Brad Stark

Daenerys is the daughter of Rhaegar and Ashara Dayne

61 posts in this topic

On 4/26/2016 at 5:31 AM, Orbulas B. Harding said:

the theory that Daeny is half Dayne and half Targ has been something I've strongly believed for a while now.

Either she is Rheagar and Ashara's child (there are a handful of ways this could work)

or she is Arthur and Rhaella's daughter (which makes a lot more sense as far as the Stormborn backstory)

Either way, Martin has made a lot of hints to there being a good deal more intrigue with her childhood than she remembers and dropped a nice handful of hints about her resemblance to members of the Dayne family

I suspect that Aegon, fake or no, might be the stories full-blooded Targ/Blackfire character... either that or Darkstar is the true Viserys... or some other nonesense

While I like the idea of Dany being secretly a Dayne because I am obsessed with House Dayne and I'd love it to come to the forefront, I am very much not sold on Rhaegar + Ashara = Dany because there is too much about it that really just absolutely doesn't fit the story as we know it at all.
Arthur + Rhaella is more plausible, but only slightly. I think it's difficult to argue that Rhaella is not Dany's mother since people witnessed her birth and her identity as the Stormborn is really integral to her character. The narrative also connects Dany with Aerys as her father a lot, so I have a hard time buying that she isn't who she's supposed to be, but for a second I'll put on the tinfoil hat, as it were, and play. If Arthur is really Dany's father, the big questions are 1) how? and 2) why?
For question 1: we know Dany is conceived just before the siege of King's Landing, which would mean Arthur had to be present either right before the siege and leave, or at the siege. We know he's not from Jaime, and we know he's later at the TOJ where he presumably has been pretty much the whole time (since he doesn't fight at the Trident and isn't left with Jaime to defend the Red Keep at that time either). That would make it rather difficult for him to have popped in to impregnate Rhaella. 
For question 2: Why? Ned thinks of Arthur as the embodiment of the honorable Knight, so it seems unlikely Arthur was big into sleeping around with his Queen, unless Ned was just straight wrong about him. If so, how is it that no one ever mentions the idea that Arthur might have slept around OR that Rhaella was sleeping around? All we hear about Rhaella was that she was incredibly dutiful, and sleeping with a member of the Kingsguard doesn't fit into that picture. There's really nothing in the story to give us even the slightest hint that something like this occurred.

So I'm asking genuinely because I'm curious--what is the evidence that people tend to point to who think Dany's parentage isn't what is seems, and specifically that Arthur might have fathered her?

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While this is a nice theory i do prefer Dany as Aerys' daughter. 

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On 6/27/2016 at 8:25 PM, SX. said:

I think George R. R. Martin has already slyly hinted at Daenerys being of Dayne blood since the very beginning. It's also worth noting that the show had her fighting one of the two battles during he episode "Battle of the Bastards."

So I pose this, what if "Daenerys" is a play on words by GRRM.  His way of secretly winking to the audience once they find out the truth of her lineage.  What if his hidden hint was revealed via Daenerys' name, meaning "Dawn Heiress."

That would set the stage for "The Princess That Was Promised" to receive the Valyrian sword "Dawn", which we might also refer to as "Lightbringer." In this case "Lightbringer" being a quite direct reference to dawn, or the time in which it becomes light again

Battle, singular, AKA 1 battle of the bastards. 

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Dany is definitely NOT Jon's twin sister. I also don't believe she is his half sister either.

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I don't think so. Dany is a child of three. So, she might have one mother and two fathers. I think her biological father is Rhaella's lover. In order to hide her cheating, Rhaella left KL for Dragonstone. Second father is Aerys because Dany believes him to be her father. So, Dany is not a descendant of Aerys and Rhealla, and thus she is not PtWP. Aerys cheated on Rhealla, too. Tyrion might be his bastard born by Joanna.

Jon, Dany and Tyrion are all children of three,  all of them being bastards. However, Jon may turn out to be a true Targ.

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Rhaegar is not Dany's father he was in battle by the time she was concieved, in the last month of Robert's Rebelion plus Rhaegar was regarded as an honourable man and it would be weird if he had another woman other than Lyanna and his wife Elia. If Ashara Dayne was pregnant the father could have been Brandon Stark or even Ned since the two liked her a lot. 

 

 

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15 minutes ago, dornishdragon said:

Rhaegar is not Dany's father he was in battle by the time she was concieved, in the last month of Robert's Rebelion plus Rhaegar was regarded as an honourable man and it would be weird if he had another woman other than Lyanna and his wife Elia. If Ashara Dayne was pregnant the father could have been Brandon Stark or even Ned since the two liked her a lot. 

 

 

That Ashara Dayne must have really been something!  Selmy also loved her from afar;)

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For the Dany is daughter of Ashara Dayne theory to work Brandon would be completely off the board since he was killed roughly a year too early to elope with her at a time that matches up with Dany's age.   Ned and Rhaegar are theoretically the top candidates left in play, along with Aerys, but is it possible Selmy himself may be a darkhorse candidate?  Perhaps Ashara committed suicide not after she learned of her brother's death, but after she was forced to give up her child by the Martells to replace Rhaella's trueborn daughter as part of their plan to reclaim the throne from the Baratheons.  It is quite plausible that Rhaella's daughter came stillborn or quickly died from complications related to her birth. She was at a very mature age to have child, was under tremendous emotional duress, endured horrible conditions at Dragonstone, and already had a troubling history with failed pregnancies. That she died during childbirth only stacks the odds further against her newborn child having any realistic chance of survival during this tragedy. The question then becomes how/why Darry or Ashara would be involved in a scheme to cover up a failed childbirth and how Ashara's child could be swapped in without drawing suspicion from the rest of Westeros.  Perhaps Ashara actually feigned her death at Starfall and either hid out in Dorne for a time or escaped to Essos with her child. This child was then either given away via the Martells or another group with vested political interests, to eventually be groomed into current day Young Griff/Aegon, or Dany. Or perhaps Ashara was in on the Baratheon usurpation scheme all along, and left her child in Darry's care under the pretense that Dany would be raised with Viserys in Essos as a legitimized Targaryen and not a bastard.  

I'm inclined to think that if Dany is anyone's child besides Rhaella's, she would be Ashara's.  There is already clear evidence in the text physically linking the two.  Dany reminds Selmy of  a young Ashara.  They share the same distinct eyes as well as other very remarkable features and mannerisms that are imprinted from Selmy's vivid memories of the girl that he had once lusted after.  This seems unusually weighty to be a coincidence born of common Valyrian traits since nothing about Dany's appearance/mannerisms specifically triggers Selmy to see any notable likeness with Rhaella.  The events around Dany's childbirth at Dragonstone, and Rhaella's death and the deaths/disappearances of all the actors involved in said event, leaves such an unreliable framework for what actually happened, that there is still plenty of room for unforeseen twists and turns in Dany's backstory.  GRRM may be holding out for major reveals regarding both Dany and Aegon's backgrounds. House Dayne's significance could ultimately prove much greater than we have been led to believe.

Edited by Eugs

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my pet theory is that dany is child of rhaella and lewyn martell, who has an ancestor named Dany. we also know lewyn has a secret paramour who is a great beauty. and even his brothers know nothing about her. what kind of paramour has to be so secret? the queen. 

 

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GRRM loves bastards. 

now all three dragon riders are bastards. 

dany is a martell bastard by targ. 

tyrion is a targ bastard by lannister. 

jon is a targ bastard by stark. 

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Whoever Daenerys's parents are (I am of the opinion they are Aerys and Rhaella), at least one of them has to be a Targaryen.  Daenerys hatching three dragons out of a pyre is as clear a sign that she is a Targaryen as Jon having a direwolf is that he is a Stark.  That she is a Targaryen is unquestionable.  That means Ashara and any Stark is out.

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On 6/27/2016 at 5:25 PM, SX. said:

I think George R. R. Martin has already slyly hinted at Daenerys being of Dayne blood since the very beginning. It's also worth noting that the show had her fighting one of the two battles during he episode "Battle of the Bastards."

So I pose this, what if "Daenerys" is a play on words by GRRM.  His way of secretly winking to the audience once they find out the truth of her lineage.  What if his hidden hint was revealed via Daenerys' name, meaning "Dawn Heiress."

That would set the stage for "The Princess That Was Promised" to receive the Valyrian sword "Dawn", which we might also refer to as "Lightbringer." In this case "Lightbringer" being a quite direct reference to dawn, or the time in which it becomes light again

 

I dig it. I think of Daenerys as "dreamfire". Aerys=Fire. Daenys was the dreamer.

Or, as Dayne+Aerys= "dawnfire."

 

On 6/30/2016 at 10:30 AM, Rumy Stark said:

While I like the idea of Dany being secretly a Dayne because I am obsessed with House Dayne and I'd love it to come to the forefront

You might dig these threads then.

Arthur+Lyanna

Dawn=Ice

On 6/30/2016 at 10:30 AM, Rumy Stark said:

So I'm asking genuinely because I'm curious--what is the evidence that people tend to point to who think Dany's parentage isn't what is seems, and specifically that Arthur might have fathered her?

Tons of evidence (fDany Theory).

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On 6/27/2016 at 7:25 PM, SX. said:

I think George R. R. Martin has already slyly hinted at Daenerys being of Dayne blood since the very beginning. It's also worth noting that the show had her fighting one of the two battles during he episode "Battle of the Bastards."

So I pose this, what if "Daenerys" is a play on words by GRRM.  His way of secretly winking to the audience once they find out the truth of her lineage.  What if his hidden hint was revealed via Daenerys' name, meaning "Dawn Heiress."

That would set the stage for "The Princess That Was Promised" to receive the Valyrian sword "Dawn", which we might also refer to as "Lightbringer." In this case "Lightbringer" being a quite direct reference to dawn, or the time in which it becomes light again

She did not fight she rode a dragon that did all the work. Dany being anything more than a Targaryan is just wishful thinking. Dawn is not a Valyrian steel sword, it was forged from the ore a Meteroite.

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if r+l=j and assume dany is who she is claimed to be, which is the 'rightful' heir to the trag throne if dany is jon's aunt

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On 2016-08-10 at 10:19 PM, HoodedCrow said:

Dany is  Dayn aerys

Ha Ha!  Good one!  To the OP, there are an awful lot of inconsistencies concerning Dany's birth and whereabouts in a association with her brother.  For one thing she speaks Valerian and he doesn't.  They had all their money stolen by the servants; yet he still has his mother's crown and enough money to travel around as the beggar king.  Would a young boy really travel around the world with an infant in tow?  Lemon trees don't grow in Braavos, there are no trees in Braavos.  They grow in Dorne.  There are gaps and inconsistencies in her childhood memories; something you can expect with very early childhood memories.  Viserys mother died in childbirth; how do we know that child also survived. Summer storms are frequent in the south but not at Dragonstone. Dany and Viserys have only been at Illyrio's manse for 6 months and yet they claim to have been making plans for years.  They are already involved with fAgeon; another child they are presenting as someone else.  There are plenty of gaps and inconsistencies in her narrative to question the 'official' story.  The Dayne bloodline has more importance to the story than has been revealed so far.  The biggest neon sign pointing to the dawn sword itself.

And yes, I think she is lightbringer.  She represents the crone who carries the lantern.  The one who lights the way.  We'll probably find out more about it when she takes her place with the crones at Vaes Dothrak; passes beneath the shadow of the mother of mountains and touches the 'light'.

 

Edited by LynnS

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Nice!! And Dayne + Aerys!

 

this is crazy, I've been talking about this in FB groups for a long time- it's great to see other people see it too!

Edited by Venus414
Added more

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On August 27, 2016 at 9:49 AM, LynnS said:

Ha Ha!  Good one!  To the OP, there are an awful lot of inconsistencies concerning Dany's birth and whereabouts in a association with her brother.  For one thing she speaks Valerian and he doesn't.  They had all their money stolen by the servants; yet he still has his mother's crown and enough money to travel around as the beggar king.  Would a young boy really travel around the world with an infant in tow?  Lemon trees don't grow in Braavos, there are no trees in Braavos.  They grow in Dorne.  There are gaps and inconsistencies in her childhood memories; something you can expect with very early childhood memories.  Viserys mother died in childbirth; how do we know that child also survived. Summer storms are frequent in the south but not at Dragonstone. Dany and Viserys have only been at Illyrio's manse for 6 months and yet they claim to have been making plans for years.  They are already involved with fAgeon; another child they are presenting as someone else.  There are plenty of gaps and inconsistencies in her narrative to question the 'official' story.  The Dayne bloodline has more importance to the story than has been revealed so far.  The biggest neon sign pointing to the dawn sword itself.

And yes, I think she is lightbringer.  She represents the crone who carries the lantern.  The one who lights the way.  We'll probably find out more about it when she takes her place with the crones at Vaes Dothrak; passes beneath the shadow of the mother of mountains and touches the 'light'.

 

Viserys mother didn't die birthing her, but I believe she very well could have at dragonstone, replaced by Asharas baby (and Ashara posed as her wet nurse for a time, at least in Braavos signing the pact. Dayne+Aerys.  He got her pregnant a year or two after the tourney- she could have had two.  That old Dayne blood...

the great empire of the dawn?  

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1 hour ago, Venus414 said:

Viserys mother didn't die birthing her, but I believe she very well could have at dragonstone, replaced by Asharas baby (and Ashara posed as her wet nurse for a time, at least in Braavos signing the pact. Dayne+Aerys.  He got her pregnant a year or two after the tourney- she could have had two.  That old Dayne blood...

the great empire of the dawn?  

There's nothing to say that Rhaegar did the deed.  It's just as likely that Aerys did the deed having the power, opportunity and crazy madness nobody can deny.  If indeed, Targaryen blood is a requirement.  But yes the Dayne bloodline goes back at least 10,000 years if we are to believe the tales. It depend on how you want to put the prophecies together and whether or not Rhaegar had it right.  I think it's likely to turn out to be something entirely different that what the reader expects.  It's also not out of the question that Aerys is also Jon's father.  The old mad king skywalker connection.

We don't really know what happened to Lyanna.  All we have is the official story and a lot of gaps. We know Rickard was travelling to Riverrun for Brandon's wedding.  We know Brandon went on an errand of some kind just prior to the wedding.  Next thing he's off to KL demanding that Rhaegar come out and face him.  Then Rickard and party show up at KL.  Was Lyanna travelling with them to the wedding?  Did Rhaegar really kidnap her or is this propaganda?  The only witness seems to be Ethan Glover who perished at the ToJ.

Edited by LynnS

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