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JaegrM

Roose's involvement known?

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We know Roose actively helped plan The Red Wedding, and that it was he who actually stabbed Robb in the heart and twisted the blade.
We know people aren't fond of how he rose to his current position.
But I'm curious as to what others in the story think occurred.
Do they think Roose betrayed Robb and had a hand in his death?
or do they think it was more along the lines of Roose jumped ship to save himself and profit before Robb's body was cold?
I've recently lost my books, and it seems like the internet is pretty all over the place when it comes to this subject, so I was hoping someone here would be able to enlighten me and be able to back it up with some sort of textual evidence.

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Well people know Roose was at the wedding, came out unhurt and not captive, then was promoted to Warden of the North afterwards.

I think even the Northerners could put those pieces together. I don't recall anything specific, but most Northern Lords have a good idea he was involved, I believe.

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Just my opinion, but I'd guess that the throughout the North there are several different stories of how it went down, but guilt by association will be enough when it finally comes time to pay the piper.

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Well, considering the Wull wants to lick Bolton blood off his axe before he dies, I'd say the northmen have pretty good idea regarding Roose's culpability.

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Although I think most people blame the Freys for the RW, I am sure many suspect the Boltons had a hand in it.  House Manderly, for example, definitely know.  Technically speaking though, the Boltons didn't break guest right.  They did, however, turn on Rob, which everyone has to know...

 

Side note: I think very few people know the Lannisters were involved.  It would be hard to prove they had a hand anyway.

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Well, considering the Wull wants to lick Bolton blood off his axe before he dies, I'd say the northmen have pretty good idea regarding Roose's culpability.

 

I remember the line, but from my reading I got the impression that his sentiment was more because Boltons have historically been pretty bad dudes, and Arya was about to marry the worst of them.
 

 

Although I think most people blame the Freys for the RW, I am sure many suspect the Boltons had a hand in it.  House Manderly, for example, definitely know.  Technically speaking though, the Boltons didn't break guest right.  They did, however, turn on Rob, which everyone has to know...

 

Side note: I think very few people know the Lannisters were involved.  It would be hard to prove they had a hand anyway.

I seem to recall a scene from Cersei's POV where the council was talking about how the smallfolk and some lords were saying that the Lannister's needed to be punished for their involvement?
​And they discussed punishing the Freys or encouraging Walder's heirs to speed up his death to pacify people?

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Although I think most people blame the Freys for the RW

 

That's because Walder Frey broke the guest right, which is what most of the non-northerners found so sickening, even more so than the Young Wolf's death in and of itself. If the Red Wedding took place in the Dreadfort, the Bolton's would be the ones taking the heat.

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Roose Bolton came back with most of his army, the Frey army and the title of Warden of the North. Not a single northman missed the fact that Roose betrayed the Starks.

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Roose Bolton came back with most of his army, the Frey army and the title of Warden of the North. Not a single northman missed the fact that Roose betrayed the Starks.

Didn't he have the Karstarks too?

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Didn't he have the Karstarks too?

Part of the Karstark infantry (the calvary abandoned Robb earlier). But the northmen already know that the Karstark abandoned Robb.

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When Bran and co. were heading north they ran into a Liddle in a cave who shared his food and company with them. The Liddle was wearing a cape clasp in the shape of a pine cone made of bronze and gold which is not the kind of thing a poor mountain shepherd would have. So presumably he was someone of importance. He tells Bran that the Boltons are paying good silver for wolf pelts and would pay gold for the right pelts. He was basically saying that the Boltons were killing Starks and looking for the Stark boys and that he knew who Bran really was. Couple that with the mountain clans so readily siding with Stannis against the Boltons out of duty to "the Ned" I think it common knowledge among the Northerners that the Boltons were behind the Red Wedding. Manderly has clearly stated he knows and Barbrey Dustin implied (I think her tour of the crypts was looking for evidence that Manderly was telling her true that he has a witness who saw the living Stark boys exit the crypts after Winterfell was sacked). So common knowledge imho.

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When Bran and co. were heading north they ran into a Liddle in a cave who shared his food and company with them. The Liddle was wearing a cape clasp in the shape of a pine cone made of bronze and gold which is not the kind of thing a poor mountain shepherd would have. So presumably he was someone of importance. He tells Bran that the Boltons are paying good silver for wolf pelts and would pay gold for the right pelts. He was basically saying that the Boltons were killing Starks and looking for the Stark boys and that he knew who Bran really was. Couple that with the mountain clans so readily siding with Stannis against the Boltons out of duty to "the Ned" I think it common knowledge among the Northerners that the Boltons were behind the Red Wedding. Manderly has clearly stated he knows and Barbrey Dustin implied (I think her tour of the crypts was looking for evidence that Manderly was telling her true that he has a witness who saw the living Stark boys exit the crypts after Winterfell was sacked). So common knowledge imho.

I like it.

 

Well people know Roose was at the wedding, came out unhurt and not captive, then was promoted to Warden of the North afterwards.

I think even the Northerners could put those pieces together. I don't recall anything specific, but most Northern Lords have a good idea he was involved, I believe.

Agreed.

 

 

I'd like to add though, it probably doesn't matter. People (Northerners) dislike the Boltons, and there's no way they're going to let the [literally] bastards sit in Winterfell as Wardens of The North.

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When Bran and co. were heading north they ran into a Liddle in a cave who shared his food and company with them. The Liddle was wearing a cape clasp in the shape of a pine cone made of bronze and gold which is not the kind of thing a poor mountain shepherd would have. So presumably he was someone of importance. He tells Bran that the Boltons are paying good silver for wolf pelts and would pay gold for the right pelts. He was basically saying that the Boltons were killing Starks and looking for the Stark boys and that he knew who Bran really was. Couple that with the mountain clans so readily siding with Stannis against the Boltons out of duty to "the Ned" I think it common knowledge among the Northerners that the Boltons were behind the Red Wedding. Manderly has clearly stated he knows and Barbrey Dustin implied (I think her tour of the crypts was looking for evidence that Manderly was telling her true that he has a witness who saw the living Stark boys exit the crypts after Winterfell was sacked). So common knowledge imho.

You may be right, but I was always under the impression the Liddle was referring specifically to Ramsay and his cronies.

Do you happen to have the Manderly quote? I remember him talking about Ramsay being responsible for Winterfell, and the Freys but I don't recall him mentioning Roose.

Lady Dustin is an enigma to me, I don't trust her words, and I have no idea how much Roose trusts her or how much she knows. or for that matter how much the other northerners trust her. I feel like all theories about her are both crazy and justified. She's loyal to the Starks, Loyal to the Boltons, Key to the GNC, not a part of it, etc.
She could know all of Roose's secrets or none.

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Although I think most people blame the Freys for the RW, I am sure many suspect the Boltons had a hand in it.  House Manderly, for example, definitely know.  Technically speaking though, the Boltons didn't break guest right.  They did, however, turn on Rob, which everyone has to know...
 
Side note: I think very few people know the Lannisters were involved.  It would be hard to prove they had a hand anyway.


Maybe not. I imagine that since Ramsey is reminding everyone that he has been legitimized and that Roose has been named Warden by Kings Landing, and the fact that it is known that Roose escaped the Red Wedding for the better that they did it with Lannister support.

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You may be right, but I was always under the impression the Liddle was referring specifically to Ramsay and his cronies.
Do you happen to have the Manderly quote? I remember him talking about Ramsay being responsible for Winterfell, and the Freys but I don't recall him mentioning Roose.
Lady Dustin is an enigma to me, I don't trust her words, and I have no idea how much Roose trusts her or how much she knows. or for that matter how much the other northerners trust her. I feel like all theories about her are both crazy and justified. She's loyal to the Starks, Loyal to the Boltons, Key to the GNC, not a part of it, etc.
She could know all of Roose's secrets or none.


She is not loyal to Roose.....but she is playing the game as well as anyone in the North, with her built in ( fake) hate for the Starks.

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She is not loyal to Roose.....but she is playing the game as well as anyone in the North, with her built in ( fake) hate for the Starks.


I don't think her dislike for the Starks is completely fake, but it may be exaggerated. I think she's sitting on the fence and waiting to fall on whatever side is more favorable come the Battle of WF. She wants to be on the winning side, whatever that is.

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You may be right, but I was always under the impression the Liddle was referring specifically to Ramsay and his cronies.

Do you happen to have the Manderly quote? I remember him talking about Ramsay being responsible for Winterfell, and the Freys but I don't recall him mentioning Roose.

Lady Dustin is an enigma to me, I don't trust her words, and I have no idea how much Roose trusts her or how much she knows. or for that matter how much the other northerners trust her. I feel like all theories about her are both crazy and justified. She's loyal to the Starks, Loyal to the Boltons, Key to the GNC, not a part of it, etc.
She could know all of Roose's secrets or none.

Manderly says to Davos: "They do not expect the north to believe their lies, not truly, but they think we must pretend to believe or die. Roose Bolton lies about his part in the Red Wedding, and his bastard lies about the fall of Winterfell. And yet so long as they held Wylis I had no choice but to eat all this excrement and praise the taste".

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Manderly says to Davos: "They do not expect the north to believe their lies, not truly, but they think we must pretend to believe or die. Roose Bolton lies about his part in the Red Wedding, and his bastard lies about the fall of Winterfell. And yet so long as they held Wylis I had no choice but to eat all this excrement and praise the taste".

Thank you.
So at least Manderly is suspicious of Roose's role.

I'm curious about how Roose's promotion is being presented to the world.

Is there some significance to the parts you bolded I'm too dense to understand?

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Thank you.
So at least Manderly is suspicious of Roose's role.

I'm curious about how Roose's promotion is being presented to the world.

Is there some significance to the parts you bolded I'm too dense to understand?

No, the text was bolded at source, I forgot to remove the formatting. A Glover was also in the meeting with Manderly and Davos, so that makes two main houses.

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Although I think most people blame the Freys for the RW, I am sure many suspect the Boltons had a hand in it.  House Manderly, for example, definitely know.  Technically speaking though, the Boltons didn't break guest right.  They did, however, turn on Rob, which everyone has to know...

 

Side note: I think very few people know the Lannisters were involved.  It would be hard to prove they had a hand anyway.

 

Actually guest right counts for everyone, including guests to host and guests to other guests. There's a reason why Manderly brought so much of his own food with him and only eats his own.

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