The Dornishman's Wife Foreshadows Abel's Fate

[TerrorVoid]

13 hours ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

The problem with your analogy here is that the Mance would be descending with attackers fighting their way down so the Mance would have the disadvantage.

He could easily bait them into going to lower levels, while blocking the way out.

[Jak Scaletongue]

22 hours ago, aryagonnakill#2 said:

Why would sausages disable dogs?  Did he poison the sausages?  In short, I don't get the sausage stuff.  Hiding drugs under meat fools cops not dogs, if thats what made you think that.  To fool dogs you need to hurt their nose with peppers or something similar.  And your still not "fooling" them, your hurting them so they stop.

Also, no ladder in crypts, and when did Roose & Ramsay leave the hall so that Mance could use the lords door?  I don't believe that is in the text.

On a side note - Danes smuggling Jews out of Denmark to Sweden (and possibly other places as well) would use meat mixed or coated with cocaine because it would numb/block/[scientific jargon] the dogs odour receptors and make it impossible (or nearly) for the dogs to smell the humans in the hold of the boat.  Chances are it got them a little...distracted...in the process as well...which could only have helped!

Now, Mance likely doesn't have access to cocaine, and under *his* circumstances it wouldn't really be the solution he needs (throwing sausage in the opposite direction he's running would probably work better for him).  BUT hiding drugs in food CAN confuse dogs as well as cops - it just depends on the drug...

[aryagonnakill#2]

2 hours ago, Jak Scaletongue said:

On a side note - Danes smuggling Jews out of Denmark to Sweden (and possibly other places as well) would use meat mixed or coated with cocaine because it would numb/block/[scientific jargon] the dogs odour receptors and make it impossible (or nearly) for the dogs to smell the humans in the hold of the boat.  Chances are it got them a little...distracted...in the process as well...which could only have helped!

Now, Mance likely doesn't have access to cocaine, and under *his* circumstances it wouldn't really be the solution he needs (throwing sausage in the opposite direction he's running would probably work better for him).  BUT hiding drugs in food CAN confuse dogs as well as cops - it just depends on the drug...

If your willing to waste the drugs...lol.  But that makes sense.  Coke would numb their noses if it was powdered and open.

[Eden-Mackenzie]

On January 26, 2016 at 7:05 AM, purple-eyes said:

...Plus in that song there is indeed "he smiled" and he had "brothers". 

A outlaw man tasted a dornish woman, then a dornish man killed him with a special blade. I mean it does sound like arthur, smiling knight and elia. Probably the closest case in the whole series. I can not think another dornish man like this.

 

On January 26, 2016 at 11:01 AM, Warm Pie said:

The problem with OP's theory is that there is no Dornishman's Wife at Winterfell.  Rescuing a woman is not the same as seducing her.

Here's the thing about songs though: they're open to a myriad of interpretations/associations, especially those with uncertain origins, such as the Dornishman's Wife and the Bear and the Maiden Fair (it's about Brienne; no wait, it's about Sansa; no wait, it's about Dany and Jorah). Even the Rains of Castamere, which we know was written about Tywin's takedown of the Reynes, is forever tied to the Red Wedding, and, to a certain extent, the Purple Wedding as well.

When Mance changed the lyrics from "Dornishman's wife" to "Northman's daughter", he made the song be about the situation in Winterfell. Mance has brothers too: his former brothers of the Watch, and his brothers-in-arms of the Free Folk; portions of each group are/were planning a visit to Winterfell.  Mance is a singer, knows all the bawdy songs, and seems like an overall jovial guy who may smile from time to time. Seducing is not the only possible interpretation of "tasting" a woman, it could also be raping, or it could be stealing the hostage wife of a sadistic lunatic.

On January 26, 2016 at 11:58 AM, TerrorVoid said:

Sorry, I thought, ladder=stairway.
I meant that only one person can go in a row, which is told to us 

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He and Robb had fought many a heroic battle on these steps, slashing at one another with wooden swords. Good training, that; it brought home how hard it was to fight your way up a spiral stair against determined opposition. Ser Rodrik liked to say that one good man could hold a hundred, fighting down.

I would think the staircase would still have to be a bit wider than just a single person, in order to allow a defender to effectively swing a sword, but not wide enough to allow two people to fight side-by-side against a common enemy.  So staircase is maybe wide enough to allow two people to walk beside each other? The real advantage comes from holding the higher ground: your blows are going land higher on the body, near the more vulnerable spots (eyes, mouth, throat etc.), and have the added momentum of gravity behind them, whereas your attacker will have to be swinging up at you, with less of a target. The only advantage this staircase could have for Mance would be if he can get to it without being seen by Roose's men, and that is going to largely depend on exactly what caused all the commotion, whether it was the escape or the sounding of the war horns.

[Jak Scaletongue]

1 hour ago, aryagonnakill#2 said:

If your willing to waste the drugs...lol.  But that makes sense.  Coke would numb their noses if it was powdered and open.

That would be the hard part!

(Though when the choice is drugs or saving people from gas chambers, I think I manage without the coke for a bit )

[Makk]

I strongly believe it was Ramsay who wrote the letter. I simply don't believe that the possible motivations for Mance or Stannis to write the letter fit well enough. There is no need for there to be a twist of one of them forging the letter because the twist already exists that Ramsay has been mislead as described in the original post.

And although it wouldn't have been implausible for Mance to have escaped, the only way Ramsay would have known enough to write the letter is if he captured and tortured Mance. So that is not good news for him.

I'm not completely sold on the meaning of the song in regards to this. The line about the leech is interesting but there doesn't seem to be a good fit in regards to much else. Neither Ramsay nor Roose has a daughter that Mance has "tasted" and the last part where he dies surrounded by his brothers doesn't seem to fit well either. Along with that I don't really think it is the kind of thing that GRRM foreshadows since he tells us plainly a few chapters later. But I do agree with the analysis of what led Ramsay to write the pink letter.

[Clegane'sPup]

On 1/26/2016 at 2:25 PM, purple-eyes said:

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Rhaegar has half blackwood blood which is as strong as Bloodraven, so maybe he wargged into a raven when he died and then took the body of mance rayder with the help of bloodraven.

I would like to check to see if I am correctly reading what you are saying? Tis okay?

BR helped Rhaegar warg a raven when Rhaegar died? Rhaegar, who is now living inside a raven decided to move into the body of The Mance?

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The real mance already died when he went outside the wall. That is why he changed a lot after he came back.

 Mance was living inside the wall and died when he went outside the wall. The reason the dead Mance changed was because Rhaegar with the help of BR warged a raven and then Rhaegar left the raven and moved into Mance’s dead body?

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His black cloak was repaired with red silk and red is the color of Targ. This means he came back with "red".

I got nuttin’.

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he is not an oathbreaker because Rhaegar never took the oath of the watch.

Mance is not an oathbreaker because Rhaegar with the help of BR warged a raven and moved into Mance’s body thus making Mance’s dead body Rheagar's?

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This is completely possible, I have to say.

Are you saying Rhaegar is a skinchanger who has warged Mance’s dead body when Mance went outside the wall after being inside the wall?

On 1/26/2016 at 2:25 PM, purple-eyes said:

In this case, he may not know Jon is his son since he never met him, and he did not even know if Jon is a son or daughter or a stillborn baby.

Since everybody in 7K knew Lyanna died and Jon is a bastard of Ned and he looked nothing like rhaegar, Rhaegar would not know Jon is his son either.

By the way, Dalla also died in childbirth, so this is like a pattern of rhaegar, his women always would have big problem with childbirth.

 

All a person has to do is scroll over a name to get info. You have racked up 5352 posts since 7/15. Are you a person whose second language is English? Or are you a person pretending that English is their second language?  Just curious, that I am.

[purple-eyes]

3 minutes ago, Clegane'sPup said:

Are you saying Rhaegar is a skinchanger who has warged Mance’s dead body when Mance went outside the wall after being inside the wall?

All a person has to do is scroll over a name to get info. You have racked up 5352 posts since 7/15. Are you a person whose second language is English? Or are you a person pretending that English is their second language?  Just curious, that I am.

Oh yeah, English is indeed my second language. For this I have no doubt. I can write in another language much better.

Often I felt so frustrated that I can not express myself very well here. Sometimes I am sort of tired so I do not check my writting very carefully.

But I admit that I do write a lot in English on a daily basis. So...............maybe I am too diligent on this?

Hope this answer satisfies your curiosity.

 

Anyway, come back to topic, this mance/rhaegar thing is just my crackpot.

Maybe I should have put an extra sentence that: Crackpot alert! just for entertainment purpose! Please do not take it too seriously!

Actually I occsionally had some funny idea such as Cersei is the KOLT, or something like this.

I brought them up here just for fun, and I do not think they are true.

 

 

 

[Clegane'sPup]

Spoiler

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The Dornishman's wife was as fair as the sun,

and her kisses were warmer than spring.

But the Dornishman's blade was made of black steel,

and its kiss was a terrible thing.

. . .

The Dornishman's wife would sing as she bathed,

in a voice that was sweet as a peach,

But the Dornishman's blade had a song of its own,

and a bite sharp and cold as a leech.

. . .

As he lay on the ground with the darkness around,

and the taste of his blood on his tongue,

His brothers knelt by him and prayed him a prayer,

and he smiled and he laughed and he sung,

"Brothers, oh brothers, my days here are done,

the Dornishman's taken my life,

But what does it matter, for all men must die,

and I've tasted the Dornishman's wife!"

Jon I, Storm 7

Later, the Mance changed the words of the song . . .

 

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He was still waiting for his porridge when Ramsay swept into the hall with his Bastard's Boys, shouting for music. Abel rubbed the sleep from his eyes, took up his lute, and launched into "The Dornishman's Wife," whilst one of his washerwomen beat time on her drum. The singer changed the words, though. Instead of tasting a Dornishman's wife, he sang of tasting a northman's daughter.

The Turncloak, Dance 41

The last time we saw the Mance, posing as Abel, Theon foretold his fate. . .

 

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"Ramsay will use your women as his prey," he told the singer. "He'll hunt them down, rape them, and feed their corpses to his dogs. If they lead him a good chase, he may name his next litter of bitches after them. You he'll flay. Him and Skinner and Damon Dance-for-Me, they will make a game of it. You'll be begging them to kill you." He clutched the singer's arm with a maimed hand. "You swore you would not let me fall into his hands again. I have your word on that." He needed to hear it again.

"Abel's word," said Squirrel. "Strong as oak." Abel himself only shrugged. "No matter what, my prince.”

. . .

If Abel's scheme went awry, Ramsay would make their dying long and hard. He will flay me from head to heel this time, and no amount of begging will end the anguish. No pain Theon had ever known came close to the agony that Skinner could evoke with a little flensing blade. Abel would learn that lesson soon enough. And for what? Jeyne, her name is Jeyne, and her eyes are the wrong color. A mummer playing a part. Lord Bolton knows, and Ramsay, but the rest are blind, even this bloody bard with his sly smiles. The jape is on you, Abel, you and your murdering whores. You' ll die for the wrong girl.

Theon, Dance 51

In between we learned about Ramsay and Skinner . . .

 

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He remembered how much it had hurt when Lord Ramsay had commanded Skinner to lay his ring finger bare.

. . .

Reek swung down from his saddle and took a knee. "My lord, Moat Cailin is yours. Here are its last defenders."

"So few. I had hoped for more. They were such stubborn foes."

Lord Ramsay's pale eyes shone. "You must be starved. Damon, Alyn, see to them. Wine and ale, and all the food that they can eat. Skinner, show their wounded to our maesters."

"Aye, my lord."

Reek II, Dance 20

 

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There were things too hurtful to remember, thoughts almost as painful as Ramsay's flaying knife . . .

Reek III, Dance 32

 

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Roose Bolton's pale eyes were fixed on Theon, as sharp as Skinner's flaying knife.

A Ghost in Winterfell, Dance 46

And notice the similarities between this . . . 

 

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But the Dornishman's blade was made of black steel, and its kiss was a terrible thing.

and this . . .

 

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When you have known the kiss of a flaying knife, a laugh loses all its power to hurt you.

The Prince of Winterfell, Dance 37

Toward the end of Dance, the Mance was in a very, very tight spot . . .

 

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Of Abel, Rowan, Squirrel, and the others there was no sign. He and the girl were alone. If they take us alive, they will deliver us to Ramsay.

Theon, Dance 51

Now, perhaps the Mance was able to hide in the crypts, or maybe he was able to escape Winterfell completely. More likely, however, he was taken alive by Ramsay’s men since we last saw him playing in the Great Hall . . .

 

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Roose Bolton gave an approving nod. "As he says. There will be time enough to fight each other once we are done with Stannis." He turned his head, his pale cold eyes searching the hall until they found the bard Abel beside Theon. "Singer," he called, "come sing us something soothing."

Abel bowed. "If it please your lordship." Lute in hand, he sauntered to the dais, hopping nimbly over a corpse or two, and seated himself cross-legged on the high table. As he began to play—a sad, soft song that Theon Greyjoy did not recognize—Ser Hosteen, Ser Aenys, and their fellow Freys turned away to lead their horses from the hall.

Rowan grasped Theon's arm. "The bath. It must be now."

. . .

"But . . . Abel . . . “

"Abel can fend for himself," murmured Squirrel.

. . .

"Frenya, Holly, go with them," Rowan said. "We will be along with Abel. Do not wait for us." And with that, she whirled and plunged into the snow, toward the Great Hall. Willow and Myrtle hurried after her, cloaks snapping in the wind.

Theon, Dance 51

Then, Jon reads a letter . . .

 

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Bastard, Your false king is dead, bastard. He and all his host were smashed in seven days of battle. I have his magic sword. Tell his red whore. Your false king's friends are dead. Their heads upon the walls of Winterfell. Come see them, bastard. Your false king lied, and so did you. You told the world you burned the King-Beyond-the-Wall. Instead you sent him to Winterfell to steal my bride from me.

I will have my bride back. If you want Mance Rayder back, come and get him. I have him in a cage for all the north to see, proof of your lies. The cage is cold, but I have made him a warm cloak from the skins of the six whores who came with him to Winterfell.

I want my bride back. I want the false king' s queen. I want his daughter and his red witch. I want his wildling princess. I want his little prince, the wildling babe. And I want my Reek. Send them to me, bastard, and I will not trouble you or your black crows. Keep them from me, and I will cut out your bastard' s heart and eat it. Ramsay Bolton, Trueborn Lord of Winterfell.

Jon XIII, Dance 69

The false king was Stannis and Ramsay claimed to have defeated his army and killed him after seven days of battle. He claimed to have taken Stannis’s Lightbringer, and he learned of Melisandre. Of course, he could have learned about her from Stannis’s men, but more likely, he learned about Melisandre from the Mance. Stannis’s friends were Abel’s washer women. Ramsay claimed to have killed them and put their heads on spikes. Ramsay learned that Abel was the Mance, send by Jon to kidnap the presumed Arya. In addition to Melisandre, Ramsay leanred about Selyse and Shireen, and Val and the Mance’s son. He apparently assumed that Theon had escorted the presumed Arya to the Wall. Of course, this was shocking when we read this in the summer of 2011.

It became even more confusing on 12/28/2011, when . . .

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

And during those seven days, we should assume that Ramsay and Skinner tickled all of the Mance’s secrets from him. . .

 

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"If the glamor fails, they will kill you."

The wildling began to scrape the dirt out from beneath his nails with the point of his dagger. "I've sung my songs, fought my battles, drunk summer wine, tasted the Dornishman's wife. A man should die the way he's lived. For me that's steel in hand."

Melisandre, Dance 31

As you can see in the OP there was no mention of Rhaegar. While I have come to the conclusion that Rhaegar is a personal favorite of yours, Rhaegar warging a raven with the help of BR, etc, is not mentioned.

Thank you, though, for answering my nosey question about your English.

[purple-eyes]

13 minutes ago, Clegane'sPup said:

  Hide contents

Jon I, Storm 7

Later, the Mance changed the words of the song . . .

 

The Turncloak, Dance 41

The last time we saw the Mance, posing as Abel, Theon foretold his fate. . .

 

Theon, Dance 51

In between we learned about Ramsay and Skinner . . .

 

Reek II, Dance 20

 

Reek III, Dance 32

 

A Ghost in Winterfell, Dance 46

And notice the similarities between this . . . 

 

and this . . .

 

The Prince of Winterfell, Dance 37

Toward the end of Dance, the Mance was in a very, very tight spot . . .

 

Theon, Dance 51

Now, perhaps the Mance was able to hide in the crypts, or maybe he was able to escape Winterfell completely. More likely, however, he was taken alive by Ramsay’s men since we last saw him playing in the Great Hall . . .

 

Theon, Dance 51

Then, Jon reads a letter . . .

 

Jon XIII, Dance 69

The false king was Stannis and Ramsay claimed to have defeated his army and killed him after seven days of battle. He claimed to have taken Stannis’s Lightbringer, and he learned of Melisandre. Of course, he could have learned about her from Stannis’s men, but more likely, he learned about Melisandre from the Mance. Stannis’s friends were Abel’s washer women. Ramsay claimed to have killed them and put their heads on spikes. Ramsay learned that Abel was the Mance, send by Jon to kidnap the presumed Arya. In addition to Melisandre, Ramsay leanred about Selyse and Shireen, and Val and the Mance’s son. He apparently assumed that Theon had escorted the presumed Arya to the Wall. Of course, this was shocking when we read this in the summer of 2011.

It became even more confusing on 12/28/2011, when . . .

 

Hidden Content

 

Hidden Content

 

And during those seven days, we should assume that Ramsay and Skinner tickled all of the Mance’s secrets from him. . .

 

Melisandre, Dance 31

As you can see in the OP there was no mention of Rhaegar. While I have come to the conclusion that Rhaegar is a personal favorite of yours, Rhaegar warging a raven with the help of BR, etc, is not mentioned.

Thank you, though, for answering my nosey question about your English.

Oh, you are welcome. 

Where did you get rhaegar is my personal favorite? 

Quite the opposite, I am a famous rhaegar hater here. 

OP is talking about mance and I do not think I am the first one to bring rhaegar = mance here. 

 

 

[Clegane'sPup]

7 minutes ago, purple-eyes said:

Oh, you are welcome. 

Where did you get rhaegar is my personal favorite? 

Quite the opposite, I am a famous rhaegar hater here. 

OP is talking about mance and I do not think I am the first one to bring rhaegar = mance here. 

 

 

Do you think that Mance escaped WF?

Or was Mance captured?

And as much as I really, really dislike this question, have you read any of the five books?

[purple-eyes]

7 minutes ago, Clegane'sPup said:

Do you think that Mance escaped WF?

Or was Mance captured?

And as much as I really, really dislike this question, have you read any of the five books?

I have no idea. 

Sure, I read them. But I have not read much the English books yet. Too many pages and sort of tiring. 

[Lost Melnibonean]

15 hours ago, TerrorVoid said:

He could easily bait them into going to lower levels, while blocking the way out.

Wasn't your poimt that he would have an advantage fighting on the steps, which was foreshadowed by Robb and Jon's duels on steps?

[TerrorVoid]

16 hours ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

Wasn't your poimt that he would have an advantage fighting on the steps, which was foreshadowed by Robb and Jon's duels on steps?

The exact qoute was about advantage for the one who is standing above.

[Lord Lannister]

On 1/25/2016 at 4:43 PM, Lost Melnibonean said:

In context, it appeared that Stannis defeated the Freys and made a deal with the Manderlys to effect a ruse. Apparently, seven days after Roose ordered the Manderlys and the Freys out of Winterfell to fight Stannis, the Manderlys returned with Stannis sword, and false word of Stannis’s defeat.

And during those seven days, we should assume that Ramsay and Skinner tickled all of the Mance’s secrets from him. . .

I'm not sure about the foreshadowing in the song, but I do like your theory that the Manderly's are conspiring with Stannis and setting Bolton up to fail as so. That's the most plausible and creative interpretation of the pink letter I've seen so far.

[Lost Melnibonean]

And this exchange happens right after The Mance introduces himself to Jon...

"How did you like the song, lad?"

"Well enough. I'd heard it before."

"But what does it matter, for all men must die, the King-beyond the-Wall said lightly, "and I've tasted the Dornishman's wife."

[Aegon VII]

On January 27, 2016 at 6:44 PM, Clegane'sPup said:

And as much as I really, really dislike this question, have you read any of the five books?

Id like to ask the same thing to anyone who doesn't agree that Mance = rhaegar is supported in the text. To anyone who doesn't think it's a plausible theory I highly suggest rereading the books again.

i can understand not agreeing with it, but it is a valid theory with textual evidence backing it up. In this thread, someone just casually mentioned that he believed it when responding to the op, it was everyone else's reaction to it that derailed the thread. 

If we do consider mr=RT, it much further extends the parallels between him and bael. He already got off with the stark girl, Lyanna, and had the kid, js. Now he just has to do the "infiltrating the castle as a bard" aspect of it. If js ends up killing him in battle it will really complete the story. I'm interested to see what the "leech" foreshadows, because it does suggest Mance will be killed by a Bolton instead of js.

MR=RT is a valid theory that some of us like to take into consideration when evaluating other theories. It is very frustrating when every single time it is mentioned, the thread gets derailed by people commenting the same four or five reasons they think it's impossible, reasons that everyone already knows. 

On January 27, 2016 at 6:31 PM, purple-eyes said:

Snip

Interesting theory about rhaegar going into a raven and then into Mance's body, I've never considered that before. There's evidence supporting Mance and BR working together and both have connections with Ravens. Definitely possible, albeit "crackpot".

[Clegane'sPup]

8 hours ago, Aegon VII said:

Id like to ask the same thing to anyone who doesn't agree that Mance = rhaegar is supported in the text. To anyone who doesn't think it's a plausible theory I highly suggest rereading the books again.

i can understand not agreeing with it, but it is a valid theory with textual evidence backing it up. In this thread, someone just casually mentioned that he believed it when responding to the op, it was everyone else's reaction to it that derailed the thread. 

Don't have much to say except you may want to go check @purple-eyes prior posts.

Mance is not Rhaegar. It is not a valid theory. Lack of text or ample amount of text does not a theory make.

[Adam Yozza]

On 08/01/2017 at 2:25 PM, Aegon VII said:

Id like to ask the same thing to anyone who doesn't agree that Mance = rhaegar is supported in the text. To anyone who doesn't think it's a plausible theory I highly suggest rereading the books again.

i can understand not agreeing with it, but it is a valid theory with textual evidence backing it up. In this thread, someone just casually mentioned that he believed it when responding to the op, it was everyone else's reaction to it that derailed the thread. 

If we do consider mr=RT, it much further extends the parallels between him and bael. He already got off with the stark girl, Lyanna, and had the kid, js. Now he just has to do the "infiltrating the castle as a bard" aspect of it. If js ends up killing him in battle it will really complete the story. I'm interested to see what the "leech" foreshadows, because it does suggest Mance will be killed by a Bolton instead of js.

MR=RT is a valid theory that some of us like to take into consideration when evaluating other theories. It is very frustrating when every single time it is mentioned, the thread gets derailed by people commenting the same four or five reasons they think it's impossible, reasons that everyone already knows. 

Interesting theory about rhaegar going into a raven and then into Mance's body, I've never considered that before. There's evidence supporting Mance and BR working together and both have connections with Ravens. Definitely possible, albeit "crackpot".

Mance=Rhaegar isn't supported in the text though. Mance grew up at the Wall, he was a wildling child that was captured and raised by the NW. So that discounts the theory that Rhaegar faked his death, took a new name and ran off to join the NW. The fact that Rhaegar was cremated further discredits this theory.

Similarly, our descriptions of Mance and Rhaegar differ greatly, so the theory of Mance dying on his ranging and Rhaegar taking his place also can't work. Mance has greying brown hair and sharp brown eyes. Rhaegar has silver hair and purple eyes. I'd argue that coloring ones hair on a regular basis while at the Wall wouldn't be easy, but I'll accept that he could do it. His eyes though can't be done without a glamour.

As to the suggestion that Rhaegar skinchanged into Mance's body....well, that one would actually work, though I'd feel cheated if this were the case. However the problem is that there is no textual evidence to support that Rhaegar was a skinchanger.

[LmL]

21 minutes ago, Adam Yozza said:

Mance=Rhaegar isn't supported in the text though. Mance grew up at the Wall, he was a wildling child that was captured and raised by the NW. So that discounts the theory that Rhaegar faked his death, took a new name and ran off to join the NW. The fact that Rhaegar was cremated further discredits this theory.

Similarly, our descriptions of Mance and Rhaegar differ greatly, so the theory of Mance dying on his ranging and Rhaegar taking his place also can't work. Mance has greying brown hair and sharp brown eyes. Rhaegar has silver hair and purple eyes. I'd argue that coloring ones hair on a regular basis while at the Wall wouldn't be easy, but I'll accept that he could do it. His eyes though can't be done without a glamour.

As to the suggestion that Rhaegar skinchanged into Mance's body....well, that one would actually work, though I'd feel cheated if this were the case. However the problem is that there is no textual evidence to support that Rhaegar was a skinchanger.

Agree. It is in fact completely discounted by the text. Fwiw. The truth is that they have many symbolic correlations, and that's not an accident, but they are far from the only two characters who have symbolic parallels, and this does not mean they are the same person.