Star Wars Episode VIII: The Force Rolls out of Bed and Stretches [Ep VII Spoilers]

[ab aeterno]

The Force Awakens just gets better every time I see it. Now that's impressive. 

[Astromech]

6 minutes ago, ab aeterno said:

The Force Awakens just gets better every time I see it. Now that's impressive. 

It nails the humor of the original trilogy as well.

[ab aeterno]

8 minutes ago, Astromech said:

It nails the humor of the original trilogy as well.

Yeah, watching it again a few months after launch helps put in in perspective, and now that I'm not overanalysing things, I'd rate it even more highly. Even the fight with the gangs doesn't bother me that much. 

[Astromech]

The gangs initially felt out of place, but have grown on me with more viewings. The only issue I have is the Leia/Chewbacca cold shoulder after the battle, but the writers admitted they goofed there and regret it.

[ab aeterno]

The camera angle doesn't help, because it looks so cold on both their parts.

[karaddin]

On 7/4/2016 at 3:39 AM, Kalbear said:

It's a plausible sword fight that isn't super choreographed to hell and is filled with emotional value. Both it and the Kylo/Finn fight. They're masterful action as conversation, very much similar to Fury Road. It isn't action for its own sake, and it works very well.

It's very reminiscent of Empire and RotJ's duels - not the best choreography, but excellent in being a conversation of violence. And the facial expressions of Rey are just awesome and made me cheer again watching it. 

Is this an intentional choice of words on your part referencing some ideas from KOTOR2 (and possibly KOTOR1, it's been years since I played that and losing my save meant I never managed to finish it) or purely coincidental? Because if the latter it's potentially hitting on something quite relevant.  Filoni has certainly drawn heavily on the KOTOR era for Rebels, and with the way it's being tied together through the Malachor connection (Kylo's sabre design connecting back to the Scourge and the stuff we saw there in the Rebels finale) it certainly seems that some elements at least were playing into the design of TFA, so the idea of a philosophy from that influencing what they try to do with combat style doesn't seem beyond the realm of possibility.

The relevant part of KOTOR2 (for any who don't know it, regardless of whether Kal does) is a species called the Echani who had the following philosophy on fighting

Quote

Echani culture held the belief that to know one fully, you must fight them. Echani fighting was not only self-defense, but a form of self-expression, a means of communication similar to art. For the Echani, it was not at all unusual for children of the same parents to be born so as to be completely indistinguishable from one another to outsiders. Thus, being able to distinguish between like individuals through reading of body movement became an essential requirement.

The Echani were also known to be able to read feelings and emotion through combat. To an Echani, a combat between two people said more than hours of talking. They saw a certain purity in the way techniques were used in battle.[6] The Maktites learned this to their own sorrow circa 3951 BBY, when their stores of thermal weaponry were rendered ineffectual by relatively simple adjustments in the traditional Echani light armor.[5]

Reading the list of appearances on there, they did indeed appear in KOTOR1 as well along with some of the novels...all of this is now Legends, but they are in the process of absorbing the parts they liked into canon.

[Kalbear]

Yeah, had no idea at all about that. That's cool! I was more referring to something that has been lost in a lot of the high-octane action sequences we see - that really good action is another form of expression and ideally has its own language. This was a key in TESB and ROTJ, where we see the lightsaber duels as first an analysis of how Vader is, how energetic but undisciplined Luke is, and then later the conflict of rage and anger about his father that Luke has. It's an undercurrent of the entire fight and it matters, and because it matters the fight is better even if the choreography isn't that special. It's affecting and emotionally charged. The closest that the prequels got to this was the Anakin-Obiwan fight, but even that was sanitized to oblivion. 

This is, IMO, why things like Winter Soldier have worked and why other superhero movies have failed in their fight scenes, despite them being cool. And why TFA succeeded - because the Kylo/Finn fight told us something about Ren that we didn't know, and the Kylo/Rey fight told us something about both of them in a way that mere conversation couldn't. 

[Corvinus85]

JJ may have shut down the "Luke is Rey's father" theory.https://www.yahoo.com/movies/star-wars-jj-abrams-reveals-big-clue-about-024438518.html

Quote

“Rey’s parents are not in Episode VII. So I can’t possibly say in this moment who they are. But I will say it is something that Rey thinks about, too.”

 

[The Monkey]

The more I think about the theory that Obi-Wan is Rey's grandfather (or perhaps father if force ghosts can ejaculate), the more I like it. 

[Calibandar]

1 hour ago, Corvinus said:

JJ may have shut down the "Luke is Rey's father" theory.https://www.yahoo.com/movies/star-wars-jj-abrams-reveals-big-clue-about-024438518.html

 

You could almost say Luke wasn't in Episode VII either.

[Rhom]

Quote

ugh, Abrams clarified his comments to Entertainment Weekly. “What I meant was that she doesn’t discover them in Episode VII. Not that they may not already be in her world,” Abrams said.

WTF does that even mean?!!?

[Joe Pesci]

After seeing the Abrams line about Rey's parents not being in TFA, the first thing that popped into my mind was 'well maybe just one of them was in it'. It's a stretch, but that was my initial reaction.

[red snow]

30 minutes ago, The Monkey said:

The more I think about the theory that Obi-Wan is Rey's grandfather (or perhaps father if force ghosts can ejaculate), the more I like it. 

Me too. The only pre-existing character I'd like to be a family member. Mainly as it sets up a whole other story around Obi Wan. Who did he break his vows for? Why did he abandon them in favour of looking over Luke? All kinds of things including "how did Luke find his family"

17 minutes ago, Calibandar said:

You could almost say Luke wasn't in Episode VII either.

JJ is so good at misdirection bullshit from the lost days and his general approach to advertising that he could easily be emphasing "parentS" in the case we only saw one of them. Honestly, they should interview the guy like they are in court or writing up a contract.

Having not discovered her parents in ep VII seems like even more BS.

[RumHam]

9 minutes ago, red snow said:

Honestly, they should interview the guy like they are in court or writing up a contract.

I don't even think that would help, he did flat out lie about Khan several times. 

[Astromech]

It just sounds like clickbait to me. JJ is trolling as he usually does.

[Jen'ari]

 Sorry to spoil the surprise, but I am Reys father.

[HexMachina]

3 hours ago, Rhom said:

WTF does that even mean?!!?

It means Rey wonders who her parents are, but doesn't learn who they are in Episode 7. But, that doesn't mean they weren't in the film

[HexMachina]

3 hours ago, Leap said:

If Luke is her Dad, then she doesn't find out in VIII, is what I took from it. 

He was talking about Episode VII. She could well find out in VIII

[red snow]

2 hours ago, Lord Sidious said:

 Sorry to spoil the surprise, but I am Reys father.

Did you also metaphorically kill your younger self?

6 hours ago, RumHam said:

I don't even think that would help, he did flat out lie about Khan several times. 

Yeah, he could even genuinely think he knows who it is and the next director could have it be someone else. That's what happens when you don't actually provide any clues in the film itself.

3 hours ago, Astromech said:

It just sounds like clickbait to me. JJ is trolling as he usually does.

I'm surprised he didn't say the blu-ray (out now folks) doesn't have more info regarding this. Who's Finn and Poe Dameron's parents? I'm guessing Mr and Mrs Dameron in one case. Who's the evil ginger guy's parents? It's odd that the fixation is on Rey's parentage. Especially compared to Finn who I'd say was the joint lead and is also an orphan. Could it be to do with people's obsession/disgust at her being powerful with the Force? If so, I really hope her dad isn't a Force-user because the conclusion then could be "oh, it makes sense now - her dad was super awesome.

[ab aeterno]

3 minutes ago, red snow said:

I'm surprised he didn't say the blu-ray (out now folks) doesn't have more info regarding this. Who's Finn and Poe Dameron's parents? I'm guessing Mr and Mrs Dameron in one case. Who's the evil ginger guy's parents? It's odd that the fixation is on Rey's parentage. Especially compared to Finn who I'd say was the joint lead and is also an orphan. Could it be to do with people's obsession/disgust at her being powerful with the Force? If so, I really hope her dad isn't a Force-user because the conclusion then could be "oh, it makes sense now - her dad was super awesome.

I think it's because people suspect she's a child of Luke, Leia or Obi-Wan's kid. Especially since Kathleen Kennedy said that this was still a series about the Skywalker family.

Given what little Finn tells us about his parents, it doesn't seem likely that they're anyone of consequence. 

Rey's parents however, or whoever left her in Jakku, are raised in the movie as a significant mystery. Along with why Ren seems to know who she is.