Pony Queen Jace

WWE Royal Rumble

356 posts in this topic

17 hours ago, SerPaladin said:

I personally agree. But as a dad of a pair young teen sons, and an uncle of two boys age 5 and 7, I'm the only one that likes Sami. My boys also couldn't figure out why I liked Punk a few years ago, though they are learning to appreciate the art of making an arena full of marks hate you as a heel.

Ambrose is a less mean Piper. He can drive plot in the ring, backstage, or in his talk show. He's funny on the mic and unpredictable in general, but effective in stirring the pot. I cringe every time he does his "wacky" rope bounce, because it breaks believability, but (most of) the rest of his move-set looks damaging and intentionally painful, and he can sell. I'd like him better if he had Cesaro's move-set, just to name a guy who is his size.

"In the Ring" is not the only criteria, if it was, Cesaro would have Reign's push. For objective value, Zayn and Ambrose are upper midcarders, one is much better in the ring, one is much better on the mic (and moves merch). Smarks like us don't buy as many t-shirts as little kids. I got my nephew the Owens and Zayn toys for Christmas, and I had to explain who Zayn was in relation to Owens. He still would have preferred Cena.

I can see why Zayn might not appeal to teens.  He's been portrayed as a dork, always seeking approval of authority figures.  He also loses a lot, which is on booking.  I can also see why he wouldn't appeal to younger kids.  He's never treated like he matters, and younger kids pretty much like who they're told to like.  That's why there's such a disparity between kids and adults when it comes to Reigns.  The WWE has done everything they can to tell fans that he's the next coming of Christ.  The kids buy into it, because they're kids.  The adults don't, because Reigns is mediocre in the ring and has all the charisma of a bag of rocks.  

But I see this as an issue that's more on the WWE's end than Zayn's.  They spend all their time building up one guy (Reigns) as the next best thing at the expense of everyone else instead of treating multiple guys like stars as they should.  I think Zayn could be an easy main event guy for the WWE, and perhaps even their next Daniel Bryan.  It seems that fans really want to like him.  The WWE just struggles to give us a compelling reason to do so.  He might have a better shot on Smackdown, although I really wish they had used the shake-up as a way to finally separate he and Owens for a while.  As good as those two are together, they faced off so regularly on Raw that I just have no desire to see another Owens/Zayn match for at least a year.

And really, Cesaro should have Reigns' push.  He's great in the ring, he's got the look that Vince loves (tall, ripped), and he's charismatic as hell and the crowd loves him.  The only reason he hasn't held a world title thus far is because he's Swiss, and Vince doesn't think a Swiss guy can be a star.  Any competent organization would have realized what they had and pushed him accordingly.  

As far as Ambrose goes, I think they just missed the bullet on him.  The time to push him was the year following the Shield break-up.  He was far hotter than Reigns during that time period, but the WWE kept refusing to put the title on him in favor of Rollins (who was being booked terribly as a heel champ) and Reigns (who no one liked).  They waited until he'd been phoning it in in the ring for months and he had cooled off considerably before finally putting the title on him, and by that point fans had moved on to AJ Styles (who is pretty much better than Dean in every way).  

I will say that I'm glad that the WWE has maneuvered Owens, Zayn, Styles, and Nakamura to all be on Smackdown at once.  It just means I really don't have much reason to watch Raw any more, unless of course Braun Strowman is going to be attempting murder on Reigns every week.  That might actually compel me to watch.  :lol:

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10 hours ago, briantw said:

And really, Cesaro should have Reigns' push.  He's great in the ring, he's got the look that Vince loves (tall, ripped), and he's charismatic as hell and the crowd loves him.  The only reason he hasn't held a world title thus far is because he's Swiss, and Vince doesn't think a Swiss guy can be a star.  Any competent organization would have realized what they had and pushed him accordingly. 

Cesaro to Smackdown would have been a great move. Programs with Styles, Owens, Nakamura, even Zayn or Ziggler or Harper, would all be outstanding. I'm hoping Harper turns into a Cesaro type. He's another agile big dude with limited mic skills, but he'd be better booked Cesaro-style than just putting him into the "hoss category" with Kane and Corbin and Seamus.

Let's all hope for a Cesaro trade for... Orton... in the next shake-up.

Also, too much creativity for the writers, but the Drifter would be fun drifting across all the WWE shows. Raw, NXT, Smackdown, maybe a crown and cape for the UK show and a lucha mask again for 205 Live. Just let the dude be completely surreal, and instruct the announce team to treat it completely normal, like he's part of that brand's roster that week. It might appeal only to me, but have a little fun.

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Shane McMahon survives helicopter crash.

I haven't watched WWE in years, but if they somehow work this into the storyline on the show and make it out so Stone Cold sabotaged the helicopter... I'd watch every minute!!!!!!

:lol: 

 

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Posted (edited)

1 hour ago, Rhom said:

Shane McMahon survives helicopter crash.

I haven't watched WWE in years, but if they somehow work this into the storyline on the show and make it out so Stone Cold sabotaged the helicopter... I'd watch every minute!!!!!!

:lol: 

 

Man, Shane has got to stop taking these crazy bumps, it makes the boys look bad.

Edited by GrimTuesday

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30 minutes ago, GrimTuesday said:

Man, Shane has got to stop taking these crazy bumps, it makes the boys look bad.

He definitely should've held off on a spot like this until WrestleMania next year, with good ol' JR on commentary...

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6 hours ago, Joe Pesci said:

He definitely should've held off on a spot like this until WrestleMania next year, with good ol' JR on commentary...

BAH GAWD, HE KILLED HIM!  AS GAWD AS MY WITNESS HE IS BROKEN IN HALF!

Seriously...JR's commentary will always be the best.  Lucha Underground has really good commentary, though.  I really dig the Striker/Vampiro combo.  

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Posted (edited)

Been a while since I've seen this thread.  Anyone who follows this shit should watch NXT Takeover Brooklyn from last week.  Fantastic show from top to bottom.  Every match was great, and the end was awesome.  NXT is killing it right now, and they've got the Ring of Honor invasion story just getting started.  Fits perfectly that Nigel McGuinness is one of the announcers there now.

Edited by briantw

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47 minutes ago, briantw said:

Been a while since I've seen this thread.  Anyone who follows this shit should watch NXT Takeover Brooklyn from last week.  Fantastic show from top to bottom.  Every match was great, and the end was awesome.  NXT is killing it right now, and they've got the Ring of Honor invasion story just getting started.  Fits perfectly that Nigel McGuinness is one of the announcers there now.

Yeah NXT is pretty much always better - and the ROH invasion is pretty fun.  They just kicked up Roode to Smackdown.  Don't get why Asuka is still in NXT at this point.  Also don't know why they're doing Lesner-Strowman and Cena-Reigns at No Mercy instead of doing those two money matches at Summerslam, but this is part and parcel why I've never been able to sustain interest in the product for more than a few months since he bought WCW.

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27 minutes ago, dmc515 said:

Yeah NXT is pretty much always better - and the ROH invasion is pretty fun.  They just kicked up Roode to Smackdown.  Don't get why Asuka is still in NXT at this point.  Also don't know why they're doing Lesner-Strowman and Cena-Reigns at No Mercy instead of doing those two money matches at Summerslam, but this is part and parcel why I've never been able to sustain interest in the product for more than a few months since he bought WCW.

Asuka's vacating the NXT title in a week and is going to get called up.  Supposedly she broke or injured her collarbone during the match with Ember Moon at Takeover, but I have no idea if it's a real injury or a work. I think it has a six week or so recovery time, and they pretty easily could have written around that and kept the title on her.  My opinion is that they wanted to keep her undefeated streak going on the main roster, possibly to lead to a Wrestlemania match with Ronda Rousey if she's ready.  Thus, having her vacate the title makes the most sense.  Sucks she didn't get to put Ember over on the way out the door, because Ember is fucking awesome and possibly the most athletic female on the roster, but I can at least see the value in them running with the "who will beat Asuka" story.

As far as the other stuff goes, I usually just credit it to Vince McMahon being senile and out of touch.  You'd think they'd build up to major matches, but instead they often give them away for free on Raw or Smackdown or some random unimportant PPV.  I also agree it's hard to sustain interest.  It sucks because I like so many people on the main roster (Owens, Styles, Zayn, etc.), but they just rarely put on amazing matches there because they are all booked so poorly.  I've mostly stopped watching Raw/Smackdown and when I miss part or all of non-NXT PPVs I usually don't rewatch unless I read that a match was amazing (which is rare).

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3 minutes ago, briantw said:

Asuka's vacating the NXT title in a week and is going to get called up.  Supposedly she broke or injured her collarbone during the match with Ember Moon at Takeover, but I have no idea if it's a real injury or a work.

Yeah I read that shortly after I posted.  I don't think it's a work, but it does make clear they intended to call her up soon.  I don't think she's ever been in the cards for Rousey - the obvious angle there is the horsewomen, and Charlotte is going to be insanely over whenever she comes back and whatever happens to the naitch.  Agreed on her not being able to put over Ember before she moved up - Ember has loads of potential and I think that's probably what they had in mind without the injury.

8 minutes ago, briantw said:

You'd think they'd build up to major matches, but instead they often give them away for free on Raw or Smackdown or some random unimportant PPV.

Yeah, this is the problem with the network.  There's no longer an incentive to save things for PPVs, and particularly the major PPVs beyond Mania which is a week long event that takes over a city.  I have no problem with them giving away major matches on TV - they did that all the time during the Monday Night Wars.  The problem is they don't have any storyline progression or any means to differentiate the matches on Raw/Smackdown and the PPVs.  It's just laziness.  Can't think of the examples right now, but I'm pretty sure at least a couple of the Summerslam matches were given away on TV in the go-home shows.  That's just telling your viewers you don't care about build anymore.

13 minutes ago, briantw said:

It sucks because I like so many people on the main roster (Owens, Styles, Zayn, etc.), but they just rarely put on amazing matches there because they are all booked so poorly.  I've mostly stopped watching Raw/Smackdown and when I miss part or all of non-NXT PPVs I usually don't rewatch unless I read that a match was amazing (which is rare).

Exactly.  I got excited again because of the wealth of talent they have right now.  There is so much potential there that me and my brother started getting interested around a year ago.  Like clockwork, the excitement waned pretty quickly and the most interesting thing was Jericho (my second favorite wrestler ever) coming up with new ways to get his list over.

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1 minute ago, dmc515 said:

Exactly.  I got excited again because of the wealth of talent they have right now.  There is so much potential there that me and my brother started getting interested around a year ago.  Like clockwork, the excitement waned pretty quickly and the most interesting thing was Jericho (my second favorite wrestler ever) coming up with new ways to get his list over.

The Jericho/Owens bromance and then Owens turning on him was basically the best part of Raw from when Owens won the title until Wrestlemania.  He and Owens were just a great pairing, as they're both lightning quick with their quips and just naturally funny guys.

I also thought Owens turning on Jericho at the Festival of Friendship was one of the few genuinely shocking moments I've seen from the main roster in years.  Everyone knew he was going to turn on Jericho, or Jericho was going to turn on him, but I don't think anyone thought it was going to happen at that moment.  Owens is at his best when they're just letting him be a savage asshole who has no problem injuring guys on purpose.

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Posted (edited)

7 minutes ago, briantw said:

The Jericho/Owens bromance and then Owens turning on him was basically the best part of Raw from when Owens won the title until Wrestlemania.  He and Owens were just a great pairing, as they're both lightning quick with their quips and just naturally funny guys.

I also thought Owens turning on Jericho at the Festival of Friendship was one of the few genuinely shocking moments I've seen from the main roster in years.  Everyone knew he was going to turn on Jericho, or Jericho was going to turn on him, but I don't think anyone thought it was going to happen at that moment.  Owens is at his best when they're just letting him be a savage asshole who has no problem injuring guys on purpose.

Totally.  It was the only thing worth watching for so long and is a testament to why Jericho is so awesome.  He brought out the best in Owens - who exudes talent himself.  Now they can't even make the Styles/Owens feud compelling and have moved on to having Owens feud with Shane.  And why Shane is still doing this shit and supposed to be a box office draw at his age is, like, Trump level baffling.

ETA:  Another example is what they did with Balor last year was great.  Then he comes back and....the best he's gotten is a feud with Wyatt.  It's quite frustrating.

Edited by dmc515

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15 minutes ago, dmc515 said:

Totally.  It was the only thing worth watching for so long and is a testament to why Jericho is so awesome.  He brought out the best in Owens - who exudes talent himself.  Now they can't even make the Styles/Owens feud compelling and have moved on to having Owens feud with Shane.  And why Shane is still doing this shit and supposed to be a box office draw at his age is, like, Drumpf level baffling.

ETA:  Another example is what they did with Balor last year was great.  Then he comes back and....the best he's gotten is a feud with Wyatt.  It's quite frustrating.

What's interesting about the most recent Jericho run is that, for how well it ended, it began absolutely terribly.  His feud with Styles never gave us any good matches and his feud with Ambrose gave us one of the worst matches of that year.  He really rounded into form after that, though, and his feud with Owens had some really good matches.  Those two work really well together.  Granted, both guys tend to work well with just about everyone, but they definitely brought out the best in each other during that feud.  Jericho's lost a step, but he can still go pretty well for a guy his age.

Agree about Styles/Owens.  I remember they put on an awesome Raw match before they did the brand split, and their most recent matches just haven't hit that level.  The most recent one was good, although overbooked since they're running the Shane/Owens feud.  I will say that I am at least interested in a Shane/Owens match.  Shane seems like the perfect person to put over Owens, as Owens can just absolutely destroy him and it will be totally in character.  It could be a smart way to write Shane off of TV for a while too.

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33 minutes ago, briantw said:

What's interesting about the most recent Jericho run is that, for how well it ended, it began absolutely terribly.  His feud with Styles never gave us any good matches and his feud with Ambrose gave us one of the worst matches of that year.  He really rounded into form after that, though, and his feud with Owens had some really good matches.  Those two work really well together.  Granted, both guys tend to work well with just about everyone, but they definitely brought out the best in each other during that feud.  Jericho's lost a step, but he can still go pretty well for a guy his age.

Yeah, I think it took awhile for Jericho to get back into form, and the Styles feud was definitely a disappointment.  Assuming it took him awhile to get back in the groove, which is understandable considering his age.  The only thing I remember about the Ambrose feud is Jericho later saying he owed him, like, 10 grand for one of his bedazzled jackets or something.  Which was hilarious.

36 minutes ago, briantw said:

The most recent one was good, although overbooked since they're running the Shane/Owens feud.  I will say that I am at least interested in a Shane/Owens match.  Shane seems like the perfect person to put over Owens, as Owens can just absolutely destroy him and it will be totally in character.  It could be a smart way to write Shane off of TV for a while too.

I think the problem with their Summerslam match was simply Shane was in the way.  You take away that type of crap and just give the two 20 minutes and I'm sure they could put on a show.  I still don't understand the rationale of Shane putting anyone over.  What heat do you get for beating a 46 year old non-wrestler?  Vince had his blood feuds in the early 2000s, sure, but it was always against guys that didn't need any rub and were done as special attraction matches at Mania, not topping the card of a "PPV."

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For as awful as Vince tends to be at giving the fans what they want (unless what they want is Roman Reigns, of course), I give him credit for the ass beating he took tonight.  That shoot headbutt was brutal.  No way he doesn't have a concussion.  Surprised they okay'd that.

 

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