Rhaenys_Targaryen

Small Questions v. 10105

2,072 posts in this topic

3 minutes ago, Jon Weirgaryen said:

We haven't learned that yet, and I doubt we will.

Thanks!  I figured if we didn't know by now or at least have enough clues to guess then it probably wasn't important.  Just couldn't remember. 

Edited by DarkSister1001
Forgot to say thanks.

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I'm wondering if someone could do a dream interpretation foe me?  

End of Jon VI in SoS, Jon has returned to CB, is wounded, and receives milk of the poppy from Aemon. He has this dream: 

When the dreams took him, he found himself back home once more, splashing in the hot pools beneath a huge white weirwood that had his father’s face. Ygritte was with him, laughing at him, shedding her skins till she was naked as her name day, trying to kiss him, but he couldn’t, not with his father watching. He was the blood of Winterfell, a man of the Night’s Watch. I will not father a bastard, he told her. I will not. I will not. “You know nothing, Jon Snow,” she whispered, her skin dissolving in the hot water, the flesh beneath sloughing off her bones until only skull and skeleton remained, and the pool bubbled thick and red.

Thanks in advance! 

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4 hours ago, DarkSister1001 said:

Do we ever find out which person physically put the box with the Myrish lens and compartment hiding Lysa's letter to Catelyn way back in GoT?  I know it was Littlefinger's doing and it was someone that came to WF with King Robert and her entorage.  But I can't recall who or how they did it. 

There was a thread on it a while back...

 

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15 minutes ago, OtherFromAnotherMother said:

I'm wondering if someone could do a dream interpretation foe me?  

End of Jon VI in SoS, Jon has returned to CB, is wounded, and receives milk of the poppy from Aemon. He has this dream: 

When the dreams took him, he found himself back home once more, splashing in the hot pools beneath a huge white weirwood that had his father’s face. Ygritte was with him, laughing at him, shedding her skins till she was naked as her name day, trying to kiss him, but he couldn’t, not with his father watching. He was the blood of Winterfell, a man of the Night’s Watch. I will not father a bastard, he told her. I will not. I will not. “You know nothing, Jon Snow,” she whispered, her skin dissolving in the hot water, the flesh beneath sloughing off her bones until only skull and skeleton remained, and the pool bubbled thick and red.

Thanks in advance! 

Foreshadowing the shadow baby Jon is going to give Melisandre? 

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Can someone tell me how do crows find their way to castles? And were there crows that did the same in real life?

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3 hours ago, 7-KG said:

Can someone tell me how do crows find their way to castles? And were there crows that did the same in real life?

The Wikipedia page on Homing pigeons may be useful to you

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Do we know what happens to the warg's real body as they are in another human or animal? For instance... when Bran slips in to Hodor's mind, is Bran's own body just sitting motionless against a tree trunk (or whatever). I assume a warg cannot communicate/function as normal while in two bodies at once?

I can't seem to find any clue with Varamyr. I am thinking there was a quick description with Orell, but I may not be using the right key words.

You have my continued thanks.

 

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21 hours ago, Rhaenys_Targaryen said:

The KG swear an oath to protect their king and serve their king for as long as they'll live. Their position as KG, at least until Cersei got involved, was for life. So walking away, will mean exile, and should such a KG be caught, he'd presumably be severily punished, and execution then indeed becomes a possibility.

Thanks!

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9 hours ago, The Fattest Leech said:

Do we know what happens to the warg's real body as they are in another human or animal? For instance... when Bran slips in to Hodor's mind, is Bran's own body just sitting motionless against a tree trunk (or whatever). I assume a warg cannot communicate/function as normal while in two bodies at once?

I can't seem to find any clue with Varamyr. I am thinking there was a quick description with Orell, but I may not be using the right key words.

You have my continued thanks.

 

“Summer was snarling and snapping as he danced around the closest, a great ruin of a man wreathed in swirling flame. He shouldn’t get so close, what is he doing? Then he saw himself, sprawled facedown in the snow. Summer was trying to drive the thing away from him. What will happen if it kills me? the boy wondered. Will I be Hodor for good or all? Will I go back into Summer’s skin? Or will I just be dead?”
There are other examples, but this would suggest you are correct. Bran is unable to move at all while he is Hodor (I know he is paralysed, but he had been crawling before this). I would probably describe it as his awareness transferring from one body to another, so his automatic bodily functions still work (breathing etc) but things like movement, eating and such require his presence. Meera and Jojen remark on this slightly in a Storm of Swords, when they say Bran spends too much time in Summer and needs to eat as a human too.

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3 hours ago, HelenaExMachina said:

“Summer was snarling and snapping as he danced around the closest, a great ruin of a man wreathed in swirling flame. He shouldn’t get so close, what is he doing? Then he saw himself, sprawled facedown in the snow. Summer was trying to drive the thing away from him. What will happen if it kills me? the boy wondered. Will I be Hodor for good or all? Will I go back into Summer’s skin? Or will I just be dead?”
There are other examples, but this would suggest you are correct. Bran is unable to move at all while he is Hodor (I know he is paralysed, but he had been crawling before this). I would probably describe it as his awareness transferring from one body to another, so his automatic bodily functions still work (breathing etc) but things like movement, eating and such require his presence. Meera and Jojen remark on this slightly in a Storm of Swords, when they say Bran spends too much time in Summer and needs to eat as a human too.

Thank you! I must have been using the wrong mix of key words to find this.

For some reason the last few days my electronics and internet devices have not been working so well and the search site has been doing weird things or not working at all. I think it is fate telling me to focus on my own writing instead of ASOIAF so much. I need to find a muzzle for that bitch! ^_^

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4 hours ago, HelenaExMachina said:

“Summer was snarling and snapping as he danced around the closest, a great ruin of a man wreathed in swirling flame. He shouldn’t get so close, what is he doing? Then he saw himself, sprawled facedown in the snow. Summer was trying to drive the thing away from him. What will happen if it kills me? the boy wondered. Will I be Hodor for good or all? Will I go back into Summer’s skin? Or will I just be dead?”
There are other examples, but this would suggest you are correct. Bran is unable to move at all while he is Hodor (I know he is paralysed, but he had been crawling before this). I would probably describe it as his awareness transferring from one body to another, so his automatic bodily functions still work (breathing etc) but things like movement, eating and such require his presence. Meera and Jojen remark on this slightly in a Storm of Swords, when they say Bran spends too much time in Summer and needs to eat as a human too.

There is another example, and it may be an elective thing that Bran has not figured out, yet.  When Arya is blind and she is attacked with a stick, she uses the vision of a cat (felines are supposed to be the most difficult to warg) to see the attacks while she physically responds to the attacks. 

Edited by MtnLion
clarity

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On 3/1/2016 at 10:49 AM, DarkSister1001 said:

 

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4 hours ago, HelenaExMachina said:

“Summer was snarling and snapping as he danced around the closest, a great ruin of a man wreathed in swirling flame. He shouldn’t get so close, what is he doing? Then he saw himself, sprawled facedown in the snow. Summer was trying to drive the thing away from him. What will happen if it kills me? the boy wondered. Will I be Hodor for good or all? Will I go back into Summer’s skin? Or will I just be dead?”
There are other examples, but this would suggest you are correct. Bran is unable to move at all while he is Hodor (I know he is paralysed, but he had been crawling before this). I would probably describe it as his awareness transferring from one body to another, so his automatic bodily functions still work (breathing etc) but things like movement, eating and such require his presence. Meera and Jojen remark on this slightly in a Storm of Swords, when they say Bran spends too much time in Summer and needs to eat as a human too.

Yet Varamyr was able to control several beasts at once, wasn't he? And Arya was able to observe the Kindly Man whack in her. At the time he was whack in her, I don't believe she was in a trance or sprawled on the floor. (OMG can you imagine the theories we'd have if Arya were "sprawled" on the floor?)

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So, clearly we need a Handbook for the Recently Warged. I guess it depends on the warger/skinchanger and their own abilities? I wonder why Bran just lays there (lies there?) in the snow? Oh well. My idea bubble has been popped regardless.

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Just now, The Fattest Leech said:

So, clearly we need a Handbook for the Recently Warged. I guess it depends on the warger/skinchanger and their own abilities? I wonder why Bran just lays there (lies there?) in the snow? Oh well. My idea bubble has been popped regardless.

He's younger than Arya,  and he hasn't been tutored sufficiently yet, I guess...

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2 minutes ago, The Fattest Leech said:

So, clearly we need a Handbook for the Recently Warged. I guess it depends on the warger/skinchanger and their own abilities? I wonder why Bran just lays there (lies there?) in the snow? Oh well. My idea bubble has been popped regardless.

 

Just now, Lost Melnibonean said:

He's younger than Arya,  and he hasn't been tutored sufficiently yet, I guess...

Perhaps it's because he's 1) Paralyzed from the waist down and thus lacks full mobility. 2) Fully warging Hodor, a human, while Arya seems to only be borrowing the cat's eyes in a partial skinchange. Bran has been training more than Arya, it wouldn't surprise me if Arya only slipped into the cat halfway due to inexperience (or instinct?) and thus retains control over her own body.

It seems Varamyr can use Orell's eagle and still speak:

Quote
"Aye," said Tormund, striding off.
The mousy little skinchanger closed his eyes and said, "I see them. They're coming along the streams and game trails . . ."
"Who?
Quote
"Banners," he heard Varamyr murmur, "I see golden banners, oh . . ." A mammoth lumbered by, trumpeting, a half-dozen bowmen in the wooden tower on its back. "The king . . . no . . ."
Then the skinchanger threw back his head and screamed.

From ASOS, Jon X.

What I'm getting at is that it seems likely that a skinchanger is able to enter another being only partially, to make use of its eyes for example, while simultaneously relaying information or reacting to events around themselves. And it might be easier to do so with trickier animals than to fully "enter" them immediately. Varamyr says "Once a horse is broken to the saddle, any man can mount him," and well, in order to break a horse into the saddle you start off small, only putting the saddle on for a little bit before getting on top of it yourself.

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6 minutes ago, Aniel said:

 

Perhaps it's because he's 1) Paralyzed from the waist down and thus lacks full mobility. 2) Fully warging Hodor, a human, while Arya seems to only be borrowing the cat's eyes in a partial skinchange. Bran has been training more than Arya, it wouldn't surprise me if Arya only slipped into the cat halfway due to inexperience (or instinct?) and thus retains control over her own body.

It seems Varamyr can use Orell's eagle and still speak:

From ASOS, Jon X.

What I'm getting at is that it seems likely that a skinchanger is able to enter another being only partially, to make use of its eyes for example, while simultaneously relaying information or reacting to events around themselves. And it might be easier to do so with trickier animals than to fully "enter" them immediately. Varamyr says "Once a horse is broken to the saddle, any man can mount him," and well, in order to break a horse into the saddle you start off small, only putting the saddle on for a little bit before getting on top of it yourself.

But Varamyr also rode his bear into battle, and said that the bear hated him and wanted to kill him.  So he must have been warging the bear while physically capable of fighting or at least holding on.

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1 minute ago, aryagonnakill#2 said:

But Varamyr also rode his bear into battle, and said that the bear hated him and wanted to kill him.  So he must have been warging the bear while physically capable of fighting or at least holding on.

Different stages of skinchanging? It would make sense if we already have two steps, using only one of the senses and then using the entire body. Perhaps he can subjugate the bear enough to ride it and fight at the same time. Hmm... Arya is blind, so she loses nothing skinchanging into the cat. Varamyr closes his eyes to use the eagle's eyes. I don't think Bran ever sees two different places at once while warging Summer, so maybe you have to lose your own sense/ability in order to use the animals? But then what says you have to use an animals eyes while warging it? Perhaps he's only putting part of his soul into the bear to make it move but he isn't using the eyes. Forcing it to obey the commands he gives it when he's riding it (continuing the horse thing, he'd need control over his own legs and thus wouldn't be able to use the bear's legs if the skinchanger's abilities vs. the animal's abilities thing is true), freeing himself to fight people.

It might be best to devote a thread on this subject. But it seems partial skinchanging isn't completely out of the question given what we've seen/heard. Only GRRM knows.

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12 minutes ago, Aniel said:

Different stages of skinchanging? It would make sense if we already have two steps, using only one of the senses and then using the entire body. Perhaps he can subjugate the bear enough to ride it and fight at the same time. Hmm... Arya is blind, so she loses nothing skinchanging into the cat. Varamyr closes his eyes to use the eagle's eyes. I don't think Bran ever sees two different places at once while warging Summer, so maybe you have to lose your own sense/ability in order to use the animals? But then what says you have to use an animals eyes while warging it? Perhaps he's only putting part of his soul into the bear to make it move but he isn't using the eyes. Forcing it to obey the commands he gives it when he's riding it (continuing the horse thing, he'd need control over his own legs and thus wouldn't be able to use the bear's legs if the skinchanger's abilities vs. the animal's abilities thing is true), freeing himself to fight people.

It might be best to devote a thread on this subject. But it seems partial skinchanging isn't completely out of the question given what we've seen/heard. Only GRRM knows.

Are you sure you read Varamyr closing his eyes? 

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Interesting. Might be worth its own thread if anyone cares enough to start one. I would suggest Varamyr may be somewhat anomalous - he is after all, rather strong as a skinchanger, and has had years of training, compared to Bran's year or so muddling through on his own/with Jojen.

I'm also not sure that he skinchanges several animals concurrently - though I could easily be forgetting, so don't take my word on that. Anyway, interesting question, could prompt quite a lot of discussion.

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