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Comics XII: All New, All Twelve


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2 hours ago, Kalbear said:

The new artist for Clean Room is not as good as the original - who is simply one of the best artists I've seen since Cassady and Opena - but is still quite good, and is very good at the clean style and expressive character design. 

Clean Room also benefits tremendously from rereads once you find out what's going on, as you see a lot more setup and planning than most stories. It's very clear that the story has been planned from early on. Apparently Clean Room will 'end' around issue 24, but there might be a volume 2. 

Completely agree with your comments on Jon Davis Hunt - he's a tough act for most to follow.

I do like how it unfolds at its own pace and how the organisation that appears evil may not be. I have a chaotic week with moving so probably won't have time to finish this week.

A volume 2 could benefit ig the gap allowed JDH to do 6 issues as given his star is rising it may lead to more sales on the trades. There's also some strong buzz about the comic in general so I think it may wind up a lot more popular in a year than it is now. Sort of like how early Image hits like Walking Dead grew in fanbase. It still says a lot about how the Vertigo brand died when Karen Berger left - there was a time when Vertigo meant quality. The odd thing is how they still put out excellent books but that brand recognition has been stolen by Image.

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The Wild Storm was a worrying bit of nostalgia for me given I thought Ellis' "Stormwatch" was fresh when it was out 20 years ago.

Have to admit I don't really know what's going on in issue 1 which is a big minus for a book that is supposed to launch a new imprint. I've never been that familiar with the non Authority/stormwatch segment of that world and the only aspect of Wildcats I know of is the excellent and ahead of its time Wildcats 3.0 which y it's nature wasn't really "wildcats".

What is good is the intrigue and set up of some of the characters. It would just help if i knew who they were as none of them really did much except for the Emgineer (the one charater I am familiar with). Jon Davis Hunt doesn't get to shine in the way he does with Clean Room but when he is given something interesting to do he livens up eg the transformation of the engineer (who now looks like a cross between Predator and a jet).

I'll stick with the series but I'm already getting the impression that this should be a trade read and that we could do with some additional material telling us who the hell everyone is and what there powers are. I know there's a stylistic reason for not doing this but I also think 6 months (assuming this is a non-traditional Ellis release schedule) to know who and what the players are. I guess I could google the names and assume they are similar in the new version.

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Anyone still reading Walking Dead comics?  Issues 163 & 164. Daaaaamn!
Especially #164...

This may be my favorite issue in years. Kirkman really stepped up the writing and gave some fantastic character moments to Rick, Negan, Carl, and even fucking Eugene! Coupled with some well paced action and an ominous cliffhanger, well, what more could you ever ask for from a single issue of a comic?

Color. The answer is color.
But I'm still good with the graytones. Srsly.


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8 hours ago, PetyrPunkinhead said:

Anyone still reading Walking Dead comics?  Issues 163 & 164. Daaaaamn!
Especially #164...

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This may be my favorite issue in years. Kirkman really stepped up the writing and gave some fantastic character moments to Rick, Negan, Carl, and even fucking Eugene! Coupled with some well paced action and an ominous cliffhanger, well, what more could you ever ask for from a single issue of a comic?

 

 

 

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Color. The answer is color.
But I'm still good with the graytones. Srsly.

 

Yeah, I really enjoyed Rick & Negan in the house. I've always liked Negan as a character, but lately I can really see why Kirkman didn’t want to let him go.

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14 hours ago, Nictarion said:

Re The Walking Dead #164

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Yeah, I really enjoyed Rick & Negan in the house. I've always liked Negan as a character, but lately I can really see why Kirkman didn’t want to let him go.

 

Are you reading the "Here's Negan" origin story in the Image+ magazine? A lot of what Negan said...

to Rick in that house in #164 was sincere and he told it truthfully as it happened in the "Here's Negan" story. Actually, I think a good bit of what he said to Rick as far as his motives for his behavior with the Saviors spoiled what's to come in "Here's Negan." Although I'm still interested to see how Negan made that leap in logic that the only way to keep people alive was by "tricking them" to the only way to do trick them was to make them "slaves."

I'm curious to see where this "New Negan" will end up. I don't think Rick will ever give Negan the level of respect he seems to be craving from Rick. Once he realizes that, it'll be interesting to see where his loyalty to Rick goes. I'm also really curious to see if Negan goes back to ruling the Saviors after all is said and done with this current arc. Hilltop burned, Alexandria overrun with the Saviors like vultures circling, ready to pick up the scraps. The Kingdom a wild card. This better be good!

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6 hours ago, Kalbear said:

Holy fuck, clean room 16 steps things up. It went from a slow burn to mother fuckers getting some serious ass kicking. 

good to know the story gets even better. I managed to convert an Italian friend to the series by showing him some of the artwork at the weekend.

Also started reading the Vision trade and it's as good as everyone here has claimed. I'd love it if Netflix made this into a miniseries. It's not often Marvel makes something that could be considered a classic but it's happened in one of the weirdest of places. For all the bold reimagings that appear to have faltered over the last couple years, they may have been worth it if a comic like this is one of the results of said reimaginings.

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Rucka's new Image book was decent. Looks like it may have a highlander vibe (or someone developed Lazari further back in history). The art reminded me a lot of Eduardo Risso which is always a plus.

Apparenlty Ed Brubaker seems to be moving more into TV. He wrote an episode of Westworld last year and is now the writer on a new amazon show with nicolas winding refn as director. Given the quality of his comics and how he often pursues more character driven stories he should cross over nicely.

It sort of makes me want to track down Ed and Rucka's time on the batbooks and their co-effort "Gotham Central". I recall the run being quite popular but it was at a time I was mainly interested in X-men and Marvel.

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Question for those in tune with Marvel releases.

I've been reading the Old Man Logan comics and really like the Old Man Logan character as well as the new Hulk, Amadeus Cho.

I am looking for a storyline in which the new, non-dr Banner Hulk features. Anyone know any stories?

Is there a big event story that came out recently that features these two, or one that is ongoing?

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8 hours ago, Calibandar said:

Question for those in tune with Marvel releases.

I've been reading the Old Man Logan comics and really like the Old Man Logan character as well as the new Hulk, Amadeus Cho.

I am looking for a storyline in which the new, non-dr Banner Hulk features. Anyone know any stories?

Is there a big event story that came out recently that features these two, or one that is ongoing?

A few years ago there was a Hulks mini-crossover. I didn't read it but think it had the red hulk and she-hulk in it along with a non-hulk amadeus cho.

I'm sure they all have no choice but to feature in the events but I got the impression Cho wasn't a focus in the Civil War II book. She-Hulk sort of was though and the events there have set up her new book.

I really liked Cho from his introduction back in Greg Pak's Hulk run. Not sure he needed to be the Hulk as well but having never read a single page of him as the Hulk, I couldn't say. He was always a fun character and i liked how they partrayed his super genuis.

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

I was willing to give Nick Spencer/Marvel a "wait and see" approach to them outing Cap America as a Hydra agent but now it appears that Magneto is also joining Hydra. Given he's a holocaust survivor I find it hard to beleive there'd be any plausible reason for him to side with them unless there is a Hydra brain control virus. But the other thing is that they are clearly trolling fans and using them to generate publicity (although I can't see how this really gains them sales) with the hindsight that the Cap America reveal was one that appeared to divide fans. Again, I don't know how sales for the book have fared since the Hydra thing happened but it's distasteful to double-down on the stunt again.

 

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18 hours ago, red snow said:

I was willing to give Nick Spencer/Marvel a "wait and see" approach to them outing Cap America as a Hydra agent but now it appears that Magneto is also joining Hydra. Given he's a holocaust survivor I find it hard to beleive there'd be any plausible reason for him to side with them unless there is a Hydra brain control virus. But the other thing is that they are clearly trolling fans and using them to generate publicity (although I can't see how this really gains them sales) with the hindsight that the Cap America reveal was one that appeared to divide fans. Again, I don't know how sales for the book have fared since the Hydra thing happened but it's distasteful to double-down on the stunt again.

Undoubtedly.

I can't wait for people to start telling us all that we don't understand how comics work, wait and see how the story develops, give it a fair chance, blah blah blah. No matter how this turns out Marvel have at the very least depicted a Holocaust survivor as a member of a Nazi group. Oh, I'm sorry, HYDRA aren't technically Nazis, they're just pseudo-Nazis for comics that you can read without having to worry about what the Nazis actually stood for, right?

I started this comment actually pretty calm but the more I think about this the angrier I get. Which is probably what Spencer is aiming for.

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They're definitely playing off the publicity.  As long as Spencer can stomach the internet outrage, it'll definitely sell his new event.  As far as Magneto as Hydra goes - the depiction is definitely a problem but Mag's character has always been a bit of a problem, he's a genocidal fascist who's also a Nazi survivor. As someone on twitter said - the whole thing could be worth it if it's the first stage of destroying Hydra and getting some more nuanced villains.

On 26/02/2017 at 0:54 AM, Calibandar said:

Question for those in tune with Marvel releases.

I've been reading the Old Man Logan comics and really like the Old Man Logan character as well as the new Hulk, Amadeus Cho.

I am looking for a storyline in which the new, non-dr Banner Hulk features. Anyone know any stories?

Is there a big event story that came out recently that features these two, or one that is ongoing?

Cho is an important part of World War Hulk, iirc, but that's before he becomes the new Hulk. He was in Civil War II but not the main storyline, his own ongoing series ties in quite heavily and that's quite an interesting story about his relationship with Banner leading up to Banner's death and Cho seeking revenge. And then he's also in the Champions series with Ms Marvel and Miles Morales.

10 hours ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said:

 Just started Locke and Key by Joe Hill and Gabriel Rodriguez. Amazing stuff, both story and art.

I love this series, one of the best in comics imo.

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57 minutes ago, mormont said:

Undoubtedly.

I can't wait for people to start telling us all that we don't understand how comics work, wait and see how the story develops, give it a fair chance, blah blah blah. No matter how this turns out Marvel have at the very least depicted a Holocaust survivor as a member of a Nazi group. Oh, I'm sorry, HYDRA aren't technically Nazis, they're just pseudo-Nazis for comics that you can read without having to worry about what the Nazis actually stood for, right?

I started this comment actually pretty calm but the more I think about this the angrier I get. Which is probably what Spencer is aiming for.

One excuse i read was "it's an alternative cover it probably doesn't even happen in the comic" which is almost more offensive and publicity grabbing.

I admit to being part of the "blah blah" group with the cap announcement at the time but like I said doubling down on their mistakes means they are consciously sporting controversy for sales.

9 minutes ago, john said:

 As far as Magneto as Hydra goes - the depiction is definitely a problem but Mag's character has always been a bit of a problem, he's a genocidal fascist who's also a Nazi survivor. As someone on twitter said - the whole thing could be worth it if it's the first stage of destroying Hydra and getting some more nuanced villains.

 

I never had a problem with Magneto essentially being the thing he hates in the sense people/societies often become like their oppressors in order to make sure such things don't happen again. As long as he straggles the line between defending mutants and going on the offensive with humans it's interesting like his recent turn as a "hero". Although historically Magneto has done things that make him irredeemable especially in his days on asteroid M and the acolytes. That was creepy stuff and I can't remember how they retconned that one. However he'd never do things in the name of or for Nazis.

I always thought of Hydra as a fairly generic villain group within Marvel but I guess I was always more of a spidey and X-men fan. I think the movies probably heightened their usage in comics because MCU has a problem with villains and given the prominence of SHIELD i can see the temptation of a counterbalance. Just a shame shield turned out to be Hydra.

I guess it does show that the comics still have creative freedom from the MCU though as I can't imagine Kevin Feige really wants there to be any discussion of "Cap America is a Nazi" making it into the media.

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You can argue about whether Magneto is a 'fascist' - it varies according to who's writing him, at what point in his career, and what definition of fascism you want to use.

He sure as shit isn't a Nazi though. Nor even a pseudo-Nazi. He's spent his life fighting HYDRA: the Red Skull and the Struckers are long-time antagonists of his. In the context of fights he's had with those characters, usually when they were part of HYDRA, Magneto has made it 150% clear that he considers them to be the people who killed his family and exterminated millions of his fellow Jews. So even the weak 'HYDRA aren't technically real Nazis' defence does not stand up for a second.

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1 hour ago, john said:

 

Cho is an important part of World War Hulk, iirc, but that's before he becomes the new Hulk. He was in Civil War II but not the main storyline, his own ongoing series ties in quite heavily and that's quite an interesting story about his relationship with Banner leading up to Banner's death and Cho seeking revenge. And then he's also in the Champions series with Ms Marvel and Miles Morales.

 

Thanks. While we are at it, are there any good inhumans stories from the last 15 years or so?

I have the classic series by Paul Jenkins and Jae Lee, and would like more, but it doesn't seem like much of worth has been done.

They do play a good part in the Infinity series by Hickman right? I am getting that one anyway.

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1 hour ago, Calibandar said:

Thanks. While we are at it, are there any good inhumans stories from the last 15 years or so?

I have the classic series by Paul Jenkins and Jae Lee, and would like more, but it doesn't seem like much of worth has been done.

They do play a good part in the Infinity series by Hickman right? I am getting that one anyway.

Well, Marvel has lots of recent material for you if you like the Inhumans but only if you want them as X-men substitutes - there's been very little focusing on the Royal Family.

I think they were a key part of some of the cosmic series several years ago? Maybe the second or third "annihilation" series. I think they were popular but possibly more for the cosmic adventures as opposed to the Inhumans being a part of it.

The Karnak series just finished and was apparently good - probably better not having to deal with the delays now it's done.

But the Jenkins and Lee trade is possibly the best the Inhumans have been so chances are it's downhill from there. Maybe you'll get lucky and the new Inhumans series may be good? They are selling the X-men and Inhumans relaunches as "back to basics" so I'm guessing the Royal Family will be back at the forefront.

Hopefully the TV show will be good. Amazing casting of the bastard of Bolton as Maximus.

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29 minutes ago, red snow said:

Well, Marvel has lots of recent material for you if you like the Inhumans but only if you want them as X-men substitutes - there's been very little focusing on the Royal Family.

I think they were a key part of some of the cosmic series several years ago? Maybe the second or third "annihilation" series. I think they were popular but possibly more for the cosmic adventures as opposed to the Inhumans being a part of it.

The Karnak series just finished and was apparently good - probably better not having to deal with the delays now it's done.

But the Jenkins and Lee trade is possibly the best the Inhumans have been so chances are it's downhill from there. Maybe you'll get lucky and the new Inhumans series may be good? They are selling the X-men and Inhumans relaunches as "back to basics" so I'm guessing the Royal Family will be back at the forefront.

Hopefully the TV show will be good. Amazing casting of the bastard of Bolton as Maximus.

I like it to focus on the Royal Family yeah.

I have the War of Kings trade paperback, unread. Apparently they feature in that and I think that may be what yo are referring to.

Thanks for mentioning the Karnak series, will check that out.

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27 minutes ago, Calibandar said:

I like it to focus on the Royal Family yeah.

I have the War of Kings trade paperback, unread. Apparently they feature in that and I think that may be what yo are referring to.

Thanks for mentioning the Karnak series, will check that out.

War of Kings is the one I was thinking of.

I haven't read Karnak but it's by Ellis so will probably be good. Karnak's power is pretty cool.

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