Keep your hands off my Manimal! Skinchangers, Wargs and Greenseers

[The Fattest Leech]

This thread is dedicated to the kind imps, bastards and singers over at the Small Questions v. 10105 thread. Lets decode the specifics.

1. The question is: Do we know what happens to the warg's real body as they are in another human or animal? For instance... when Bran slips in to Hodor's mind, is Bran's own body just sitting motionless against a tree trunk (or whatever). I assume a warg cannot communicate/function as normal while in two bodies at once?

There is evidence that Bran is in a comatose-type of state, still alive and breathing, but his consciousness is fully elsewhere. We have this from Bran in Dance: “Summer was snarling and snapping as he danced around the closest, a great ruin of a man wreathed in swirling flame. He shouldn’t get so close, what is he doing? Then he saw himself, sprawled facedown in the snow. Summer was trying to drive the thing away from him. What will happen if it kills me? the boy wondered. Will I be Hodor for good or all? Will I go back into Summer’s skin? Or will I just be dead?” <<<Apparently Bran has the same questions we do  And it appears that once a changer or warg is in another body, then the real/main body hangs out and goes limp. 

1a. What is Bran's body doing while inside Bloodraven's cave and he is mentally "in" Hodor?

Ok. Sounds pretty clear. But wait! There's more...

2. There is another example, and it may be an elective thing that Bran has not figured out, yet.  When Arya is blind and she is attacked with a stick, she uses the vision of a cat (felines are supposed to be the most difficult to warg) to see the attacks while she physically responds to the attacks.  Well huh?!?! This sounds clearly like Arya is using the cat while she is not only conscious, but in active battle. Could it be that because she is not fully "in the cat", just using it's eyes, that she can retain her consciousness and her own skillful fighting technique?

3. We can almost believe this based on what we know about Varamyr and his eagle. He is using the eagle to scout and he is able to tell what he sees at the same time... and not unconscious and slumped up against a tree: "Banners," he heard Varamyr murmur, "I see golden banners, oh . . ." A mammoth lumbered by, trumpeting, a half-dozen bowmen in the wooden tower on its back. "The king . . . no . . ."

Then the skinchanger threw back his head and screamed.

The sound was shocking, ear-piercing, thick with agony. Varamyr fell, writhing, and the 'cat was screaming too . . . and high, high in the eastern sky, against the wall of cloud, Jon saw the eagle burning. For a heartbeat it flamed brighter than a star, wreathed in red and gold and orange, its wings beating wildly at the air as if it could fly from the pain. Higher it flew, and higher, and higher still."

4. And what's with this line: and the 'cat was screaming too. Is he able to control two animals at once... or is that small piece of his mind in the cat enough to keep it enthralled while he is skin-changing the eagle?

Clearly there is still some conflict. Varamyr also rode his bear into battle, and said that the bear hated him and wanted to kill him.  So he must have been warging the bear while physically capable of fighting or at least holding on.

5. Sooo, does training have anything to do with these different levels of control? Are they 'stages' of control? Can more than one skinchanger/warg take an animal at a time (while they are both alive)?

Please discuss. We need to decode the specifics!

Here is a link to the search site if you want to do a little snooping research https://asearchoficeandfire.com/

Here is a link to the ASOIAF wiki if you need a little changer/warg hierarchy-rule system refresher http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Skinchanger

 

[HexMachina]

Thanks for the new thread! Not much to add right now, I'm mostly curious to see what others think. But on Varanyr controlling multiple animals at once, I didn't see it that way, though I've not really reread recently so I defer to anyone with a contradictory quote. Even with the wolf-pack, he seems to control the three at once through standard pack mentality, slipping into them individually rather than all at once. 

Lin terms of your quote about the cat screaming, I assumed that was because the link they all share with Varamyr gives them some sensation of what the others feel. So, the cat isn't directly linked to the eagle, but when it burns she still somewhat feels it's pain through Varamyr, as well as the pain Varamyr himself feels. I'm actually rereading Robin Hobb's Farseer trilogy,p right now which uses a similar idea, with people who are only indirectly linked sharing sensations due to separate bonds to the same person. 

 Also, at that point in the battle, his control over the animals slips;

"Varamyr had lost control of his other beasts in the agony of the eagle's death. His shadow cat had raced into the woods, whilst his snow bear turned her claws on those around her, ripping apart four men before falling to a spear. She would have slain Varamyr had he come within her reach. The bear hated him, had raged each time he wore her skin or climbed upon her back."

I suspect this is painful/traumatic for both human and animal. 

[The Fattest Leech]

It would be nice to have this thread just be "general" enough to be able to lay down some rules in general... but... I have to admit, I originally asked the question on the other thread because I was in another recent discussion with someone who thinks Bran will warg a dragon and I was like "how"? I kinda remembered Bran not really being conscious or moving when he warged and then that got me thinking about what happens to Bran's body when he is in the cave? And so on and so forth with an ADD brain

I searched for the quote you actually gave first, so a big thank you. I didn't find mine because I had a few key words wrong. Oh well.

[Aniel]

Thanks for the thread! I don't know when next I'll read the books again, but I'll poke my head in here whenever someone posts.

As for the shadowcat screaming, a thought struck me. Perhaps Varamyr, who is a rather strong skinchanger, isn't skinchanging the cat but has a bond with it of some sort. I thought of the Aes Sedai-Warder bond in WoT, where you feel the other's consciousness and their emotions (I haven't read the previously mentioned Farseer trilogy, but that sounds similar). If so, the eagle gets set on fire and Varamyr feels it, and the cat feels what Varamyr feels... But shouldn't the other animals also feel it then?

Perhaps it's not a bond at all (though it's obvious that skinchangers/wargs have bonds of some sort with their animals) that's behind it, but maybe Varamyr ends up flitting between the eagle, himself, and the cat from the schock? Unfortunately there's no word on it in the chapter from his POV, so that theory may already be debunked/on shaky ground.

"Varamyr had lost control of his other beasts in the agony of the eagle's death." This makes it appear as though he's exerting control over all his animals all at once. So how does that work? I suppose the stages of skinchanging might have something to do with it, Varamyr's off doing whatever he does and simultaneously goes in and out of at least the bear (I imagine he's got the wolves somewhat domesticated and the cat as well, since it's with him so often) to quell any rebellion it might think of. Or maybe I'm reading too much into it. It probably took him a while to recover from the eagle's death however, and thus a while to assume control of the animals again. Though from what I remember he only has the wolves left in his prologue.

[aryagonnakill#2]

I think the only logical conclusion to make it that with training and experience you can gain more and more abilities.  Lets not forget that Bran is also like 10 years old and his brain isn't even close to fully developed.  Even Arya at only a few years older has a significantly more developed Brain, and Varamyrs is fully developed. 

Arya's situation reminds me a lot of what the worldbook says about the priests of Lorath covering their eyes.  It seems to suggest they know of warging and try to unlock the ability.

[kissdbyfire]

14 hours ago, HelenaExMachina said:

Thanks for the new thread! Not much to add right now, I'm mostly curious to see what others think. But on Varanyr controlling multiple animals at once, I didn't see it that way, though I've not really reread recently so I defer to anyone with a contradictory quote. Even with the wolf-pack, he seems to control the three at once through standard pack mentality, slipping into them individually rather than all at once.

Lin terms of your quote about the cat screaming, I assumed that was because the link they all share with Varamyr gives them some sensation of what the others feel. So, the cat isn't directly linked to the eagle, but when it burns she still somewhat feels it's pain through Varamyr, as well as the pain Varamyr himself feels. I'm actually rereading Robin Hobb's Farseer trilogy,p right now which uses a similar idea, with people who are only indirectly linked sharing sensations due to separate bonds to the same person. 

 Also, at that point in the battle, his control over the animals slips;

"Varamyr had lost control of his other beasts in the agony of the eagle's death. His shadow cat had raced into the woods, whilst his snow bear turned her claws on those around her, ripping apart four men before falling to a spear. She would have slain Varamyr had he come within her reach. The bear hated him, had raged each time he wore her skin or climbed upon her back."

I suspect this is painful/traumatic for both human and animal. 

That's my take on it as well. Also, the eagle was originally Orell's, could this be partially the reason for how it all went down? 

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

Perhaps the difference between Bran's situation (laying face down in the snow) and, say, Arya's, is due to Bran's tendency to loose himself in the warging experience. 

“You were gone too long.” Jojen Reed was thirteen, only four years older than Bran. Jojen wasn’t much bigger either, no more than two inches or maybe three, but he had a solemn way of talking that made him seem older and wiser than he really was. At Winterfell, Old Nan had dubbed him “little grandfather.”
Bran frowned at him. “I wanted to eat.”
“Meera will be back soon with supper.”
“I’m sick of frogs.” Meera was a frogeater from the Neck, so Bran couldn’t really blame her for catching so many frogs, he supposed, but even so... “I wanted to eat the deer.” For a moment he remembered the taste of it, the blood and the raw rich meat, and his mouth watered. I won the fight for it. I won.
“Did you mark the trees?”
Bran flushed. Jojen was always telling him to do things when he opened his third eye and put on Summer’s skin. To claw the bark of a tree, to catch a rabbit and bring it back in his jaws uneaten, to push some rocks in a line. Stupid things. “I forgot,” he said.
“You always forget.”
It was true. He meant to do the things that Jojen asked, but once he was a wolf they never seemed important. There were always things to see and things to smell, a whole green world to hunt. And he could run! There was nothing better than running, unless it was running after prey.

[The Fattest Leech]

3 minutes ago, Rhaenys_Targaryen said:

Perhaps the difference between Bran's situation (laying face down in the snow) and, say, Arya's, is due to Bran's tendency to loose himself in the warging experience. 

“You were gone too long.” Jojen Reed was thirteen, only four years older than Bran. Jojen wasn’t much bigger either, no more than two inches or maybe three, but he had a solemn way of talking that made him seem older and wiser than he really was. At Winterfell, Old Nan had dubbed him “little grandfather.”
Bran frowned at him. “I wanted to eat.”
“Meera will be back soon with supper.”
“I’m sick of frogs.” Meera was a frogeater from the Neck, so Bran couldn’t really blame her for catching so many frogs, he supposed, but even so... “I wanted to eat the deer.” For a moment he remembered the taste of it, the blood and the raw rich meat, and his mouth watered. I won the fight for it. I won.
“Did you mark the trees?”
Bran flushed. Jojen was always telling him to do things when he opened his third eye and put on Summer’s skin. To claw the bark of a tree, to catch a rabbit and bring it back in his jaws uneaten, to push some rocks in a line. Stupid things. “I forgot,” he said.
“You always forget.”
It was true. He meant to do the things that Jojen asked, but once he was a wolf they never seemed important. There were always things to see and things to smell, a whole green world to hunt. And he could run! There was nothing better than running, unless it was running after prey.

Could it be a difference between warging a human and skinchanging into a cat? Maybe different levels of strength or consciousness needed?

[kissdbyfire]

Just now, The Fattest Leech said:

Could it be a difference between warging a human and skinchanging into a cat? Maybe different levels of strength or consciousness needed?

We'll find out when TWoW comes out. 

[Clegane'sPup]

Glad you started the thread. I’m looking forward to reading other peoples comments.

I had this vague recollection about Bran warging Summer while he and his companions were hiding out in the crypts so I needed to look it up in CoK c.69, the first three pages.

Bran had been out of body for three days. Bran says he was always weak and thirsty when he came back. And hungry too. Jojen gives Bran a warning saying the wolf ate not Bran and that  Bran needed to remember who he was.

The book describes it in better context than I.  Seems like Bran was thrashing about because he didn’t want to return and the Reeds were calling him back. So I guess his body was empty of Bran’s mind & soul while he warged Summer.

Good thread title. Kudos. Opens up the discussion to the various elements of warging, skinchanging and greenseer -ering.

 

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

13 minutes ago, The Fattest Leech said:

Could it be a difference between warging a human and skinchanging into a cat? Maybe different levels of strength or consciousness needed?

We know there are different levels of difficulty

Dogs were the easiest beasts to bond with; they lived so close to men that they were almost human. Slipping into a dog’s skin was like putting on an old boot, its leather softened by wear. As a boot was shaped to accept a foot, a dog was shaped to accept a collar, even a collar no human eye could see. Wolves were harder. A man might befriend a wolf, even break a wolf, but no man could truly tame a wolf. “Wolves and women wed for life,” Haggon often said. “You take one, that’s a marriage. The wolf is part of you from that day on, and you’re part of him. Both of you will change.”
Other beasts were best left alone, the hunter had declared. Cats were vain and cruel, always ready to turn on you. Elk and deer were prey; wear their skins too long, and even the bravest man became a coward. Bears, boars, badgers, weasels … Haggon did not hold with such. “Some skins you never want to wear, boy. You won’t like what you’d become.” Birds were the worst, to hear him tell it.
“Men were not meant to leave the earth. Spend too much time in the clouds and you never want to come back down again. I know skinchangers who’ve tried hawks, owls, ravens. Even in their own skins, they sit moony, staring up at the bloody blue.”

Though not all skinchangers and wargs share that opinion.

[kissdbyfire]

3 minutes ago, Rhaenys_Targaryen said:

We know there are different levels of difficulty

Dogs were the easiest beasts to bond with; they lived so close to men that they were almost human. Slipping into a dog’s skin was like putting on an old boot, its leather softened by wear. As a boot was shaped to accept a foot, a dog was shaped to accept a collar, even a collar no human eye could see. Wolves were harder. A man might befriend a wolf, even break a wolf, but no man could truly tame a wolf. “Wolves and women wed for life,” Haggon often said. “You take one, that’s a marriage. The wolf is part of you from that day on, and you’re part of him. Both of you will change.”
Other beasts were best left alone, the hunter had declared. Cats were vain and cruel, always ready to turn on you. Elk and deer were prey; wear their skins too long, and even the bravest man became a coward. Bears, boars, badgers, weasels … Haggon did not hold with such. “Some skins you never want to wear, boy. You won’t like what you’d become.” Birds were the worst, to hear him tell it.
“Men were not meant to leave the earth. Spend too much time in the clouds and you never want to come back down again. I know skinchangers who’ve tried hawks, owls, ravens. Even in their own skins, they sit moony, staring up at the bloody blue.”

Though not all skinchangers and wargs share that opinion.

Yes! And also, I think, there different depths one achieves while skinchanging/warging. 

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

On 3-3-2016 at 8:12 PM, kissdbyfire said:

Yes! And also, I think, there different depths one achieves while skinchanging/warging. 

Yes.

 

Jon wargs Ghost while he's sleeping, and witnesses Mace's army. But he is also capable of warging Ghost whilst awake, though it takes a while before he realises what is happening. It's a different experience (during the former, he sees through Ghost's eyes, in the latter example, he doesn't), but still..

He wanted it, Jon knew then. He wanted it as much as he had ever wanted anything. I have always wanted it, he thought, guiltily. May the gods forgive me. it was a hunger inside him, sharp as a dragonglass blade. A hunger... he could feel it. It was food he needed, prey, a red deer that stank of fear or a great elk proud and defiant. He needed to kill and fill his belly with fresh meat and hot dark blood. His mouth began to water with the thought.
It was a long moment before he understood what was happening. When he did, he bolted to his feet. “Ghost?” He turned toward the wood, and there he came, padding silently out of the green dusk, the breath coming warm and white from his open jaws.

[kissdbyfire]

10 minutes ago, Rhaenys_Targaryen said:

Yes.

 

Jon wargs Ghost while he's sleeping, and witnesses Mace's army. But he is also capable of warging Ghost whilst awake, though it takes a while before he realises what is happening. It's a different experience (during the former, he sees through Ghost's eyes, in the latter example, he doesn't), but still..

He wanted it, Jon knew then. He wanted it as much as he had ever wanted anything. I have always wanted it, he thought, guiltily. May the gods forgive me. it was a hunger inside him, sharp as a dragonglass blade. A hunger... he could feel it. It was food he needed, prey, a red deer that stank of fear or a great elk proud and defiant. He needed to kill and fill his belly with fresh meat and hot dark blood. His mouth began to water with the thought.
It was a long moment before he understood what was happening. When he did, he bolted to his feet. “Ghost?” He turned toward the wood, and there he came, padding silently out of the green dusk, the breath coming warm and white from his open jaws.

Yes, I LOVE the scene you quoted so, so much! 

And it happens again, in a similar fashion, in Dance. 

[The Fattest Leech]

So to ask another very basic question, one that I still see different ideas about, in order to be a skinchanger, warg or green seer, 1) do you have to have first men blood, 2) just worship the old gods ( so a southerner could be born a skinchanger if their parents worshipped old gods), 3) have to be of first men blood and worship the old gods? 

I know this sounds like 101 stuff, and I know what I think, but I still see these other examples mentioned on other threads. I trust the group that has been posting here so far. 

[kissdbyfire]

As far as I recall, it hasn't been spelled out in detail. My take is, First Men blood is a must, worshipping the Old Gods not necessarily in the present. What I mean is, I think once a lineage has the trait or gift or whatever we call it, it will be passed on to the descendants (even if it may skip several generations) regardless of said descendants changing their 'religion' in the future. For instance, we have Martin saying that all Stark kids have it to greater or lesser degree, and I don't think Rickon has any religious belief as of the start of AGoT. 

I started a thread years ago about the Pact, the CotF, and the First Men, and it was exactly about the First Men receiving this gift from the CotF as part of a deal, be it magically or through interbreeding. The idea also being that not all First Men families received it, and that some  of the northern sigils are clues as to which families did. If I ever find the link for it I'll post here, but I seem to remember looking for it a few years ago and not being able to find it. 

[evita mgfs]

On 3/7/2016 at 10:48 AM, kissdbyfire said:

As far as I recall, it hasn't been spelled out in detail. My take is, First Men blood is a must, worshipping the Old Gods not necessarily in the present. What I mean is, I think once a lineage has the trait or gift or whatever we call it, it will be passed on to the descendants (even if it may skip several generations) regardless of said descendants changing their 'religion' in the future. For instance, we have Martin saying that all Stark kids have it to greater or lesser degree, and I don't think Rickon has any religious belief as of the start of AGoT. 

I started a thread years ago about the Pact, the CotF, and the First Men, and it was exactly about the First Men receiving this gift from the CotF as part of a deal, be it magically or through interbreeding. The idea also being that not all First Men families received it, and that some  of the northern sigils are clues as to which families did. If I ever find the link for it I'll post here, but I seem to remember looking for it a few years ago and not being able to find it. 

You may want to do a Google search - that is how I locate threads I started and/or participated in over the years.  I remember that thread.

 

On 3/2/2016 at 9:45 PM, The Fattest Leech said:

This thread is dedicated to the kind imps, bastards and singers over at the Small Questions v. 10105 thread. Lets decode the specifics.

1. The question is: Do we know what happens to the warg's real body as they are in another human or animal? For instance... when Bran slips in to Hodor's mind, is Bran's own body just sitting motionless against a tree trunk (or whatever). I assume a warg cannot communicate/function as normal while in two bodies at once?

There is evidence that Bran is in a comatose-type of state, still alive and breathing, but his consciousness is fully elsewhere. We have this from Bran in Dance: “Summer was snarling and snapping as he danced around the closest, a great ruin of a man wreathed in swirling flame. He shouldn’t get so close, what is he doing? Then he saw himself, sprawled facedown in the snow. Summer was trying to drive the thing away from him. What will happen if it kills me? the boy wondered. Will I be Hodor for good or all? Will I go back into Summer’s skin? Or will I just be dead?” <<<Apparently Bran has the same questions we do  And it appears that once a changer or warg is in another body, then the real/main body hangs out and goes limp. 

1a. What is Bran's body doing while inside Bloodraven's cave and he is mentally "in" Hodor?

Ok. Sounds pretty clear. But wait! There's more...

2. There is another example, and it may be an elective thing that Bran has not figured out, yet.  When Arya is blind and she is attacked with a stick, she uses the vision of a cat (felines are supposed to be the most difficult to warg) to see the attacks while she physically responds to the attacks.  Well huh?!?! This sounds clearly like Arya is using the cat while she is not only conscious, but in active battle. Could it be that because she is not fully "in the cat", just using it's eyes, that she can retain her consciousness and her own skillful fighting technique?

3. We can almost believe this based on what we know about Varamyr and his eagle. He is using the eagle to scout and he is able to tell what he sees at the same time... and not unconscious and slumped up against a tree: "Banners," he heard Varamyr murmur, "I see golden banners, oh . . ." A mammoth lumbered by, trumpeting, a half-dozen bowmen in the wooden tower on its back. "The king . . . no . . ."

Then the skinchanger threw back his head and screamed.

The sound was shocking, ear-piercing, thick with agony. Varamyr fell, writhing, and the 'cat was screaming too . . . and high, high in the eastern sky, against the wall of cloud, Jon saw the eagle burning. For a heartbeat it flamed brighter than a star, wreathed in red and gold and orange, its wings beating wildly at the air as if it could fly from the pain. Higher it flew, and higher, and higher still."

4. And what's with this line: and the 'cat was screaming too. Is he able to control two animals at once... or is that small piece of his mind in the cat enough to keep it enthralled while he is skin-changing the eagle?

Clearly there is still some conflict. Varamyr also rode his bear into battle, and said that the bear hated him and wanted to kill him.  So he must have been warging the bear while physically capable of fighting or at least holding on.

5. Sooo, does training have anything to do with these different levels of control? Are they 'stages' of control? Can more than one skinchanger/warg take an animal at a time (while they are both alive)?

Please discuss. We need to decode the specifics!

Here is a link to the search site if you want to do a little snooping research https://asearchoficeandfire.com/

Here is a link to the ASOIAF wiki if you need a little changer/warg hierarchy-rule system refresher http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Skinchanger

 

Regarding the screaming, here is something I wrote that involves Bran exercising his powers in lessons that are marked by screams:

Bran’s POV’s gradually become fewer and grow farther apart over the five of seven completed novels promised in George R. R. Martin’s series A Song of Ice and Fire. A good way to illustrate this is through comparing the number and frequency of Bran’s multiple POV’s in the first novel A Game of Thrones with the most recently published fifth novel A Dance with Dragons, in which Bran’s last POV appears not even halfway through the novel.

Martin invites A Song of Ice and Fire readers especially to hunt elsewhere in ADwD and the gift chapters from The Winds of Winter to find intimations of the newest, greenest of the greenseer’s growing powers.

Those POV’s Martin attributes to Theon, or to his nom deplumes - the Prince of Winterfell, the Turncloak, and the Ghost in Winterfell - teem with Bran’s presence as he exercises his green-magic powers, many of which Martin suggests in Bran’s lessons with greenseer Bloodraven and the representative Singer(s) who Bran and Meera call Leaf.

One of many examples is that Bran learns to use the ravens [among other means] to speak. Martin demonstrates Bran’s progress, from “screams” to words.

BR teaches and Bran learns to fly. But when Bran attempts to speak employing the raven’s voice, he screams:

“When he [bran] tried to speak, it came out in a scream” (ADwD 450).

In Theon’s POVs to follow, a raven opines its dissatisfaction with events by punctuating them with a scream.

 

On Ramsay’s wedding night, when he begins his degradation of his bride and Reek, a raven in the godswood “screams”.

In The Turncloak, when Theon walks the walls of Winterfell, he finds himself in what had been Maester Luwin’s rookery, a raven issues a “scream” of guarded welcome.

“. . . ravens looked down . . . muttering to one another. From time to time, one let out a raucousscream” (540).

Later, a raven speaks the name “Theon” and another the word “Tree”.

In AGoT, Martin describes Bran’s fall, emphasizing his “scream” by using it as an introductory participial defining Bran’s action:

“Screaming, Bran went backward out the window into the empty air” (AGoT 85).

In A Clash of Kings, Bran reacts to Rickon’s betrayal with screaming:

“Rickon even showed them [the Frey wards] the deep vaults under the earth where the stonemason was carving father’s tomb. “You had no right!” Bran screamed at his brother when he heard. ‘That was our place, a Stark place!’ But Rickon never cared” (ACoK 78).

Note in ADwD, when Lady Dustin’s retainers break open the crypts, the door “hinges screaming” (544) as if in disapproval.

In The Prince of Winterfell, Bran speaks the name Theon through manipulating the leaves of the heart tree:

“The night was windless, the snow drifting straight down out of a cold black sky, yet the leaves of the heart tree were rustling his name. ‘Theon.’ They seemed to whisper ‘Theon.’”

Moreover, Bran masters using the tree’s mouth to speak:

“. . . Bran,” the tree murmured” (616).

Through these examples, Martin marks Bran’s wizardry advancing as he gives voices to the heart tree’s leaves and mouth, to assorted ravens, and to the door hinges leading into Winterfell’s crypts. Moreover, by associating screaming with Bran in earlier novels, the author unifies and emphasizes the ‘finding a voice’ motif.

 

[kissdbyfire]

26 minutes ago, evita mgfs said:

You may want to do a Google search - that is how I locate threads I started and/or participated in over the years.  I remember that thread.

I'm too lazyyyyyyy!  

Quote

<snip>

Through these examples, Martin marks Bran’s wizardry advancing as he gives voices to the heart tree’s leaves and mouth, to assorted ravens, and to the door hinges leading into Winterfell’s crypts. Moreover, by associating screaming with Bran in earlier novels, the author unifies and emphasizes the ‘finding a voice’ motif.

Great post, as usual! 

[HexMachina]

5 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

I'm too lazyyyyyyy!  

Great post, as usual! 

If it's one of your own threads, can you not track it through "My Activity" page? 

Some great posts here, although I'm mostly just reading rather than contributing here

[evita mgfs]

1 minute ago, kissdbyfire said:

I'm too lazyyyyyyy!  

Great post, as usual! 

Why thank you very much.  I also found an instance in AFfC wherein Arya serves the Faceless Men, "Standing there with the flagon in her hands, she dreamed she was a wolf, running free through a moonlit forest with a great pack howling at her heels" [462].  I took this to be a conscious Arya having a "waking" wolf dream- or a conscious warg experience - from across the Narrow Sea.  At least I thought the wolf is Nymeria, Arya's direwolf racing through the Riverlands with her wolf pack hot on her heels.

Arya seems to have strong powers, not quite on a par with Bran, but pretty close behind him.  Perhaps her training as a Faceless assassin serves to awaken her warg and skinchanging spirit.

BTW/ I do think Bran will  master controlling multiple entities .