Jon Snow will surely live, won't he? But how? Will books and show do it the same way?

[FreyPiesForSkagos]

First here a a couple of thoughts on why I think he will surely love. I also bring up some of the ways I can imagine him being alive:

Some of the arguments a really debatable and I know that, but I think they add up to Jon being alive anyway. I think, I really like the idea of Jon becoming an Other, but I can't see George doing that in the books, but I can imagine the show going down that road. What would you like to see or what do you think will happen in either the show or the books?

1) Jon is not even dead.

2) Jon will be "saved" by the Others.

3) Jon will be saved by Mel.

4) Jon is simply dead.

5) Something else.

[joluoto2]

My thought is that the book and show will do it differently due to them already going in very different directions.

[Cyl]

I know the books made a point to establish some facts related to warging and death, most notably that if a warg's real body dies while he's warging something, he just lives on in the animal. It also established that Jon wargs Ghost, although he seems to do it by accident or unconsciously. I feel like that's going to be relevant in some way. Though, I guess it would be pretty weird if Jon stays in wolf form for the rest of the series.

The show hasn't established that info. Apparently Bran is the only Stark kid who can warg? (So far, at least. I predict Arya will later.) The show has this weird habit of forgetting the direwolves exist, and Ghost isn't shown or mentioned at all in the scene where Jon is attacked by the Night's Watch. So I think it's just going to have Melisandre revive him the way Thoros of Myr kept reviving Beric Dondarian.

[SevasTra82]

I know the books made a point to establish some facts related to warging and death, most notably that if a warg's real body dies while he's warging something, he just lives on in the animal. It also established that Jon wargs Ghost, although he seems to do it by accident or unconsciously. I feel like that's going to be relevant in some way. Though, I guess it would be pretty weird if Jon stays in wolf form for the rest of the series.

The show hasn't established that info. Apparently Bran is the only Stark kid who can warg? (So far, at least. I predict Arya will later.) The show has this weird habit of forgetting the direwolves exist, and Ghost isn't shown or mentioned at all in the scene where Jon is attacked by the Night's Watch. So I think it's just going to have Melisandre revive him the way Thoros of Myr kept reviving Beric Dondarian.

Yea the show only really depicts Bran having the Warging Power, I don't recall it ever revealing anyone else having it.  It may be just the shows way of "watering down" the books more, by only giving one of the Stark kids the powers.  The show will probably just have Jon survive the stabbing somehow, or have Mel give up her life to save Jon (making the viewers, who currently hate Mel, have to like her again for saving him).  This would take care of Mels plot arc in the books and give a reason for Jon to be revived without making him a warg also.

The books are a different beast, though.  Mel clearly still has a role to play passed Jon Snow (for instance, GRRM seems to be building her arc more, maybe to reveal she's BloodRavens daughter), so she has plenty left to do in in the books (unlike in the show).  Warging is obviously more common in the books as well, and it's a popular believe that Jon will warg into Ghost (due to Ghost being his last word spoken).

So that's what I'm going with.  Mel will sacrifice herself on the show to revive Jon, and in the books, Jon will warg into Ghost for a time until his body heals from a coma (or whatever)

 

 

 

[katb93]

I do think the book and show will have him revived in different ways, or perhaps the show will sort of show it a bit more simply than the book will. 

For example I think Jon will warg into Ghost in the book whilst his body is in a coma or whilst he is resurrected or something. He might learn a few things whilst he is warged aswell.

But for the show I don't know if they will have him warg as they haven't really shown any of the other Stark kids as having that ability apart from Bran. I think from Mel arriving at the wall just in time for Jon being stabbed she will most likely have a role in reviving/resurrecting him. 

Perhaps she will in the book aswell but I see the warging into ghost being a major part of it. 

Either way it will be interesting to see how it plays out in season 6 and then to see how similar or different it happens in TWOW. 

[Faint]

Both the show and book made sure to have Melisandre at hand. That is not a coincidence. 

[Makk]

There is a big problem with the geography but I would like Lady Stoneheart to bring him back alive with Jaime to take the black cloak to relieve him of his vows. But Melisandre is more likely with Shireen to burn. The show can't do this of course so maybe she will burn the kid who stabbed Jon or maybe even Ghost.

[Faint]

I do think there is a strong possibility that Jon is revived in the books via the burning of Shireen whereas in the show he is simply kissed or some other ritual that Melisandre concocts, if only because Benioff and Weiss refuse to paint their "hero" characters in gray tones or have them associated with overtly cruel acts (see Targaryen, Daeneyers; Lannister, Tyrion; Stark, Arya; etc.). 

[Ser Gareth]

My hunch is that Jon will eventually be killed by Arya and that the "Stick them with the pointy end" quote will come into play.  This will be at the very end of the book.

As for the revival?  We may never know the difference as I think there is a real possibility we'll never see TWOW.  But it's clear in the books that Jon will warg into Ghost, his human body will be frozen and at some point he will transfer from Ghost (probably at the expense of Ghost's life) back to his body.

Unlike most people I think Shireen WILL be burned to try and turn around a losing battle.  But it will be Stannis vs the Others and in desperation Stannis will burn Shireen at the urging of Mel.

[DirewolfDubz]

In the book I think Theon will be used as a offering, Sacrificed infront of the weirwood by stannis and somehow it will play into Jon being revived.

[Ser Gareth]

In the book I think Theon will be used as a offering, Sacrificed infront of the weirwood by stannis and somehow it will play into Jon being revived.

Definitely possible.  I think Bran will play a bigger role in Jon's revival than Mel.

However from what I've read the sacrifice required to bring Jon back has to be something that means a lot to Jon.  So I still think it will be Ghost's demise that brings him back.

[FreyPiesForSkagos]

In the book I think Theon will be used as a offering, Sacrificed infront of the weirwood by stannis and somehow it will play into Jon being revived.

My problem with this idea is that I was under the impression that Bran has trying to achieve something through Theon and might still be. Also I think Theon will probably live. Death would most likely be mercy for Theon in a way. Letting him leave would be more interesting that just letting him die.

[Jon leaves the Watch]

I don't think that in the books Mel will have anything to do with Jon being healed, whether that is through resurrection or just naturally healing. I think the character that will play a role in this part of his arc will be Val. Otherwise why is she still important to the plot of the story. I believe that if she is just there to help him heal that they will develop a relationship where they become very close and maybe even intimate. It just doesn't make any sense for Mel to resurrect Jon as there is no evidence that all Red Priests/Priestesses have the ability to bring people back to life. If he wargs into Ghost I think it will only be for a short time similar to Bran after his fall. 

[kimim]

idk. I think that the show is sticking fairly faithfully to the major characters established from the beginning, so I believe that D&D will go with what GRRM told them, once upon a time, about Jon's resurrection and parentage, Tyrion's parentage and fate, Arya's future, the end game, etc.

GRRM obviously does not stick to an outline, so it's possible that he'll change everything for the novels. In a way, he should do this, as otherwise the show will define his work for him. Anyway, there's no predicting what he'll do and frankly, at this point, I don't much care. I can see myself losing interest in asoiaf by the time the Dream rolls out years after the show is done. There are so many books to read, and so little time.

[UnmaskedLurker]

I am not sure whether Jon is just in a coma or whether his body really dies and he is resurrected. I don't think he become an Other (that idea seems absurd to me and has only gained traction because nihilists think it would be cool). What I have maintained continuously, however, is that if Jon is resurrected (not merely in a coma), something different has to be the case than what happened with Beric or LS -- i.e., Jon cannot be UnJon. In other cases of resurrection, the people come back with "less" of themselves.

Beric lost more of himself with each resurrection -- but Beric stated that even with the first resurrection, he lost a part of himself. Jon needs to be the "real" Jon and not UnJon. Yes, his experiences in Ghost -- where I assume he goes until brought back -- likely will change him in some regards, but he cannot be less of himself.  Because his "soul" goes into Ghost, perhaps that will be the reason that his "entire soul" can return and he is the real Jon and not UnJon. His "soul" may be able to remain entirely in-tact because it has a place to stay until returning to his body.

As to the differences between the show and books -- there might be some differences in detail but probably not in broad strokes. GRRM plotted out the entire series in terms of major plot points. D&D know these plot points and have confirmed that the show will end the same way that the book are intended to end. GRRM has confirmed that he is not going to changes these plot points because he has laid too many clues along the way and he does not "lie" to his readers (which he believes he would be doing if all the clues point in one direction and then the story comes out completely different). So while there have been and will continue to be significant differences between the two -- and maybe the method that Jon comes back is one of them -- anything that is critical to the resolution of the end of the series has to be more or less the same in broad strokes.

[RumHam]

I hope the rumors of how the show is handling it are false. 

 

Only because it'll reignite the whole "are Targaryens fireproof" debate. Edit: Though now that I think about it, theres another rumored scene involving Daenerys that would probably have the same effect. 

 

[UnmaskedLurker]

I hope the rumors of how the show is handling it are false. 

 

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Actually -- I would not be surprised is something on that order happens in both the book and the show. See my further thoughts in the hidden-text spoiler box below.

Dany going into the fire and not burning was described by GRRM as a "one-time" event. But I tend to think he was not being entirely truthful in it happening only one time. I think it happens only one time with Dany -- she is not fireproof -- but fire is a powerful force and a scene in which they attempt to burn Jon's body just as he is being resurrected (which the people burning the body, of course, don't know is happening) and then having Jon emerge from the flames unscathed is a parallel to Dany and kick-ass visual that seems too tempting to pass up. 

[RumHam]

Actually -- I would not be surprised is something on that order happens in both the book and the show. See my further thoughts in the hidden-text spoiler box below.

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I don't really have a problem with that idea, I'm just dreading the confusion it will generate. I dunno if you were lurking here back then but a few years ago when I first joined the board the "are Targaryens fireproof/resistant" thing was frequently debated, even though most of us felt Martin had settled the issue.

[kimim]

Actually -- I would not be surprised is something on that order happens in both the book and the show. See my further thoughts in the hidden-text spoiler box below.

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I'd prefer an ice resurrection, tbh. There's been some attempt to balance out ice and fire. Aemon lives, because cold preserves. R'hllor and his fire are evil, and the "fire" resurrection of Cat was not pretty.

Problem is that the Walkers, poised to become the big bad, are ice. Dany and her dragons, who will presumably stop the Walkers from destroying humanity, are fire. Whatever the nuance, that is pretty Manichean, with ice as the evil element, and fire as the good (or sort of good) element that prevents the total destruction of humanity.

So I'd like to see something good come of ice.

[RumHam]

I'd prefer an ice resurrection, tbh. There's been some attempt to balance out ice and fire. Aemon lives, because cold preserves. R'hllor and his fire are evil, and the "fire" resurrection of Cat was not pretty.

Problem is that the Walkers, poised to become the big bad, are ice. Dany and her dragons, who will presumably stop the Walkers from destroying humanity, are fire. Whatever the nuance, that is pretty Manichean, with ice as the evil element, and fire as the good (or sort of good) element that prevents the total destruction of humanity.

So I'd like to see something good come of ice.

An ice resurrection would be Jon returning as a wight, no?