drawkcabi Posted October 20, 2016 Share Posted October 20, 2016 Happy Spirit Day to everyone. My best to all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Of House Hill Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 @Sivin Glad all is going well. @Weeping Sore Don't fret. Things will sort themselves out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HexMachina Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 I stumbled across this article today. I was left a bit...well, confused to start with because its understanably sketchy on all of the facts, but then I was rather disappointed. On the one hand, if I've read the article correctly this woman has had her child taken away from her for allowing her to express the gender she wants to be. On the other hand, it could be that its not the child who actually wanted to live life as a girl, it doesnt seem like that is the case but like I say the facts are sketchy. If it was the child's desire to live as a girl...I don't know, it seems wrong that her mother should lose her child over that. I can also appreciate that the concept of gender is fluid and especially so at a young age, but I do think this seems awfully unfair against the mother, and the child too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weeping Sore Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 1 hour ago, HelenaExMachina said: I stumbled across this article today. I was left a bit...well, confused to start with because its understanably sketchy on all of the facts, but then I was rather disappointed. On the one hand, if I've read the article correctly this woman has had her child taken away from her for allowing her to express the gender she wants to be. On the other hand, it could be that its not the child who actually wanted to live life as a girl, it doesnt seem like that is the case but like I say the facts are sketchy. If it was the child's desire to live as a girl...I don't know, it seems wrong that her mother should lose her child over that. I'm skeptical that this was a case of the mother projecting onto a son. The baffled judge seems like he has never heard of transgender children. And I don't think it would take much from the father to get a trans daughter back into a masculine pose. That said, without more info we can't know for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Pepper Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 Yeah, that article is very light on info. It's completely unclear whether or not social services or any health care professional were able to provide documentation on whether the child is transgender or not. At times the article seemed to imply that the mom forced the child to present as a girl in order to be stealth from the father. So, who knows? It seems like an irresponsible article at the least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Of House Hill Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 I agree that there is too little information to come to any conclusion. What I fear is that the child is the center of a tug of war between the parents and may be yielding to pressure from whichever parent has custody. But that is just supposition on my part. The Guardian article seems to have been grabbed from this, 5 days earlier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weeping Sore Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 Reading further it seems that the judge is deeming placement to the father to be neutral toward gender expression while the mother was pushing the child to be female. But I would be concerned that what the judge thinks of as "neutral" is really allowing the default judgment of society coming at individuals from all sides, namely that assigned gender = real gender. And the support needed to overcome this powerful pressure (from the mom in this case) might seem to an outsider like it is the determining factor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ljkeane Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 15 minutes ago, Dr. Pepper said: At times the article seemed to imply that the mom forced the child to present as a girl in order to be stealth from the father. I think what it's saying is the mother was preventing the father having contact with the child, possibly in order to facilitate him/her 'living in stealth' as a girl. That was probably a significant factor in the courts getting involved initially. It's hard to say to much about whether it's the right decision or not really as the judge has ordered restrictions on reporting the details of the case. I'd say generally speaking a parent projecting their mistaken impressions onto a non transgender child seems very unlikely but I suppose it's possible so who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HexMachina Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 Yes my first reading was in favour of the mother, but the article is sketchy (I imagine there is only so much that can be said for confidentiality reasons). The judge does seem very ignorant of the idea of transgender children based on the article though. Thanks for the link to the Independent article too, I didn't see it when it first came out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weeping Sore Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 8 minutes ago, ljkeane said: It's hard to say to much about whether it's the right decision or not really as the judge has ordered restrictions on reporting the details of the case. I'd say generally speaking a parent projecting their mistaken impressions onto a non transgender child seems very unlikely but I suppose it's possible so who knows. I agree, of course it is possible. The article should have used gender-neutral pronouns for the child as their identity is in question, though. Jumping to "boy" and "his" creates the impression of a foregone conclusion that the mother is wrong and the judge and father are correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Of House Hill Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 One problem is that the action by the judge can be seen both as protecting the privacy of the child and concealing possible bias or other judicial misconduct or error on the part of the judge. I have no knowledge whether legal procedures in the UK permit further judicial review in the matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theda Baratheon Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 read in an article about this case the judge using the term ''male orientated interests'' fuck that - hate male and female coded interests, especially for children, not enough info to have a proper opinion of this case and even if the judge is protecting the child i still find that ''male orientated'' interests (power rangers, spongebob) bullshit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HexMachina Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 21 minutes ago, Theda Baratheon said: read in an article about this case the judge using the term ''male orientated interests'' fuck that - hate male and female coded interests, especially for children, not enough info to have a proper opinion of this case and even if the judge is protecting the child i still find that ''male orientated'' interests (power rangers, spongebob) bullshit Oh yeah I meant to bring that up too, it jumped out at me too as a bit of an indication of the Judge's POV. It added to my opinion that this was probably decided unfairly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theda Baratheon Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 Just now, HelenaExMachina said: Oh yeah I meant to bring that up too, it jumped out at me too as a bit of an indication of the Judge's POV. It added to my opinion that this was probably decided unfairly a friend of mine linked it on fb and wasn't too impressed with the phrasing. pretty outdated and ridiculous Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karaddin Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 7 hours ago, Theda Baratheon said: read in an article about this case the judge using the term ''male orientated interests'' fuck that - hate male and female coded interests, especially for children, not enough info to have a proper opinion of this case and even if the judge is protecting the child i still find that ''male orientated'' interests (power rangers, spongebob) bullshit Precisely this. You don't need more than this to determine that this judge has no fucking business making a ruling on a kids gender identity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maltaran Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 I saw this in one of the tabloids at the weekend, it was basically using the case as an opportunity to complain about social services being overly politically correct and didn't really have any actual information on the case. Having read the Guardian article which has some actual details, I have an uneasy feeling that the judge is probably biased. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derfel Cadarn Posted October 29, 2016 Share Posted October 29, 2016 Quote A question; I'm writing a sci-fi short story. Some of the characters are of indeterminate gender, and rather than using 'it' or 'they', I'm looking for recognised gender-neutral terms for he/she, him/her, and his/her. Google revealed several alternatives, but I'm looking for established alternatives, not flash-in-the-pan terms that will only serve to date my story. At the moment I'm using ve for he/she, hal for his/her, and undecided with him/her. Any guidance on this issue would be appreciated, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maltaran Posted October 29, 2016 Share Posted October 29, 2016 The only one I've encountered more than once, other than singular they, is xe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Pepper Posted October 29, 2016 Share Posted October 29, 2016 Many people I know use ze and zir (xe and xir?). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Of House Hill Posted October 29, 2016 Share Posted October 29, 2016 This includes a whole bunch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.