Undeserved Praise

[SilentDystopia]

Sorry Double Post

 

[WSmith84]

Jon Arryn, Robert Baratheon,Ned Stark, Tywin Lannister, Hoster Tully shouldn't get any praise for RR they did it for their own selfish gains and accomplished nothing but putting worse monsters on the throne. They were just as horrible as the Targs. 

Littlefinger, Bloodraven, the Bolton's, Tyrells, Balon, etc.. 

Ah that truly selfish gain of not dying. Why couldn't they have just bent over and let Jon Arryn kill them? Or better yet, hand themselves to Aerys so he could torture them to death.

[Sage of Westeros]

Balon Greyjoy. Praised and lauded by everyone for doing nothing too great. It bugs me how much Victarion and Aeron love this guy for sucking. Baelor Blacktyde says it best when he talks about Balon.

[Mladen]

Olenna Tyrell, whose greatest achievement seems to be that she is snarky yet she isnpraised ludicrous amount by the fandom.

Hey, those snarks are achievement of its own I especially liked mentioning Rains at Purple Wedding.

The undeserved praise... Practically every major character... 

[WhitewolfStark]

To answer the OP. This all depends, are we judging based on modern values, or are we judging based upon the values of the society in which they lived? Next question--is the praise given in world or out of the world?

In either case, you're going to get different answers.

[Wall Flower]

I kind of love Olenna - probably because I'm of an age where I can look forward to being a snarky old lady and pissing off the younger generation. At least Olenna took steps to protect her granddaughter from Joffrey which was more that Mace was prepared to do. Rather that being the game player in chief, I tend to think that Olenna is sceptical of her son's ambitions and the way they put both House Tyrell and her grandchildren at risk if things go wrong for the Lannister (as they already are).

[Magnar of Skagos]

Darkstar is overrated.

[Batbob45]

Darkstar is overrated.

all he know for is harming a innocent kid and for having a very crappy  catchphrases. He might of well said that he is the star in the dark.

[JRose1989]

Darkstar is overrated.

How dare you.

[good girl]

Stannis is overrated as a millitary leader and tactician. He hid in a castle during the rebellion, he won at Fair Isle with superior numbers OK. A "seige" on Dragonstone where Targaryens had already escaped him, Robert wanted blood not the island. He was shown to be a bad seige planner with his assault on Kingslanding where he was held off by a rag tag city watch commanded by a novice which enabled re-inforcements to arrive and crush his forces.

He inspires no loyalty within his men and is in the midst of marching to his doom through heavy snow. He routed Wildlings at the Wall but they have little and less experience in large battles. But if he wanted to press his claim for the Iron Throne he should have marched back to his ships and sailed south to meet up with resistence forces in the Riverlands or lay seige to White Harbour, anything other than going from the wall by foot in winter storms.

[kimim]

Rhaegar.

Robb: His lords exaggerate how good he is, which doesn't help him, at all.

The rest, not so much. Dany is praised and worshiped, and the story works to justify that, within limits. Tywin is a capable monster, and that's how he is known; no one's under the impression that he's a good man. Cersei is the only person laboring under the delusion that she's a great ruler.

Now that I think of it, people live up to their reputations in this novel.

[Anath]

Robb: Not quite living to the hype.

Jaime and the entire redemption arc. I love him, I like him, I believe in his version of honour but I can't see this redemption thing at all. Most of all, Jaime is more Targaryen-ish than some Targaryens: he does as he pleases, conscience and other finer things don't bother him all this much. It's some of his impulses that have changed, not his nature.

Asha.

Of those we haven't seen: Daemon Blackfyre.

[7-KG]

Stannis is overrated as a millitary leader and tactician. He hid in a castle during the rebellion, he won at Fair Isle with superior numbers, OK. A "seige" on Dragonstone where Targaryens had already escaped him, Robert wanted blood not the island. He was shown to be a bad seige planner with his assault on Kingslanding where he was held off by a rag tag city watch commanded by a novice which enabled re-inforcements to arrive and crush his forces.

He inspires no loyalty within his men and is in the midst of marching to his doom through heavy snow. He routed Wildlings at the Wall but they have little and less experience in large battles. But if he wanted to press his claim for the Iron Throne he should have marched back to his ships and sailed south to meet up with resistence forces in the Riverlands or lay seige to White Harbour, anything other than going from the wall by foot in winter storms.

-First of all, when you say he "hid" in a castle, you make it sound like he did it because of cowardice and that is not true. Mace had already got to him and he had nowhere to go.He managed to keep his men disciplined and prevent them from opening the gates.

-Second, we don't even know what were the numbers at Fair Isle.

-Robert only asked his brother to take the island, it wasn't Stannis' task to kill the Targaryens.

-Novice? Tyrion? He may not be known for being a commander or anything of the sort but you can't deny his smartness and btw the battle was already doomed for Tyrion, there were even guards who were already desserting. And Stannis had no way to know about the Tyrells, when you say "enabled re-inforcements to arrive and crush his forces", you make it sound like he knew and just decided to play the noob and let himself be crushed.

-If he inspires no loyalty to his men, don't you think his army would have already desserted him? Or are you counting the show as canon? 

-A good amount of the wildlings were warriors and he was outnumbered by like 5-1.

-Lol, what? This makes zero sense. Lay siege to White harbour? It will help him to press his claim? Join with resistance forces?

Btw, at that point he was already with the "save the realm to win the throne" idea. His intention is now to fight the others. 

[Tonberry]

Baelor the Blessed is seen as a pious, peacemaking, wise ruler. He even has a great sept dedicated in his honor. This makes a lot of sense from the perspective of the folk of Westeros who love them some Seven. A king who was also a septon?! How cool! But honestly, this guy was not a great dude in some ways, was sort of an idiot in others, and he certainly wasn't a great leader. He imprisoned his innocent sisters for fear that they might marry or procreate or something. He himself refused to produce an heir. He walked into a pit of vipers, expecting his faith to save him. He only survived this because Aemon pulled him out. He engaged in book-burning. He elevated extremely unqualified people to the office of High Septon. He died of fasting. Wow. That's not to say that he did nothing right (he did feed the urban poor and foster some peace with Dorne), but he does not deserve his reputation. At all.

[redtree]

Rhaegar and Lyanna can feel free to sacrifice themselves if they want. But they do not have any right to give other people so much trouble and ruin lives of thousands of people. 

Whatever motivations they have, they destroyed thousands of people by their actions.

This is not hero for sure. 

Hero sacrificed themselves to save thousands of people. 

Rhaegar and Lyanna ruined thousands of people to have happy sex. 

This, if the indeed eloped then they were just a pair of idiots. Worse, idiots who had power over people
And the married idiot also neglected his almost death wife and his toddler and newborn to get another baby, old oven is broken so out he went. I know that many believed it's because of love (cough cough lust) but from what Dany saw in the House of Undying i take it that it was because he wanted one more baby

I have a relatively high tolerance considering that it's set in medieval time, Nobels and Royals didn't give rat's ass about common people's life back then so i'll let it slide that he knew that thousand would die and they indeed die for him and fresh uterus, but what he did was over the line, he was so mindless about his own wife and children too, if only he managed to protect them i wouldn't despise him that much. 

[redtree]

-Robert only asked his brother to take the island, it wasn't Stannis' task to kill the Targaryens.

 

Did he take my hand and say, Well done, brother, whatever should I do without you?
No, he blamed me for letting Willem Darry steal away Viserys and the babe, as if I could have stopped it.
ACOK Prologue

It wasn't mentioned explicitly but from the words above, i don't think taking Dragonstone was his sole task

 

[OldGimletEye]

Ah that truly selfish gain of not dying. Why couldn't they have just bent over and let Jon Arryn kill them? Or better yet, hand themselves to Aerys so he could torture them to death.

Yes, anybody that acts in self defense of their own life ought to be condemned because they acted "selfishly". Also notice the lumping of Tywin with the rest, whose reasons for entering the war were very different from the rest. But, hey well all know the central principle of justice within the KNP is collective punishment. So why bother with details?

[Wavey Sauce]

Rand Tarly. overrated as heck. 1 battle win. could have pursued robert but instead bitched out and ate a bunch of food in front of storms end for a year

piece of shit father piece of shit person

[Wavey Sauce]

Stannis is overrated as a millitary leader and tactician. He hid in a castle during the rebellion, he won at Fair Isle with superior numbers OK. A "seige" on Dragonstone where Targaryens had already escaped him, Robert wanted blood not the island. He was shown to be a bad seige planner with his assault on Kingslanding where he was held off by a rag tag city watch commanded by a novice which enabled re-inforcements to arrive and crush his forces.

He inspires no loyalty within his men and is in the midst of marching to his doom through heavy snow. He routed Wildlings at the Wall but they have little and less experience in large battles. But if he wanted to press his claim for the Iron Throne he should have marched back to his ships and sailed south to meet up with resistence forces in the Riverlands or lay seige to White Harbour, anything other than going from the wall by foot in winter storms.

Not sure if serious. Um hiding in a castle? He had 500 men and no food, and was surrounded by land and sea and heavily outnumbered

 

edit- after reading the whole post its obvious your busting balls to get reactions lol

[7-KG]

Did he take my hand and say, Well done, brother, whatever should I do without you?

No, he blamed me for letting Willem Darry steal away Viserys and the babe, as if I could have stopped it.
ACOK Prologue

It wasn't mentioned explicitly but from the words above, i don't think taking Dragonstone was his sole task.

Even if this is true, Stannis had no way to know about Willem Darry, though. His task wasn't to spy the Targaryens too, iirc. Robert was just whining there.