Star Wars Episode VIII: The Force Rolls out of Bed and Stretches [Ep VII Spoilers]

[Myrddin]

Luke flying an X Wing in space combat with only having experience with flying a Skyhopper in atmosphere shooting womprats is akin to a cropdusting pilot climbing into a F-22 and flying undefeated against trained pilots.

Force trumps all.

[Kalbear]

1 hour ago, Myrddin said:

Luke flying an X Wing in space combat with only having experience with flying a Skyhopper in atmosphere shooting womprats is akin to a cropdusting pilot climbing into a F-22 and flying undefeated against trained pilots.

Force trumps all.

Are you kidding? Womprats are fucking badass. If anything he was way overqualified.

[Slurktan]

3 hours ago, Myrddin said:

Luke flying an X Wing in space combat with only having experience with flying a Skyhopper in atmosphere shooting womprats is akin to a cropdusting pilot climbing into a F-22 and flying undefeated against trained pilots.

Force trumps all.

Well at least its consistent in that he knows how to fly well but doesn't really know how to use the guns.  The first time he shoots he almost kills himself cause he has no idea what he's doing and shoots the surface and flies right next to it.  The second time Obi Wan tells him to concentrate so he randomnly shoots the surface but stays away this time.  The third time (and only) kill is when the tie fighter is in an extended chase of Biggs, Luke comes from behind and waits for the computer to tell him to shoot (as would a trained monkey). That's it.

You are honestly comparing that to Rey knowing how to do everything immediately with having no practice of any sort?

[Kalbear]

8 minutes ago, Slurktan said:

You are honestly comparing that to Rey knowing how to do everything immediately with having no practice of any sort?

But...she doesn't. When she starts the Falcon crashes into the dirt and flies sideways. She can't turn on the shields. She has to use her knowledge of the junkyards to gain any kind of advantage. 

And then, afterwards, she specifically tells Finn "I have NO IDEA HOW I DID THAT!"

Luke, meanwhile, turns off all targeting computers and guidance systems in a spaceship flying at multiple thousands of miles per hour through a trench in order to shoot a weapon of mass destruction into a hole 3 meters across. Because a voice told him to.

[Raja]

3 hours ago, Korvín-Corvinus said:

I would say that all also falls in the category of deliberate call backs to the original trilogy. Even the storm troopers could have had completely different gear if they wanted to go that route. I suppose they could have gone completely different with all these designs, but in a way, there was also consistency within the universe. Storm trooper design, star destroyer design, even X-wing design all started in the Clone Wars. 20 years later there are updates on all these designs. 30 years later, again updates. 

I think you misunderstand what I meant, I'm fine with storm troppers, x wings having the same design - that makes sense. But there was nothing else that looked every slightly new in terms of locations or even some newer ships? I think Rey's bike is the only thing we get. 

[Kalbear]

1 minute ago, Raja said:

I think you misunderstand what I meant, I'm fine with storm troppers, x wings having the same design - that makes sense. But there was nothing else that looked every slightly new in terms of locations or even some newer ships? I think Rey's bike is the only thing we get. 

Yeah, this was a bit disappointing. There's a little bit more in the extended deleted scenes, but this was something Lucas complained about too - that we didn't get a lot of amazing "newness' to it. We didn't get new cool worlds - we got another desert, we got another rebel base, we got another snowy place and we got another Death Star. The vehicles were largely evolutions of what we've seen, and we didn't even see evolutions of A-wings or B-wings or TIE interceptors. The coolest place was Luke's hiding spot. We got a fairly boring shuttle craft (two actually - Leia and Ren's) and a couple of nonmilitary land vehicles. 

I do think that this was also deliberate, but it's a bummer. I definitely miss this when looking for cool toys to buy for my kids and myself. 

[Corvinus85]

9 minutes ago, Raja said:

I think you misunderstand what I meant, I'm fine with storm troppers, x wings having the same design - that makes sense. But there was nothing else that looked every slightly new in terms of locations or even some newer ships? I think Rey's bike is the only thing we get. 

The big freighter that Han has, and the weird looking ship that Leia uses. Also we got a castle of sorts. And while we got yet another desert planet, the ship graveyard was a nice touch to differentiate it from what we got before. But I get your point.

[Corvinus85]

I know that Starkiller is one of the weaker points of the film, but my most recent viewing of the film (a couple of months ago) reminded me of a difference that I liked between TFA and ANH. When Alderaan is destroyed, besides Leia's somewhat despairing reaction, the most powerful reaction we get is from Obi-Wan with the iconic line he delivers. On the other hand, when the Hosnian system is destroyed, we don't have a trained Jedi on hand to give us a sense of the tragedy that occurred (no doubt Luke felt it), but we actually get a first hand account of the horror (the voices crying out and then silence) when we get a glimpse of the people on Hosnian Prime. Say what you will about the use of Starkiller, but I thought that part was well done.

[felice]

11 hours ago, Stannis Eats No Peaches said:

We see that it's Plutt she's left with in that flashback. Also he's the owner of the Falcon and through dialogue it's made pretty clear that Rey has worked on the ship and is familiar with it. She may not have flown it before but she's definitely maintained it.

That's all after she steals the Falcon, though, and it jars with what we see beforehand.

2 hours ago, Kalbear said:

Luke, meanwhile, turns off all targeting computers and guidance systems in a spaceship flying at multiple thousands of miles per hour through a trench in order to shoot a weapon of mass destruction into a hole 3 meters across.

Just like Beggar's Canyon back home. And aim and timing are what the Force is best at; that's established with the blind lightsaber training on the Falcon.

2 hours ago, Korvín-Corvinus said:

when the Hosnian system is destroyed, we don't have a trained Jedi on hand to give us a sense of the tragedy that occurred (no doubt Luke felt it), but we actually get a first hand account of the horror (the voices crying out and then silence) when we get a glimpse of the people on Hosnian Prime. Say what you will about the use of Starkiller, but I thought that part was well done.

It would have been better if there'd been any indication of the significance of Hosnian Prime or if we knew who any of the people there were, though. Alderaan is both Leia's home (we can assume she lost a great many friends and family) and the place Luke & co are trying to get to, so its destruction matters to the film. Hosnian's destruction might be relevant in the sequels, but as far as Force Awakens goes, it could have been any random planet.

[Kalbear]

Quote

Just like Beggar's Canyon back home. And aim and timing are what the Force is best at; that's established with the blind lightsaber training on the Falcon.

Which...is precisely what Rey does with the Falcon to blow up the last TIE fighter, no?

[Corvinus85]

1 hour ago, felice said:

It would have been better if there'd been any indication of the significance of Hosnian Prime or if we knew who any of the people there were, though. Alderaan is both Leia's home (we can assume she lost a great many friends and family) and the place Luke & co are trying to get to, so its destruction matters to the film. Hosnian's destruction might be relevant in the sequels, but as far as Force Awakens goes, it could have been any random planet.

It was clearly stated by Hux that it was the seat of the Republic government. 

But yes, they shouldn't have cut out the scene where Leia sends her envoy to the Senate. I believe the envoy is the woman we see at the front of the crowd in that scene.

[Astromech]

5 hours ago, Raja said:

I think you misunderstand what I meant, I'm fine with storm troppers, x wings having the same design - that makes sense. But there was nothing else that looked every slightly new in terms of locations or even some newer ships? I think Rey's bike is the only thing we get. 

You didn't like the Finalizer, Kylo Ren's shuttle, the First Order Transporter, the updated X wings and Tie Fighters? While Jakku was all-too-similar to Tatooine, the Starkiller Base world looked different and so did the location on Skellig Michael. While TFA didn't bring the loads of new worlds, vehicles, etc. that were added in the prequels and cartoons, I was pleased with the new additions and updates to existing vehicles.

[Mr. X]

7 hours ago, Kalbear said:

Are you kidding? Womprats are fucking badass. If anything he was way overqualified.

Are womprats a souped-up, intergalactic form of a wombat? That is totally badass.

 

 

If they are anything else, please don't tell me. Let me cling to my dream of interstellar wombats.

[Jace, Extat]

8 hours ago, Kalbear said:

Yeah, this was a bit disappointing. There's a little bit more in the extended deleted scenes, but this was something Lucas complained about too - that we didn't get a lot of amazing "newness' to it. We didn't get new cool worlds - we got another desert, we got another rebel base, we got another snowy place and we got another Death Star. The vehicles were largely evolutions of what we've seen, and we didn't even see evolutions of A-wings or B-wings or TIE interceptors. The coolest place was Luke's hiding spot. We got a fairly boring shuttle craft (two actually - Leia and Ren's) and a couple of nonmilitary land vehicles. 

I do think that this was also deliberate, but it's a bummer. I definitely miss this when looking for cool toys to buy for my kids and myself. 

I actually think Ren's ship is pretty fucking cool.

[Raja]

9 minutes ago, Pony Queen Jace said:

I actually think Ren's ship is pretty fucking cool.

Unfortunately, it looks almost exactly like the emperor's ship from episode 5/6 ( except for a bit of change with the wings) 

[Jace, Extat]

1 minute ago, Raja said:

Unfortunately, it looks almost exactly like the emperor's ship from episode 5/6 ( except for a bit of change with the wings) 

Yeah, he's a wannabe. It's also totally dope.

[Raja]

3 hours ago, Astromech said:

You didn't like the Finalizer, Kylo Ren's shuttle, the First Order Transporter, the updated X wings and Tie Fighters? While Jakku was all-too-similar to Tatooine, the Starkiller Base world looked different and so did the location on Skellig Michael. While TFA didn't bring the loads of new worlds, vehicles, etc. that were added in the prequels and cartoons, I was pleased with the new additions and updates to existing vehicles.

Which transporter are you talking about? The ones the storm troopers use to come to Jakku? I don't remember what that looks like, to be quite honest with you. I just felt that the prequels showed a level of creativity that wasn't there in TFA. The 'finalizer' ( that's a hilarious name for a ship) isn't too different from the emperor's ship - as I've mentioned before. With the X wings and tie fighters, there isn't much there, at least for me. 

[felice]

6 hours ago, Kalbear said:

Which...is precisely what Rey does with the Falcon to blow up the last TIE fighter, no?

Yes, and I don't have a problem with that. If she has the knowledge to fly a ship at all, I'd expect her to do it well. Luke is established as having a high opinion of his own piloting skills early on, and he's a middle-class farmboy with a ship of his own, and the opportunity to learn and practise. But Rey's depicted as having spent most of her life scavenging scrap to trade for food, and the revelation that she's also been trained as a pilot and a mechanic comes across as rather incongruous.

4 hours ago, Korvín-Corvinus said:

It was clearly stated by Hux that it was the seat of the Republic government.

The Republic government played no part whatsoever in the film, though...

45 minutes ago, Pony Queen Jace said:

I actually think Ren's ship is pretty fucking cool.

It's not bad at all, no.

[Myrddin]

18 hours ago, Slurktan said:

You are honestly comparing that to Rey knowing how to do everything immediately with having no practice of any sort?

Yes.

A T-16 Skyhopper is to an X-Wing what a Cessna is to a F-22. Flying one really doesn't prepare you to fly the other.

But you know what? That never bothered me when watching Star Wars over the last 38 years. And it didn't bother me when Rey flew the Falcon either. It's a movie. If they had slowed down the movie for her to have a flight training montage (or to show Luke get training on an X-Wing), then we'd all be complaining about that.

[Astromech]

13 hours ago, Raja said:

Which transporter are you talking about? The ones the storm troopers use to come to Jakku? I don't remember what that looks like, to be quite honest with you. I just felt that the prequels showed a level of creativity that wasn't there in TFA. The 'finalizer' ( that's a hilarious name for a ship) isn't too different from the emperor's ship - as I've mentioned before. With the X wings and tie fighters, there isn't much there, at least for me. 

Yeah, that one. The prequels spoiled us as far as shiny new things go. Lucas loves his merchandising. I agree that the prequels had an amazing amount of new things added (the Dooku's Solar Sailer is my fave). Too bad they seemed to spend more time on that than the writing. I'm confident we'll get more with the next two films in the trilogy and the additional films. I personally loved the upgraded designs of the old ships.