Dating, race, and you.

[TerraPrime]

This is what I am saying. It seems people on this thread are jumping to the conclusion that because some individuals do not find themselves attracted to members of a certain race that that means they feel those people are inferior to them. While this no doubt happens, we cannot just assume that EVERYONE that isn't attracted to asians or african-americans is a racist. Culture obviously comes into play with how people think, but that doesn't mean these people automatically view others as inferior.

 

Personal racial bias (racism) is not limited to seeing the other race(s) as inferior. For instance, the stereotype that paints Asian people as being good in science and math is a form of racism, but it doesn't paint Asians as inferior. Similiar, the exoticization of women from other ethnic groups is a form of racism, but it also does not paint these women as inferior. 

[Magnar of Skagos]

 

 

Personal racial bias (racism) is not limited to seeing the other race(s) as inferior. For instance, the stereotype that paints Asian people as being good in science and math is a form of racism, but it doesn't paint Asians as inferior. Similiar, the exoticization of women from other ethnic groups is a form of racism, but it also does not paint these women as inferior. 

In your opinion, are all forms of racism, the ones you pointed out above in particular, bad?

[Michael Seswatha Jordan]

There isn't a race out there where I haven't seen a beautiful woman. A blanket statement to me, would seem to be a bit racist. I say this because, as Kara said, you're not keeping an open mind to the possibility. And I wouldn't call it a possibility, rather a certainty.

[Dr. Pepper]

This is what I am saying. It seems people on this thread are jumping to the conclusion that because some individuals do not find themselves attracted to members of a certain race that that means they feel those people are inferior to them. While this no doubt happens, we cannot just assume that EVERYONE that isn't attracted to asians or african-americans is a racist. Culture obviously comes into play with how people think, but that doesn't mean these people automatically view others as inferior.

I don't think you get the point because what I'm saying isn't at all what you are saying.  You are claiming that it's not racist to exclude an entire group of people solely due to race.  That's not anywhere near saying that you maybe don't find yourself generally attracted to dark hair or blue eyes.  

 

As I stated, the language you use to discuss these things will indicate to others whether or not your attractions are based on racism.  Someone who says that they would never be attracted to a specific race of people may not believe they have certain biases, but the words they use certainly contradict that.   

[Eyron]

If someone deems me unfit to date solely because of the hair and skin I was born with, it certainly makes them a lesser person than I expected/hoped, and sometimes racist imo.

[Glaurung]

I think there's a huge difference between "I find myself typically attracted to such-and-such race or ethnicity, but open to consider anyone" than "I won't date black guys" or "I only date white women". I have never been convinced that the latter is not rooted in some latent or overt racism. 

 

These are my feelings on it as well.  To exclude a group solely on their race is racism, but having a strong preference to a group because you are physically attracted to that group more often on average is entirely different. 

 

Not being attracted to a certain race is not racism.

 

It depends on WHY you aren't attracted to that particular race.  I find it difficult to think that one can solely exclude an entire race.  If you aren't racist, there should always be exceptions.  For example, I am typically not attracted to asian women, but I do occasionally find some asian women to be very beautiful, and I even dated an asian woman for a while. 

 

One of the hard things about dating someone from a different race or ethnicity is dealing with the friends and family. Now if you all ready know the family ahead of time and they are OK with you that makes thing a little easier. If you have to go in cold that can be a little touchy and if you have other oppurtunities out there for you that don't entail these difficulties why bother with it? 

 

I think it's easier than you believe.  So long as your friends and family aren't complete shits, it shouldn't be too tough.  Hell, my father in law used to be a black panther. He was deep into the movement and believed in keeping the black race pure, and all of that.  He changed over the years, and he accepted me, a white guy, quickly.  Ultimately he trusted his daughter's judgement more than his own.  We are great friends now.  My father was of the variety of "I am not racist, but I think it is a bad idea for races to intermarry".  When I told him I was falling in love with a black woman, he wasn't sure about it.  I told him I was taking her home to meet my parents and if you don't like it then you don't have to ever talk to me again.  

 

My dad got over it and now he looks forward to seeing my wife more than me when we go back to visit.  And he adores his little granddaughter.  

 

But our fathers were both good people at heart, just a bit misguided and/or ignorant. I don't think most ignorant people are bad people, they just need to be educated or they need more world experience. If your family and friends aren't shit people, then they should accept whoever you choose to love.  And if they don't accept them, then they don't deserve to have you.  You don't need friends/family like that. 

 

Not being sexually attracted to someone of African descent, or Asian descent, or European or Native American, is not racist.

 

 

 

My girlfriend's parents are completely opposed to me due to me having British ancestry. IMO my feelings for my girlfriend out way the negative opinions her family has with me.

 

This I think is important.  Ultimately when you make a choice in somebody who you want to be your partner, it is your decision, not your family's decision.  

[Lily Valley]

 

Yeah, I'm too picky.  That's why I'm 47 and have never been married.

Hang out with me and Yags, you'll become more indiscriminate.

 

 

Personally, rather than excluding people based on race, I'm still vying for that elusive IRL achievement, the Full Benetton. I'm still missing a couple and some nights it vexes me.

Doubling down on your ass Yags.  I'm going for the entire UN member list.  Race you.

 

 

LITA,

 

 I have found in the US that the barriers in place based on cultural disapproval to be very hard to overcome for LTRs.  Locally, within our black community there is disapproval if people date others of  the wrong "shade".   Things like this make me wonder if many people's limits are caused by stuffing cross-cultural attractions in a box labeled, "Not Worth the Hassle."  

 

Dating, sex and relationships are hard enough to manage when things are easy.

 

[sologdin]

"i'm not attracted to persons of race [x]" is by definition 'racist'--to argue otherwise is frivolous, ignoring the meanings of the words. the question becomes whether this is the type of racism that should excite reasonable persons who understand that historical circumstance will place local limitations on aesthetic preferences and that no one is an ubermensch who can escape the chain of historical causality inherent in desire. in most cases, this type of preference is likely to be involuntary, unconscious, and unrelated to herrenvolk doctrine. (cf. the pedestrian statement on the stormfront 'aryan dating' subforum that "I'm attracted only to members of the white race.")

that said, i don't have a limited preference and therefore am eyeing all'y'all askance as unreconstructed segregators.

[Hereward]

In the hopefully unlikely demise of Lady Hereward in a freak encounter with an unauthorised cider press, a malfunctioing stairlift and five tubs of swarfega, I would be wholly racially neutral in my choice of successor. As long as the lady is question was forgiving, physically and morally flexible, knew which fork to use and the dress code at important sporting events. Apart from the Kalmyks, I could never plight my troth with someone who smelled vaguely of horse and could not comment sensibly on the LBW law.

[Seventh Pup]

Basically agree with Terra, and Solo. 

 

For instance one of the things I find attractive is height. I'm 5'3" and I like the idea of being able to stand on my tip toes to kiss my guy. I also like a good set of hands. Big, strong, slightly callused hands.  These things exist in all races. For someone to say that there is no example of anyone in a race that has characteristics they find attractive... it's hard not to see that as racist.

[Eyron]

I can understand that environment in upbringing can play a part, and I too find certain aesthetics attractive more often but not much to do with race. I grew up with family and friends from different races and perhaps I don't care about it because of that. It is perfectly natural to me and I like it. Everyone looking the same would be boring.

[All-for-Joffrey]

I was involved in an interesting conversation earlier about whether or not it's racist to exclude a race from your dating pool.

 

Science says yes, yes it is.

 

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/09/09/no-blacks-is-not-a-sexual-preference-it-s-racism.html?source=TDB&via=FB_Page
 

A new Australian study published in Archives of Sexual Behavior entitled “Is Sexual Racism Really Racism?” suggests that the answer to that question is probably “yes.” Sex researchers Denton Callander, Christy Newman, and Martin Holt asked over 2,000 gay and bisexual Australian men how they felt about race and dating through an online survey. These men also completed a region-specific version of the Quick Discrimination Index (QDI), a standard survey instrument that measures attitudes on race and diversity.

After putting these two data sets together, the trend was clear: “Sexual racism… is closely associated with generic racist attitudes, which challenges the idea of racial attraction as solely a matter of personal preference.”

[Red Tiger]

I was involved in an interesting conversation earlier about whether or not it's racist to exclude a race from your dating pool. Our dating and sexual choices are about a personal as it gets, and yet, human beings still want to be treated with dignity even when it's regarding your choices. I personally think it all depends on how you're communicating your preferences.

Last year, a woman excluded me from consideration because I'm not a skinny white guy. After deliberating on it in the dating thread, I ultimately decided I wasn't being singled out for my race; the lady was simply exercising her freedoms in full. However, had she said something to the effect of: "You're black, I don't date black people.", I may have ended up feeling very differently.

What say y'all, the hive mind?

Like I said in a previous thread, I tend to not date black girls (thought i've dated plenty of 'mulattos' so to speak), im not against it but usually they're just not for me.

 

Im a simple dude, she just needs to look good, not supermodel-good, just fairly attractive.

[TerraPrime]

 

 

In your opinion, are all forms of racism, the ones you pointed out above in particular, bad?

 

 

While all levels of racism are bad, some are worse than others. The type of racism where one sees Asians as better at math and science is down further on the list of things to complain about. 

 

Still, Asian and Black women have particularly suffered the exoticization for their sexual appeals based on their race, and it is actually more than a minor annoyance in many cases. 

 

So, to answer the broader question: Even when the racism is to paint the other group in an appealing light, racism itself is still bad. 

[Gasp of Many Reeds]

There's something of a continuum between racial thinking, racialism and racism IMO. Racial thinking can be a merely nominal classificatory tool which isn't necessarily based on assumptions of biological race, whereas such assumptions of significant biological difference underlie racialism, but racialism does not imply overt prejudice as racism does (though it does require you to be well behind the times when it comes to understandings of human inter-populational and intra-populational variation, so in modern times racialism is usually associated with racism, as it requires a fair degree of ignorance and prejudice to ignore the current science [which moreover has been current since at least the '40s]).

[Eyron]

 

While all levels of racism are bad, some are worse than others. The type of racism where one sees Asians as better at math and science is down further on the list of things to complain about. 

 

Still, Asian and Black women have particularly suffered the exoticization for their sexual appeals based on their race, and it is actually more than a minor annoyance in many cases. 

 

So, to answer the broader question: Even when the racism is to paint the other group in an appealing light, racism itself is still bad. 

I would like to extend this to all groups that are subject to exoticism. Some suffer more than others on a world scale definitely, but to the individual the issue is the same.

It is the feeling of your whole personality and history being reduced to colour/race and following that an expectation on a sexual level and even intelligence. It's an objectification and prejudices based on race and gender. To me and I think you agree, it's not positive in any light, for any women.

[Lily Valley]

I would like to extend this to all groups that are subject to exoticism. Some suffer more than others on a world scale definitely, but to the individual the issue is the same.

It is the feeling of your whole personality and history being reduced to colour/race and following that an expectation on a sexual level and even intelligence. It's an objectification and prejudices based on race and gender. To me and I think you agree, it's not positive in any light, for any women.

Or for men.  I read the stats on Black men and they're appalling, because what I see in hookup culture belies that.  

 

 What I have witnessed among my male black friends is horrible when they date outside their race.  (anecdotal evidence ahead)

 

It looks like being a pretty woman from the outside.  They are immediately treated like a bimbo and not a human.  They get treated like a sex toy or worse, they get treated like someone is doing them a FAVOR.  That's disgusting. That is also BULLSHIT. That is part of the problem of people saying "I don't date ______".  One doesn't date them, one has a one-off and then feels ashamed.  That is bullshit.  

 

 

I'd like to see data of "have you ever?" on this topic.

[Eyron]

That is certainly disgusting, Lily. And I agree, same extends to them.

[Kyoshi]

Interesting topic.

For me (someone raised in a predominantly black community and presently living as a minority among white and coloured people) I've witnessed skin shade as a limiting factor in my own community. Race becomes a factor once I leave my race.

Within my own race, the darker the skin, the more penalised the individual. Whereas outside, in my experience so far, people generally don't date outside their race. However, in the case that someone defies this, it's most likely to be a coloured person: Coloured women are more likely to date white men than black men while coloured men are more likely to date Indian women. This is just what I've observed and I have no reference to cite. But I believe my observation would be different if I were American, Dutch or British; this is where I think culture plays a role. South African culture allows for the observations I've made while the others may not.

[Kyoshi]

Just to add: the point I was trying to make is that even beyond race, there are more ethnic filters people place on viable sexual partners. And as someone who's had more "black experiences" than any other, the black communities I have encountered place high value on skin tone. I believe this to be a result of several things from media influence to colonialism. But again, I have no reference to back this up. Just personal observations.