Where does Westeros get its coal?

[DominusNovus]

We know that they have coal in Westeros.

 

From A Game of Thrones:

Chunks of coal burned in iron braziers at either end of the long room, but Jon found himself shivering. 

 

From A Storm of Swords:

Beneath, his face was lined and saturnine, with thin arched brows above large eyes as black and shiny as pools of coal oil. 

 

From A Dance with Dragons:

 

 

 

Those were done in maester’s ink, made of soot and coal tar, 

 

 

Charcoal is mentioned, as well, so we know that GRRM isn't just referring to charcoal, but actual coal.  Plus, there's the coal oil and tar.  There's no reason to find this unusual, anyway, since coal mining has been around for a long long time, and, in particular, medieval England was quite familiar with it.

 

Its just, I've yet to come across any indication of where it might be coming from.  The only mines that I can think of, in Westeros, as those of the Iron Islands and those of the Westerlands.  I'm inclined to think it comes from the Iron Islands, but thats just my gut.

[Felguy]

I think of the Iron Islands too but... Wasn't it only some copper and tin there? Haven't heard of coal from the islands

[Felguy]

I read up on coal in general and it makes me think most of it comes from the Neck....


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coal read the formation part

[falcotron]

Since we don't have any information, all anyone can do is make a wild guess.

One possibility is that they're only using coal the same way Roman-12th century England did, for fires in areas where wood is scarce and in small amounts for special purposes like drying food and smelting iron. If so, they can presumably get enough from a wide range of surface seams all over the continent, and it's not a big enough deal for anyone to talk about.

On the other hand, maybe they're using it the way 13th-16th century England did, and digging coal pits wherever they can find it. In that case, it's probably concentrated in a few areas, and some people are probably getting rich off it--but we don't have any idea where or who. You could guess Dorne and the North just by parallel to Wales/Cornwall and Scotland/Northumberland, and I guess that would explain why integrating these distant and divisive regions into the Seven Kingdoms has been so important. But really, that's little more than a wild guess.

[SayGen]

I love threads like this. Hopefully we can get an answer it really does make the world more immersive when it falls inline with reality.
I also agree with Felguy, thanks for the link.

[Fire Eater]

From Tywin Lannister's Christmas stocking

[Felguy]

I love threads like this. Hopefully we can get an answer it really does make the world more immersive when it falls inline with reality.I also agree with Felguy, thanks for the link.

No problem.

Got me interested as well :P the world around us depends on it for energy but we don't even research much about it. Including me.

Edit : holy shit read the Coal Fires section, those fires last long...

[BRANDON GREYSTARK]

The river lands was probably a primordial swamp as was parts of the north .

[Felguy]

From Tywin Lannister's Christmas stocking

'Heh'

[sweetsunray]

Either peat from deforrested areas around the Neck. They might have some local pits underground for coal. But GRRM might indeed use the word coal for charcoal as well. Easiest way to make coallike burning material is by turning wood into charcoal. Most people would refer to it as "coal" then. 

[DominusNovus]

I read up on coal in general and it makes me think most of it comes from the Neck....


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coal read the formation part

 

Good catch.  The Neck has my vote now.

 

Either peat from deforrested areas around the Neck. They might have some local pits underground for coal. But GRRM might indeed use the word coal for charcoal as well. Easiest way to make coallike burning material is by turning wood into charcoal. Most people would refer to it as "coal" then. 

 

Well, he refers to charcoal and coal by name, and separately.  I'm inclined to think its not just laziness on his part.

[sweetsunray]

Well, he refers to charcoal and coal by name, and separately.  I'm inclined to think its not just laziness on his part.

 

Well, it's not laziness... it's variety in vocabulary. Charcoal can be referred to as coal. That GRRM uses both words does not mean he means 2 separate type of coals. Also charcoal can be hot enough to be used for smelting and melting metal.

[DominusNovus]

 

Well, it's not laziness... it's variety in vocabulary. Charcoal can be referred to as coal. That GRRM uses both words does not mean he means 2 separate type of coals. Also charcoal can be hot enough to be used for smelting and melting metal.

 

He also refers to coal oil and coal tar in passing.  You don't get oil from making charcoal, and, technically, you don't get tar from making charcoal either (you get charcoal from making tar).

[White Ravens]

From Tywin Lannister's Christmas stocking

 

Hahaha!  :)

 

I read up on coal in general and it makes me think most of it comes from the Neck....


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coal read the formation part

 

Westeros has a history that goes back ten-thousand years or so.  Coal takes millions of years to form (even hundreds of millions of years) and could be buried under any part of the current continent, even folded up into the mountains.  The Iron Islands is my top pick for where coal is mined, but only because we know that other mining is done there.  And the Lannisters would also be no strangers to mining. 

[Felguy]

Hahaha!  :)
 

 
Westeros has a history that goes back ten-thousand years or so.  Coal takes millions of years to form (even hundreds of millions of years) and could be buried under any part of the current continent, even folded up into the mountains.  The Iron Islands is my top pick for where coal is mined, but only because we know that other mining is done there.  And the Lannisters would also be no strangers to mining.

Iron Islands are only noted for their Iron and some tin and lead. It says on the wiki.

[White Ravens]

Iron Islands are only noted for their Iron and some tin and lead. It says on the wiki.

 

I know.  The wiki doesn't say where coal is mined.  But current geology, climate and vegetation have no relation to where ancient processes formed coal so I'm inclined to go with Iron Islands for the simple reason that we know mining is part of their economy.  Also, I read in the provided link that some coal comes from ancient deposits of algae so Iron Islands again.

[Felguy]

 

I know.  The wiki doesn't say where coal is mined.  But current geology, climate and vegetation have no relation to where ancient processes formed coal so I'm inclined to go with Iron Islands for the simple reason that we know mining is part of their economy.  Also, I read in the provided link that some coal comes from ancient deposits of algae so Iron Islands again.

Sigh, okay.

[Ser Patroclo]

 

I know.  The wiki doesn't say where coal is mined.  But current geology, climate and vegetation have no relation to where ancient processes formed coal so I'm inclined to go with Iron Islands for the simple reason that we know mining is part of their economy.  Also, I read in the provided link that some coal comes from ancient deposits of algae so Iron Islands again.

 

I am somewhat doubtful that islands can be rich of coal, considered how most island have birth. 

[Cagey Bee]

Also.. it's stated that the iron islands are disentigrating, implying they were once more whole. Algae deposits old enough would be unlikely. Dorne used to be a different climate.. worth mention.. it changed when the Arm of Dorne was shattered. It doesn't mention a verdant climate, but there was a shallow salt sea..

Edit: the salt see is way underwater now.. so not saying to coal comes from there.

[Ibbison from Ibben]

Coal is much easier to find if it has been uplifted once it has formed. The seams are then exposed by erosion. Lower areas of the Mountains of the Moon might provide a good place for this to happen. Possibly the northern slopes of the Red Mountains as well.

 

Coal is forming in the Neck right now, but won't be ready for a long time. The crannogmen certainly burn peat, though.

 

There is probably coal buried deep under the Reach, but Westerosi technology isn't capable of finding it or exploiting it. LF should be buying up oil drilling rights around the Shield Islands.

 

In the end, we don't know anything about the plate tectonics of Planetos, and that's the info we need. Is the Narrow Sea spreading? Is Westeros moving west? (The lack of mountain formation on the west coast implies the answer is no.) Are the Stepstones volcanic? The Bone Mountains look like they could have been formed by a collision between two plates, like the Urals. How did the Mountains of the Moon form? Or the Red Mountains? We don't know.