have to take things a different way to do the constrictions of the television format? Yes of course, he is probably more attached to his characters than all of us. But he's worked in television, and he understands. The fan hate is far more extreme and baseless than GRRM expressing the aspects he doesn't like about the adaptation.

 

./rant off

:agree:  :agree:  :agree:

 

Very well said. I wish more people could be as mature about things as you. Myself included lol