Ok Ladies, Robert or Rhaegar?

[Wall Flower]

7 minutes ago, Jon's Queen Consort said:

 

I don't know why this was so funny and at this point I am afraid to ask.

How can we know that?

Well, I don't think Oberyn is perfect - I didn't like the way he hit the mother of one of his daughters and stole her child. However, he is in a long-term loving relationship with Ellaria and she seems to be the mother of all his younger daughters. Oberyn does get points for caring for the results of his liaisons. Oberyn and Ellaria seem to have an open relationship in the true meaning of the term, where both parties are able to experiment outside the partnership (although I get the feeling it's more a case of inviting people in).

As for Robert and Rhaegar, I don't think either of them are ideal husbands. If I was choosing a husband in Westeros, I would go for Ned Stark, Jon Snow or Sam Tarly (as long as I didn't have to visit my arsehole father in law). 

 

 

[Jon's Queen Consort]

Just now, Wall Flower said:

Well, I don't think Oberyn is perfect - I didn't like the way he hit the mother of one of his daughters and stole her child. However, he is in a long-term loving relationship with Ellaria and she seems to be the mother of all his younger daughters. Oberyn does get points for caring for the results of his liaisons. Oberyn and Ellaria seem to have an open relationship in the true meaning of the term, where both parties are able to experiment outside the partnership (although I get the feeling it's more a case of inviting people in).

I agree. What I mean is that we cannot compare Robert with Oberyn because one was in an loveless relationship and the other was in a loving relationship, one had Cersei and the other Ellaria, one was chronically depressed and the other wasn't.

[devilish]

On 01/02/2016 at 5:36 PM, DigUpHerBones said:

It is 281, just after Tourney at Harrenhal, immediately after you were named Queen of Love and Beauty, you are in Lyanna Stark's corset...

But this time the choice is YOURS (maybe it was all along, probably was, but we do not KNOW for sure, yet).

And also this time, hindsight is 20/20.

You know what happens to the Kingdom if you leave with Rhaegar.

You also can see your future life with Robert (saying he never usurped the throne) But you are able to "see" the fury on the Trident that day if you did leave with Rhaegar, and what Robert was willing to do.

You know Rhaegar is a little flaky, he is after all a married Crown Prince and has a severe case of depression and you know you might end up on a pyre if you do not produce male heirs.  But you also know he is a super, super decent human being.

You also know Robert will NEVER be faithful, and cause quite some embarrassment to you and your family when he has 50 bastards running around.

The choice is yours.

 

Rhaegar.

Rickard got it wrong. He cant raise a girl to be independent only to have her marry a brute she doesn't love and who would cuckold her at every occasion. Both Rickard and Tywin learnt that the wrong way. 

[redtree]

It doesn't matter how pretty or "decent" any married guy is, once he hit me his values would plunge to the ground. Especially the one whose wife has just given birth and do this proclamation in front of public, i wouldn't be flattered i'd be ashamed and angry. Sleazebag

[Orphalesion]

4 hours ago, Jon's Queen Consort said:

I agree. What I mean is that we cannot compare Robert with Oberyn because one was in an loveless relationship and the other was in a loving relationship, one had Cersei and the other Ellaria, one was chronically depressed and the other wasn't.

Doesn't change the fact that one seemed a desirable mate and the other not. And I don't think it was Cersei that ruined Robert (just as little as Robert ruined Cersei)

It's not just old, fat Robert that seems undesirable to me, young Robert doesn't sound much better. He sounds like a frat bro.

It's been a while since I read book one, but I can't really recall Robert having made an attempt to make it work with Cersei, did anybody state so to Ned or something? Cause I can't recall (i really can't) and it would surprise me.

[Laughing Storm Reborn]

"Yes," Septa Scolera echoed, "and you must feel so much lighter now, clean and innocent as a maid on the morning of her wedding."
I fucked Jaime on the morning of my wedding, the queen recalled. "I do," she said, "I feel reborn, as if a festering boil has been lanced and now at last I can begin to heal. I could almost fly."

"My late husband loved the forest too." In the early years of their marriage, Robert was forever imploring her to hunt with him, but Cersei had always begged off. His hunting trips allowed her time with Jaime. Golden days and silver nights.

Joffrey had never had a close friend of his own age, that she recalled. The poor boy was always alone. I had Jaime when I was a child . . . and Melara, until she fell into the well. Joff had been fond of the Hound, to be sure, but that was not friendship. He was looking for the father he never found in Robert.

Just some jewels to keep the wheels moving...

[BricksAndSparrows]

Well ladies, one's going to cheat on you then get fat, and the other is going to cheat on you then die...

So...

[UnViserion]

On 6/18/2016 at 5:28 PM, Jon's Queen Consort said:

You cannot know that. After all didn't Rhaegar eloped with her after only looking her during TTOHH?

Because Rhaegar wasn't? You know he was married and he was cheating on his wife with Lyanna and we all know that once a cheater always a cheater. How can someone trust a man who abandoned his wife who just gave birth and almost died?

Lyanna is a hypocrite. Yes Robert did had a bastard but he wasn't married when he had it, on the other hand Rhaegar eloped with Lyanna when he was married, already had a daughter and his wife almost died giving birth to a son. Which is worse; having a child when being single or eloping while being married with a woman who almost died and father of two?

Yup-- all of this. 

[wolfmaid7]

On 6/19/2016 at 6:45 PM, The Wolves said:

Oberyn seems like he would care about your needs. Plus he shared and was creative  

Robert just laid on top of women, fat and stinking being a selfish person caring about his pleasure.  

So Oberyn. 

Noooooo he laid ontop of Cersie stinking of wine.

Was he selfish and uncaring person when he had his own Maester heal Barristan Selmy.Was he selfish when Bran fell and he stayed up all night with Ned.

Robert is very flawed but honestly he is one of the best written characters in this story.

12 hours ago, Orphalesion said:

From what little we've have seen of him. I doubt he'd hurt Ellia. Perhaps I should have said "he cares about people he's in a relationship with"

Ellia was cut from the same cloth as him...That being the point.

12 hours ago, Jon's Queen Consort said:

Or he loves. Robert was in a relationship with Cersei and he even tried to make the marriage to work, but he didn't loved her. 

That's it right there.

12 hours ago, Wall Flower said:

Well, I don't think Oberyn is perfect - I didn't like the way he hit the mother of one of his daughters and stole her child. However, he is in a long-term loving relationship with Ellaria and she seems to be the mother of all his younger daughters. Oberyn does get points for caring for the results of his liaisons. Oberyn and Ellaria seem to have an open relationship in the true meaning of the term, where both parties are able to experiment outside the partnership (although I get the feeling it's more a case of inviting people in).

As for Robert and Rhaegar, I don't think either of them are ideal husbands. If I was choosing a husband in Westeros, I would go for Ned Stark, Jon Snow or Sam Tarly (as long as I didn't have to visit my arsehole father in law). 

 

 

As i said i was confused on why Oberyn would be picked seeing as there are stark differences and similarities.There seemed to be reasons people dismiss Robert as a suitable mate existing in a possible relationship with Oberyn that made me take a step back.What Oberyn and Elia had going for them was that they were compatible.

As for Robert and Rhaegar...I can't judge Robert for something he "may or may not" do which is likely based on the mate he was with.Robert was an unmarried man in his prime and within his right as a man of that time to eff anything that walked through the door and slowed down.However,Robert only ever cheated on one woman and that was Cersie and that was because- and this is Robert's own words -paraphrasing.

"Cersie guarded her cunt as if it had all the gold in Casterly rock in it" She couldn't get over Robert calling out Lyanna's name on their wedding night.She screwed Jamie the morning of their wedding so don't feel sorry for her.

If anything speculated about Rhaegar is true i'm sorry there's only two choices he's a rapist or an adulterer.If of these reasons were done because of prophecy he's a prime canidate for me running the other way......Fast.

Cersie also said she was never going to forgive Robert for killing the man she thought she would be with.Clearly these noble women had a type.We hear it in the stories they told themselves about what beauty was.Wildling men stole women all the time but its not seen as romatic because of how they were viewed. Violent, unwashed barbarians a prince supossedly does it and its romantico. For in their deluded sense of romance and this also goes for alot of readers....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ZPlxFfnEPI

"Who could ever learn to love a beast"

 

11 hours ago, devilish said:

Rhaegar.

Rickard got it wrong. He cant raise a girl to be independent only to have her marry a brute she doesn't love and who would cuckold her at every occasion. Both Rickard and Tywin learnt that the wrong way. 

We don't know,being with Lyanna and being with Cersie two different things.Robert told Ned he wants a few things to be happy.

To ride and feel the wind blowing in his hair,to hunt and to have a woman squealing in his bed.He married a woman who cared for neither of these things.

7 hours ago, Orphalesion said:

Doesn't change the fact that one seemed a desirable mate and the other not. And I don't think it was Cersei that ruined Robert (just as little as Robert ruined Cersei)

It's not just old, fat Robert that seems undesirable to me, young Robert doesn't sound much better. He sounds like a frat bro.

It's been a while since I read book one, but I can't really recall Robert having made an attempt to make it work with Cersei, did anybody state so to Ned or something? Cause I can't recall (i really can't) and it would surprise me.

Yeah he did,he wanted to take her hunting and she would put him off to be with the brother she effed the morning of their marriage.Additionally,Cersie's pride was hurt because Robert called out Lyanna on their wedding night.Robert said of Cersie:

Oh, Cersei is lovely to look at, truly, but cold . . . the way she guards her cunt, you'd think she had all the gold of Casterly Rock between her legs."

and 

"My late husband loved the forest too." In the early years of their marriage, Robert was forever imploring her to hunt with him, but Cersei had always begged off. His hunting trips allowed her time with Jaime. Golden days and silver nights.

Weren't concerned with Robert's  interest which he wanted to share and experiance with her and withheld her pussy from him....

 

Yeah she was going to get cheated on...Not that Cersie cared her love was Jamie.

[devilish]

1 hour ago, wolfmaid7 said:

Noooooo he laid ontop of Cersie stinking of wine.

Was he selfish and uncaring person when he had his own Maester heal Barristan Selmy.Was he selfish when Bran fell and he stayed up all night with Ned.

Robert is very flawed but honestly he is one of the best written characters in this story.

Ellia was cut from the same cloth as him...That being the point.

That's it right there.

As i said i was confused on why Oberyn would be picked seeing as there are stark differences and similarities.There seemed to be reasons people dismiss Robert as a suitable mate existing in a possible relationship with Oberyn that made me take a step back.What Oberyn and Elia had going for them was that they were compatible.

As for Robert and Rhaegar...I can't judge Robert for something he "may or may not" do which is likely based on the mate he was with.Robert was an unmarried man in his prime and within his right as a man of that time to eff anything that walked through the door and slowed down.However,Robert only ever cheated on one woman and that was Cersie and that was because- and this is Robert's own words -paraphrasing.

"Cersie guarded her cunt as if it had all the gold in Casterly rock in it" She couldn't get over Robert calling out Lyanna's name on their wedding night.She screwed Jamie the morning of their wedding so don't feel sorry for her.

If anything speculated about Rhaegar is true i'm sorry there's only two choices he's a rapist or an adulterer.If of these reasons were done because of prophecy he's a prime canidate for me running the other way......Fast.

Cersie also said she was never going to forgive Robert for killing the man she thought she would be with.Clearly these noble women had a type.We hear it in the stories they told themselves about what beauty was.Wildling men stole women all the time but its not seen as romatic because of how they were viewed. Violent, unwashed barbarians a prince supossedly does it and its romantico. For in their deluded sense of romance and this also goes for alot of readers....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ZPlxFfnEPI

"Who could ever learn to love a beast"

 

We don't know,being with Lyanna and being with Cersie two different things.Robert told Ned he wants a few things to be happy.

To ride and feel the wind blowing in his hair,to hunt and to have a woman squealing in his bed.He married a woman who cared for neither of these things.

Yeah he did,he wanted to take her hunting and she would put him off to be with the brother she effed the morning of their marriage.Additionally,Cersie's pride was hurt because Robert called out Lyanna on their wedding night.Robert said of Cersie:

Oh, Cersei is lovely to look at, truly, but cold . . . the way she guards her cunt, you'd think she had all the gold of Casterly Rock between her legs."

and 

"My late husband loved the forest too." In the early years of their marriage, Robert was forever imploring her to hunt with him, but Cersei had always begged off. His hunting trips allowed her time with Jaime. Golden days and silver nights.

Weren't concerned with Robert's  interest which he wanted to share and experiance with her and withheld her pussy from him....

 

Yeah she was going to get cheated on...Not that Cersie cared her love was Jamie.

Its seems that hunting wasn't the only thing Lyanna cared about. Else she would have chosen him instead of Rhaegar. She was a sensitive girl who was reduced to tears by Rhaegar's music. Can you imagine Robert doing the same thing?

Also Lyanna was concerned about Robert's infidelity, something he shared with Eddard. I shiver at the thought of what would happen if a married Robert did a Stannis wedding thing (ie he soiled the groom's wedding bed and deflowered another girl) with Brandon around

[DanaKz]

Robert, hands down.

1000 whores are better than one "beloved lover". 1000 whores are nothing, but when your husband is pining after one girl exhausting you everyday by waxing poetic to her... I would be like "OMG, go and fuck some cunt already and stop raping this poor harp"

[Jon's Queen Consort]

20 hours ago, Orphalesion said:

Doesn't change the fact that one seemed a desirable mate and the other not. And I don't think it was Cersei that ruined Robert (just as little as Robert ruined Cersei)

According to who? I mean who can say who is a desirable mate and who isn't. Also I don't believe that Robert ruined Cersei at all.

20 hours ago, Orphalesion said:

It's not just old, fat Robert that seems undesirable to me, young Robert doesn't sound much better. He sounds like a frat bro.

And the magic word here is to you. To me no matter how he would look like a married man who abandoned his wife who almost died giving birth isn't even at the bottom of the  "Desirable list"

20 hours ago, Orphalesion said:

It's been a while since I read book one, but I can't really recall Robert having made an attempt to make it work with Cersei, did anybody state so to Ned or something? Cause I can't recall (i really can't) and it would surprise me.

Cersei herself had told it; 

Quote

In the early years of their marriage, Robert was forever imploring her to hunt with him, but Cersei had always begged off. His hunting trips allowed her time with Jaime.

In his ways he tried to make the marriage work.

12 hours ago, wolfmaid7 said:

Was he selfish and uncaring person when he had his own Maester heal Barristan Selmy.Was he selfish when Bran fell and he stayed up all night with Ned.

Robert is very flawed but honestly he is one of the best written characters in this story.

Agree. He may was flawed and when we see him chronically depressed, something that Rhaegar's fans chose not to see, and yet he managed to be a good man. If he wasn't the Stormlanders who didn't followed him would had the same fate with Hoster's bannermen who didn't follow him, sword and fire, if he wasn't a good man the IronIsles will have the fate that rebels had under Tywin's rule.  I cannot understand why people keep thinking that alcohol or sex make someone a bad person. Eff it I know why because they are hypocrites.

12 hours ago, wolfmaid7 said:

That's it right there.

I love how people dismiss Robert's love because he "didn't knew Lyanna" but claim loved her and that is why he eloped her when they only met during a Tourney.

[BricksAndSparrows]

I think this IS a tough question (it's not just about screwing, right?)

There is a HUGE missing factor in our measure of Rhaegar: How did Lyanna feel about the whole thing? Was Rhaegar keeping her locked up and raping her, trying to breed some magic prophecy baby? Or did she love him and go willingly. The men hidden behind those answers are very different from one another.

[wolfmaid7]

20 hours ago, devilish said:

Its seems that hunting wasn't the only thing Lyanna cared about. Else she would have chosen him instead of Rhaegar. She was a sensitive girl who was reduced to tears by Rhaegar's music. Can you imagine Robert doing the same thing?

Also Lyanna was concerned about Robert's infidelity, something he shared with Eddard. I shiver at the thought of what would happen if a married Robert did a Stannis wedding thing (ie he soiled the groom's wedding bed and deflowered another girl) with Brandon around

Who said she chose Rhaegar? Where did that come from? I don't subcribe to Rhaegar having anything to do with Lyanna's disapprearance at all.Or more specifically i don't think she was "missing" 

Here's the thing with Rhaegar and his songs..To quote JonCon every girl who heard Rhaegar sing cried.Alot of them probably wanted to drop their draws and heal his hurts(whatever the frack Cersie was thinking about with that statement).The point i'm making is Lyanna wasn't unique in crying over Rhaegar's tears.I cry every time hear "Stuck in the moment" but i don't wanna drop my draws for Bono.

Yeah Lyanna was concerned about if Robert would only keep to one bed.No woman in their right mind wouldn't be concerned.Exactly what she said is exactly what she would have said.It is a concern she should have had logically.

But again, Lyanna and Cersie are two different people.Would Robert have cheated on Cersie if she fulfilled his needs.Probably not. The man wanted 3 simple things,ride,hunt and have a woman squealing in his bed..Was that too much to ask? Apparently for Cersie it was to much.

9 hours ago, Jon's Queen Consort said:

According to who? I mean who can say who is a desirable mate and who isn't. Also I don't believe that Robert ruined Cersei at all.

And the magic word here is to you. To me no matter how he would look like a married man who abandoned his wife who almost died giving birth isn't even at the bottom of the  "Desirable list"

Cersei herself had told it; 

In his ways he tried to make the marriage work.

Agree. He may was flawed and when we see him chronically depressed, something that Rhaegar's fans chose not to see, and yet he managed to be a good man. If he wasn't the Stormlanders who didn't followed him would had the same fate with Hoster's bannermen who didn't follow him, sword and fire, if he wasn't a good man the IronIsles will have the fate that rebels had under Tywin's rule.  I cannot understand why people keep thinking that alcohol or sex make someone a bad person. Eff it I know why because they are hypocrites.

I love how people dismiss Robert's love because he "didn't knew Lyanna" but claim loved her and that is why he eloped her when they only met during a Tourney.

Well said!

[Damon_Tor]

On 2/1/2016 at 9:36 AM, DigUpHerBones said:

You also know Robert will NEVER be faithful, and cause quite some embarrassment to you and your family when he has 50 bastards running around

That's an assumption. Maybe Robert was driven to cheat by having to marry a woman he hated, a woman who hated him right back.

[Alaynsa Starne]

Robert or Rhaegar? Wat? Barristan or bust. 

[BRANDON GREYSTARK]

Forget about the Cosporn  TV show Game of Thrones, IMHO if they knew nothing of them , most women would chose both .Pre Elia Rhaegar or pre Cercei Robert . Both are very handsome .Robert  is more gregarious while Rhaegar seems to be more sensitive . As a proud north man I am outraged , that you chose Oberyn Martell over Brandon Stark . Brandon Stark is handsome and he doesn't have any bastards running around ,he had 1 woman he was involved with and he told her , that he was betrothed to another woman.

[TheDemonicStark]

Rhaeger, because I can prevent the rebellion.

[HoodedCrow]

So the choice is marry an alcoholic piggish brute that I dislike, who will probably give me a backhand at any opposition, or die in childbirth having run off with a married man leaving  of my family members dead and a a hurting realm. tough. I think I'd run off to the gold companions and be a merc and maybe fall in love.

if nephew Bran told me through a tree that my child was needed to save the world, I may go with Raegars plan, not believing he and I would die.

[Hos the Hostage]

On 6/21/2016 at 10:25 PM, Damon_Tor said:

That's an assumption. Maybe Robert was driven to cheat by having to marry a woman he hated, a woman who hated him right back.

He fathered at least two bastards(Bella and Gendry - who was an age with Robb) while fighting for his 'true love', not to mention fucking all the whores in the Peach. At that time he was betrothed to Lyanna and not married to Cersei. His marriage with Cersei was indeed very detrimental, but in my opinion, sleeping around while leading a war for winning back Lyanna was cheating too.