True.Kitn902 Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 I understand this isn't something Ned would ever do but what if he walked in the throne room after Jamie murdered Aerys demanded he remove himself from his THRONE, sat and called himself King Eddard Stark first of his name. 1) what is SER Jamie's initial response to such a bold statement? 2) what does Robert and Jon Arryn think or do about this Ned is like family, obviously Hoster is with Ned on this one lol. 3) IF and I mean IF Robert bends the knee to Ned and Jon follows what does the rest of Westeros supreme nobility do? Are they pretty much forced to let a wolf sit the throne? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Ned Stark Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 I actually think that was the he one thing Cersei was right about, that Ned should have claimed the throne, though I understand why he didn't. I doubt anyone is going to really challenge him, even Robert. Ned would have kept a peaceful kingdom for a longtime. Arrest Tywin for war crimes, dismiss the small council and Jaime. Create a truly efficient small council that rules for the realm and not themselves; Stannis, Jon Arryn, Hoster or Brynden Tully, throw in a couple of his most trusted northern lords. No LF, Spider, or Lannisters; no appointees like Blount, Trant, Slynt, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rippounet Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 Ned would have kept a peaceful kingdom for a longtime. I'm not so sure. Of all the Lords Paramount, Ned was possibly the one with the weakest claim. And he proved himself to be terrible at political games. Robert may have been a bad king, but he was decent at keeping the kingdom united and peaceful (Balon hardly counts), and his small council did the job. Also, with Ned as king,Tywin becomes a major problem from the start. Try him for war crimes? This pretty much means having another major war with the Lannisters right away, when the rebels' forces have already suffered badly. Pacifying the Dornish becomes way more difficult. Even the IB rebellion becomes dangerous. No way this works. Robert had the huge advantage of being unmarried when he took the throne. His marriage with Cersei may have been unhappy, but it kept the peace for decades and held the kingdom together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wolves Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 I actually think that was the he one thing Cersei was right about, that Ned should have claimed the throne, though I understand why he didn't. I doubt anyone is going to really challenge him, even Robert. Ned would have kept a peaceful kingdom for a longtime. Arrest Tywin for war crimes, dismiss the small council and Jaime. Create a truly efficient small council that rules for the realm and not themselves; Stannis, Jon Arryn, Hoster or Brynden Tully, throw in a couple of his most trusted northern lords. No LF, Spider, or Lannisters; no appointees like Blount, Trant, Slynt, etc. I'm glad Ned didn't that's the most appealing thing about Ned and the Starks is that they have no desire for that ugly chair. And I don't get the appeal of it it's ugly it attracts so every ugly, greedy, corrupt monsters and you and your family are targets. Ned would have ruined the Starks if he sat on that cursed things, again I'm glad he didn't the smartest decision Ned ever made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
True.Kitn902 Posted September 9, 2015 Author Share Posted September 9, 2015 I'm not so sure. Of all the Lords Paramount, Ned was possibly the one with the weakest claim. And he proved himself to be terrible at political games. Robert may have been a bad king, but he was decent at keeping the kingdom united and peaceful (Balon hardly counts), and his small council did the job. Also, with Ned as king,Tywin becomes a major problem from the start. Try him for war crimes? This pretty much means having another major war with the Lannisters right away, when the rebels' forces have already suffered badly. Pacifying the Dornish becomes way more difficult. Even the IB rebellion becomes dangerous. No way this works. Robert had the huge advantage of being unmarried when he took the throne. His marriage with Cersei may have been unhappy, but it kept the peace for decades and held the kingdom together. Ned's claim was weak but no one would have said shit with the North, Storm lands, Vale, River lands alliance also Dorne would have been easier to pacify under Ned since Ned Stark had done them no harm. Ned Stark had 5 children with Cat each child is another mariage to a powerful family after Rick on a betrothal you could hold all the great lords in your family circle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rippounet Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 Ned's claim was weak but no one would have said shit with the North, Storm lands, Vale, River lands alliance also Dorne would have been easier to pacify under Ned since Ned Stark had done them no harm. Ned Stark had 5 children with Cat each child is another mariage to a powerful family after Rick on a betrothal you could hold all the great lords in your family circle. Good point about Ned's children. Still don't think the Lannisters would have let Tywin be tried though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lion of the West Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 1. I believe that Jaime would have laughed at it and don't given a much thought to it. 2. Robert will be furious and Jon Arryn try to reason with Eddard. They had already crowned Robert by this point so I don't expect that anyone would think that Eddard would do something like this at this point. I a however sure it would be a permanent rift between Robert and Eddard. In regards to Hoster he would be torn between Winterfell and the Eyrie, so no way to know which way he'll swing. 3. For a time the Wolf can keep the throne but given Ned's foray into the political scene at King's Landing, odds are that he would be assassinated or disposed fairly quickly. Eddard do not have the skills and mindset for political intrigues. Or very likely a rebelion against King Stark will follow which could well topple him as Eddard would seem to be a man who does not shy away from making enemies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Ned Stark Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 Ned's claim was weak but no one would have said shit with the North, Storm lands, Vale, River lands alliance also Dorne would have been easier to pacify under Ned since Ned Stark had done them no harm. Ned Stark had 5 children with Cat each child is another mariage to a powerful family after Rick on a betrothal you could hold all the great lords in your family circle. This. Also, and I could be completely wrong about this as I am not a politician, but real world, present day politics do not relate in an apples to apples fashion. It is more of the Game of Thrones, which IMHO, can only grow and fester to the degree as the King, and those he has empowered around him allow it to. If the Lannisters risk war for him arresting Tywin, then it's the westerlands against the realm. Which, in the long run, taking the current Lannnisters out of power would have been good for the realm King - Ned Queen - Catelyn - together they have plenty of true born heirs. Hand - Jon Arryn Master of Laws - Bronze Yohn Master of Ships - Jason Mallister Master of Whispers - Manderly Master of Coin - Stannis Master-at-arms - Rodrik Cassel? Commander of Watch - Jory or Robett Glover Kingsguard- Commander Brynden Tully Barristan Robar Royce Helman Tallhart Adam Marbrand Harlan Tyrell Smalljon Umber Lord of Winterfell - Benjen Couldn't a group like that keep the scheming to a minimal and rule for the better of the realm? Sure the Lannisters are neglected, but betrothing Robb to Arrianne and Sansa to Willas you shore up everyone but the Lannnisters, but Jaime is want to the wall and Tywinis executed ( maybe sent to the wall, but that might be dangerous). Jon can be revealed as a Targ and given Dragonstone, the watch is stronger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~DarkHorse~ Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 Cersei is speaking nonsense. The only argument for Ned claiming the Throne, is that he got to it first. That is it. Robert was the obvious choice. He slayed Prince Rhaegar, won all the battles and was the star of the rebellion. As the Baratheon heir, he also had the closest blood ties to House Targaryen, so he could argue some form of legitimacy to his claim. The North supports House Stark, but King's Landing is not the North. Ned would have had trouble getting the southern Houses on board with the legitimacy of his rule. He has no Targ blood and does not have Robert's fame. Why should anyone bow before him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~DarkHorse~ Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 This. Also, and I could be completely wrong about this as I am not a politician, but real world, present day politics do not relate in an apples to apples fashion. It is more of the Game of Thrones, which IMHO, can only grow and fester to the degree as the King, and those he has empowered around him allow it to. If the Lannisters risk war for him arresting Tywin, then it's the westerlands against the realm. Which, in the long run, taking the current Lannnisters out of power would have been good for the realm King - Ned Queen - Catelyn - together they have plenty of true born heirs. Hand - Jon Arryn Master of Laws - Bronze Yohn Master of Ships - Jason Mallister Master of Whispers - Manderly Master of Coin - Stannis Master-at-arms - Rodrik Cassel? Commander of Watch - Jory or Robett Glover Kingsguard- Commander Brynden Tully Barristan Robar Royce Helman Tallhart Adam Marbrand Harlan Tyrell Smalljon Umber Lord of Winterfell - Benjen Couldn't a group like that keep the scheming to a minimal and rule for the better of the realm? Sure the Lannisters are neglected, but betrothing Robb to Arrianne and Sansa to Willas you shore up everyone but the Lannnisters, but Jaime is want to the wall and Tywinis executed ( maybe sent to the wall, but that might be dangerous). Jon can be revealed as a Targ and given Dragonstone, the watch is stronger. That would have been a massive dick move for Ned to make himself King and Robb his heir, while only giving Jon Dragonstone. Hopefully, Jon would realise just how much he has been wronged and rebel against them. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Ned Stark Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 That would have been a massive dick move for Ned to make himself King and Robb his heir, while only giving Jon Dragonstone. Hopefully, Jon would realise just how much he has been wronged and rebel against them. ;) Well, he obviously wouldn't do that, and I wouldn't want him to as it wouldn't be in tune with his character, which is probably my favorite literary character I've ever read. I just think for the stability of the realm, few could have done better when the throne was apparently up for grabs. Jaime could have claimed it, Tywin, Robert, Arryn, or Ned; I pick Ned. I don't think it's Jon's nature or upbringing to think that he should have the throne. Lord of Dragonstone is better than Bastard of Winterfell, from a status position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
True.Kitn902 Posted September 10, 2015 Author Share Posted September 10, 2015 Jon wouldn't want Westeros only to be made Jon Stark which was all he ever wanted. Robb Stark is heir to the Iron Throne so he would get dragon stone but I'm sure Ned would find some lord ship for Jon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abdallah Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 I understand this isn't something Ned would ever do but what if he walked in the throne room after Jamie murdered Aerys demanded he remove himself from his THRONE, sat and called himself King Eddard Stark first of his name. 1) what is SER Jamie's initial response to such a bold statement? 2) what does Robert and Jon Arryn think or do about this Ned is like family, obviously Hoster is with Ned on this one lol. 3) IF and I mean IF Robert bends the knee to Ned and Jon follows what does the rest of Westeros supreme nobility do? Are they pretty much forced to let a wolf sit the throne? Ned has no Targaryen blood, unless Jon is part Targaryen I actually think that was the he one thing Cersei was right about, that Ned should have claimed the throne, though I understand why he didn't. I doubt anyone is going to really challenge him, even Robert. Ned would have kept a peaceful kingdom for a longtime. Arrest Tywin for war crimes, dismiss the small council and Jaime. Create a truly efficient small council that rules for the realm and not themselves; Stannis, Jon Arryn, Hoster or Brynden Tully, throw in a couple of his most trusted northern lords. No LF, Spider, or Lannisters; no appointees like Blount, Trant, Slynt, etc. Killing Tywin and forcing Jaime to take the black would turn the Lannisters into his enemies. The Westerlands would have revolted, and they have a very large army. Sure Tywin and Jaime might be gone, but Cersei and Tyrion would marry powerful lords. Eventually a lannister always pays his debts. Heck the Iron born would have them as an ally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Good Guy Garlan Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 I guess Robert would've been pissed, but he had bigger fish to fry, like rescuing Lyanna and lifting the siege of Storm's End (since I assume Ned would have to stay in KL and deal with Tywin and the immediate aftermath of the Sack) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bellatrix Stark Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Lord of Winterfell - Benjen Benjen would not have inherited Winterfell, Bran would have. I think Benjen would have probably still joined the Night's Watch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thelittledragonthatcould Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 1) what is SER Jamie's initial response to such a bold statement? Nothing. It matters not what Ned does, it is more the reaction of Tywin, Robert and Jon that matters. He will fall in line with his father. 2) what does Robert and Jon Arryn think or do about this Ned is like family, obviously Hoster is with Ned on this one lol. Jon would probably advise them against it. An Old God worshipping Northerner is going to be a harder sell than Robert the Andal with Targ blood. I'm not sure about Robert. He loves Ned but he is an egomaniac and believes he won the war. There would definitely be some resentment, possibly delayed, but it will come eventually. Tywin will bide his time. He may choose to try marrying Cersei and Jaime(who would definitely be out of the Kingsguard) to the Tyrells and Hightowers rather than Robert. He may even get remarried himself. 3) IF and I mean IF Robert bends the knee to Ned and Jon follows what does the rest of Westeros supreme nobility do? Are they pretty much forced to let a wolf sit the throne? Initially yes. The Westerlands had already made their move. Jon thought a marriage was needed to keep them loyal so I predict that the Greyjoy Rebellion focusing on the Riverlands and North would be more successful with the the Reach and West holding out. Long term it could go either way, depending on what faith his children are and his rule Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syrioforelseesforreal Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Robert taking the throne because of his better claim was obviously talked about and agreed upon by Robert n jon,n Ned. Ned deciding to sit the throne on a whim would be a slight Robert would not abide. Most like he'd challenge Ned to single combat, and win.Probably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maester of Valyria Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Ned Stark had 5 children with Cat each child is another mariage to a powerful family after Rick on a betrothal you could hold all the great lords in your family circle. Ned had no children at this point. He had only just married Cat and concieved Robb. He didn't know about Robb until he returned home to Winterfell, or at the very least until very late in the Rebellion. You can't promise marriage pacts with one unborn child of uncertain gender, and a wife who may not survive labour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
True.Kitn902 Posted September 10, 2015 Author Share Posted September 10, 2015 Ned had no children at this point. He had only just married Cat and concieved Robb. He didn't know about Robb until he returned home to Winterfell, or at the very least until very late in the Rebellion. You can't promise marriage pacts with one unborn child of uncertain gender, and a wife who may not survive labour. Obviously I'm saying with the alliance Ned had with the other great lords after Ned takes the IT Westeros basically has to accept it since no other lords could stand against the might of 4 kingdoms at that moment anyways, So during this time of fragile peace Ned would already produced Robb and Sansa and Promised Robb to either Mace or Doran and Sansa could be married off to a Hightower or some other powerful house. My WHOLE point is yes Westeros isn't going to accept a old god worshiping northerner but with out an army to try and dethrone king stark how would Ned be removed?? Let's be real promise Robb to Mace Margaery is around Robb age it would be perfect also remember Benjen is single and would require a wife as well so this would be an immediate Ally in the making... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frey Pie Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 For the sake of the ill answer but ned would never have claimed the throne It all depends on Robert. Robert wasn't made king until the fall of KL. If Ned claimed the throne then it all falls on Robert. If Robert falls into line then I think Ned has a very good chance. Hoster would obviously back Ned, his grandchildren would be royalty. Jon I think would back Ned whether or not he thought it was a good idea. The strength of this backing is down to what Robert does. If Robert is supportive Jon will be. If not then I think Jon would just be a neutral party. Now as for the Lannisters I imagine Tywin would immediately leave the capital. He can't afford a battle in the streets of KL in uncertain terms. In this case Robert could still marry Cersei, bringing Tywin back into the fold. What's his alternative? Independence? Dorne and the Reach dipped their banners to Jon and Ned already to Robert as king. Why not Ned? One problem I can foresee is that of religion, but Robert was never religious. Neither were many of the Targs. As for this whole Ned being too naive for it...please. Robert was far worse then Ned. His politicking was a disaster. Of he wasn't assassinated in 14 years, neither would Ned. So in short, it's possible. All depends on Robert imho Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.