red snow Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 12 hours ago, Corvinus said: The better way to spin it, imo, is to remember that Ragnar had a rat in his hands. So where there are rats and mice, their predators may have a chance of thriving. If the snake found plenty of food indoors, it might survive winter. But again, this is just spinning the wheels. More plauible but less fun 9 hours ago, Zorral said: This doesn't mean northerners went to China. But at certain points traders from east and west meet, and goods are exchanged, including slaves. Especially around the Black Sea. As well, there were Vikings in Moorish kingdoms in the Iberian peninsula. They raided as well, but they also got hired to be mercenaries and body guards. Trade and traders go where peoples as a whole or group do not, bringing back strange new things, including talented, exotic slaves. Some were musicians . . . . Musicians also bring back strange new things including instruments, songs, dances -- food. Yeah, while there was trade over huge differences it was rare/virtually never that a person travelled from A-Z (they'd usually do A-E then someone did the next stint, etc). So the middle regions would probably see the most mixing. It would be very unusual for people from A and Z to meet. Just commodities which i guess includes slaves. 12 hours ago, Astromech said: Hide contents So while it's possible a chinese slave could get as far as Norway it seems highly unlikely they'd do so without it being a special order or higher price, It didn't appear that she was a special order at all from her introduction though. It just seems like a wasted investment as it must have cost a lot to keep her alive for so long. Unless a pirate stole her and then it's more plausible again and Aslaug got a bargain. I have no idea why astromech's quote is in here! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jussi Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 Best episode in the season so far. I really enjoyed Harald's introduction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mladen Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 15 hours ago, Buckwheat said: I thought it was supposed to be clear that swallowing the snake was a hallucination. But before he took anything, there was a snake in the hut, and that one must have been real. So the snake is both real and a hallucination. Inception, much Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red snow Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 12 minutes ago, Risto said: Inception, much If only the snake had been eating itself while Ragnar was eating it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corvinus85 Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 26 minutes ago, red snow said: If only the snake had been eating itself while Ragnar was eating it! So Ragnar swallows all of Midgard? Mind blown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red snow Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 34 minutes ago, Corvinus said: So Ragnar swallows all of Midgard? Mind blown. Ragnar Rocks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorral Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 7 hours ago, red snow said: More plauible but less fun Yeah, while there was trade over huge differences it was rare/virtually never that a person travelled from A-Z (they'd usually do A-E then someone did the next stint, etc). So the middle regions would probably see the most mixing. It would be very unusual for people from A and Z to meet. Just commodities which i guess includes slaves. So while it's possible a chinese slave could get as far as Norway it seems highly unlikely they'd do so without it being a special order or higher price, It didn't appear that she was a special order at all from her introduction though. It just seems like a wasted investment as it must have cost a lot to keep her alive for so long. Unless a pirate stole her and then it's more plausible again and Aslaug got a bargain. I have no idea why astromech's quote is in here! She arrived in Kattegat as part of the booty along with other captives from the Frankia siege. She wasn't brought by a slaver trader. We don't even know if she was a slave in Frankia, btw. Or what she did there. She may have been part of a wealthy person's display of his / her ability to exercise conspicuous consumption. Her appearance is one of being in really good shape for someone enslaved so long. Aslaug didn't buy her -- she picked her out of what presumably was Ragnar's personal cut of the pillaged Frankia wealth. At least this is what it looked like to me. That others saw something else -- and are right, though, is certainly possible. The historical record, such as it is, shows all sorts of Asian slaves -- particularly from regions of India, highly trained in dance and music from birth, in the al-Andulus caliphate, and in the southern - Mediterranean courts of Gaul even before Charlemagne. There is a great deal of acoustical forensics of their influences in the music traditions of these eras on both sides of the Pyrenees, just as there were African slaves in these courts who sang and danced -- entertainers. As well slaves took care of the infants and small children -- and to this day people sing babies to sleep, which was another way cross-culturation happened / happens. Skilled slaves were high demand, such as slaves with the skills to make rugs, weave and so on. Wealthy people put them to work to make these goods for sale to other wealthy people. Highly skilled luxury entertainment slaves were high demand goods too. Recall in those days though entertainers were in high demand the social status of these with such talent was very low. More often than not they were slaves, and the women in particular, then, often were sex slaves as well as entertainers. Which set up a millenial attitude about entertainers and actors, as being whores and slaves, and thus no person of any status, particularly women, would practice theatrical arts. A good source for such information is in the first two chapters of Cuba and Its Music: From the First Drums to the Mambo. (The book begins with the Phoenicians . . .) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red snow Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 30 minutes ago, Zorral said: She arrived in Kattegat as part of the booty along with other captives from the Frankia siege. She wasn't brought by a slaver trader. We don't even know if she was a slave in Frankia, btw. Or what she did there. She may have been part of a wealthy person's display of his / her ability to exercise conspicuous consumption. Her appearance is one of being in really good shape for someone enslaved so long. Aslaug didn't buy her -- she picked her out of what presumably was Ragnar's personal cut of the pillaged Frankia wealth. At least this is what it looked like to me. That others saw something else -- and are right, though, is certainly possible. This does make it seem more plausible. Like you say she may well have been ordered by a french noble and this would justify the lengths they went to getting her there. So Ragnar and co just got a bargain from seizing the slaves as booty from the siege. I didn't pick up that the slave may have already been Ragnar's. I'm sure he'd have picked her out once he saw her too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorral Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 6 minutes ago, red snow said: This does make it seem more plausible. Like you say she may well have been ordered by a french noble and this would justify the lengths they went to getting her there. So Ragnar and co just got a bargain from seizing the slaves as booty from the siege. I didn't pick up that the slave may have already been Ragnar's. I'm sure he'd have picked her out once he saw her too. He probably didn't do it himself as injured as he is. But surely there are minions, subordinates who did it for him. Caesar didn't pick the Gauls he was selling into slavery himself: he was too busy. Somebody's job was to see he got his lion's share of the captives, and would make sure he got good ones. Yah -- a lot more plausible than a python or boa constrictor in that drafty cabin being awake in the cold, not torpid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovely Lyanna Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 I liked this episode. For some reason I am more willing to forgive the Vikings for not sticking to history. Perhaps I just do not really have preconceived vision of how I want it to look, so I am able to just go with the flow of it. The title should have been, "What One Man Can Do." "What one man can do, another can do. What one man can do, another can do. God d**n right. Today we kill the Mutharf*&#er." That's from The Edge. I love that movie. I like Bjorn and the bear. It was so of like Jeremiah Johnson. Sorry Leonardo, I liked your movie, but it still sort of felt like that someone just threw Jeremiah Johnson and Hang Em High in a blender and this is what came out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corvinus85 Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 2 hours ago, Zorral said: She arrived in Kattegat as part of the booty along with other captives from the Frankia siege. She wasn't brought by a slaver trader. We don't even know if she was a slave in Frankia, btw. Or what she did there. She may have been part of a wealthy person's display of his / her ability to exercise conspicuous consumption. Her appearance is one of being in really good shape for someone enslaved so long. Aslaug didn't buy her -- she picked her out of what presumably was Ragnar's personal cut of the pillaged Frankia wealth. At least this is what it looked like to me. That others saw something else -- and are right, though, is certainly possible. Wasn't there a turban wearing guy on the dock when Aslaug got her? It seemed to me that he was a slaver. I figured if Ragnar and Aslaug entrusted this business to one of their servants, said servants would have looked more at home in Kattegat than what that guy did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astromech Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 Here's an interview with Dianne Doan, talking about Yidu, which may shed some light on her character background and her arc this season. It isn't much of a spoiler. http://www.showbizjunkies.com/tv/dianne-doan-vikings-interview/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wmarshal Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 1 hour ago, Corvinus said: Wasn't there a turban wearing guy on the dock when Aslaug got her? It seemed to me that he was a slaver. I figured if Ragnar and Aslaug entrusted this business to one of their servants, said servants would have looked more at home in Kattegat than what that guy did. I assume the guy was trading in France and traveled back with the Danes to establish trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wmarshal Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 Wait time out, something is very wrong Aslaug said Fairhair needs to over throw Ragnar to be king of Norway, but Ragnar is king of Danes and sitting in Denmark, so... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GallowKnight Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 1 hour ago, Wmarshal said: Wait time out, something is very wrong Aslaug said Fairhair needs to over throw Ragnar to be king of Norway, but Ragnar is king of Danes and sitting in Denmark, so... I'd guess that parts of Norway probably belong to Denmark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorral Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 2 hours ago, Astromech said: Here's an interview with Dianne Doan, talking about Yidu, which may shed some light on her character background and her arc this season. It isn't much of a spoiler. http://www.showbizjunkies.com/tv/dianne-doan-vikings-interview/ Nope, no spoilers at all. The actress says: Quote I think it’s already publicly known I’m kidnapped on the Red Sea and then brought to Paris, and it’s presumed that from their raid last season, they bring me back to Kattegat where I’m sold to Queen Aslaug as a slave, so I’m one of her new ladies for this season. Thanks for that line! So, yah, the Levant (would love to know from whom she was kidnapped and who kidnapped her) and that Aslaug bought her, so she's not personal booty -- and maybe not the other kind of booty either? ah-hem. Anyway, if anyone would know these things I'd trust the actress to know! The Red Sea part though does hold up the trade routes and slavers and merchandise of the era, and much more ancient ones before that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wmarshal Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 2 hours ago, The_Gallows_Knight said: I'd guess that parts of Norway probably belong to Denmark. I have no idea, as Ragnar seems to get all his power from Kattegat, no matter how many men get slaughtered, theI don't know, maybe wondering warriors come in flock to join him. Ragnar travels no where to show where his territories begin and ends. It seems more or less the jarls aren't even in any form his subjects and the title king is useless switch around for jarl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astromech Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 I have an educated guess about Yidu's background based on what we've seen and supposing she is actually from Tang Dynasty China. Besides the whole Silk Road maritime route capture, her having trouble breaking a chicken's neck tells me she probably is not from an agricultural/rural/poor background. She may be from a merchant background, but I doubt that. Urban elite is most likely. The Tang Dynasty was quite progressive concerning women's rights, but only urban elites benefited from it. As someone above stated, musicians/artists were viewed favorably and enjoyed a higher social status. During Ragnar's drug trip, Yidu appears to be wearing white face paint. This leads me to believe Yidu may have been a courtesan. Tang Dynasty courtesans are believed to have been the inspiration for geishas in japan, who wore white face paint. Courtesans were viewed favorably and held an elevated social status. I'm not sure about her comment about pirates not daring to have their way with her, but I'm leaning towards her being a musician/artist or courtesan from the Tang Dynasty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wmarshal Posted March 18, 2016 Share Posted March 18, 2016 http://deadline.com/2016/03/vikings-renewed-season-5-history-jonathan-rhys-meyers-1201722220/ http://variety.com/2016/tv/news/vikings-renewed-season-5-jonathan-rhys-meyers-cast-1201733044/ Well I guess we are in it to win it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HexMachina Posted March 18, 2016 Share Posted March 18, 2016 12 minutes ago, Wmarshal said: http://deadline.com/2016/03/vikings-renewed-season-5-history-jonathan-rhys-meyers-1201722220/ http://variety.com/2016/tv/news/vikings-renewed-season-5-jonathan-rhys-meyers-cast-1201733044/ Well I guess we are in it to win it. From the article; "The brilliant writing and depth of historical research and authenticity brought to the screen by Michael Hirst..." *sniggers* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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