Zorral Posted March 23, 2016 Share Posted March 23, 2016 Thoughts? Any historian with basic training knows this. The slave trade and trade in general, as you would see if you'd read above your own post in this and the previous Vikings thread. Trade routes and how ancient they are, are the fundamental information for doing any kind of scope history as well as understanding a lot of archeology. The sheer ancientness of trade routes, particularly those bringing iron to places that didn't have local sources of it are indeed mind-boggling. But these routes were happening for millenia before 800 A.D. The Norse were trading into the Black Sea and the Mediterranean long before the Vikings went a'pillaging. (See, among other things, the Amber Road, and look at Iron trade routes.) As well, Norse even before 800 A.D. were serving as mercenaries and bodyguards -- as well as pillaging -- even in Moorish Spain. It seems that when Viking sieges and raiding failed, they hired themselves out to do the same for those they weren't able to plunder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veltigar Posted March 23, 2016 Author Share Posted March 23, 2016 13 hours ago, dbunting said: For some reason my post from yesterday in response to this was lost. This stuck with me so I did a little internet "research" on slave trading in the time frame that this is set in. I came across a very interesting forum in which a question is posed. The question is basically this, I am writing a book and need a plausible way for a Chinese female slave to be in Viking control in 800... Sound familiar? This question was posted in 2010. I added the link because I was dumbfounded by the exact match to the show. Thoughts? http://historum.com/speculative-history/15468-unlikely-scenario-vikings-china.html Hirst doesn't concern himself with things like plausibility, so it can't have been him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbunting Posted March 23, 2016 Share Posted March 23, 2016 12 hours ago, Zorral said: Thoughts? Any historian with basic training knows this. The slave trade and trade in general, as you would see if you'd read above your own post in this and the previous Vikings thread. Forgive me for not being a historian, I thought I was in an "entertainment" section discussing fictional television based very loosely on historical events. And for the record I did read more than my post I have read the thread and the one before it and before it. The "thoughts" comment was about the similarities of the 2010 question I found and the plot line that got the Chinese slave to Vikings, not the slave trade itself, which I professed ignorance on. So I will try this more slowly so no one else yells at me! Does anyone find it strange that a question posted in 2010 on a forum (in which the author says they are gathering info for a book) matched identically to the plot line from this episode? My first thought was a writer was fleshing out ideas for the series back then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jarl the climber Posted March 23, 2016 Share Posted March 23, 2016 I am sort of lost when it comes to the plausibility of a woman from China somehow making it to Norway in the 8th or 9th century. First, if I remember correctly, she said that she was taken by pirates. Maybe the Chinese went as far west as maybe Sri Lanka back then maybe someone really adventurous would go as far as Egypt/the Middle East if they could hitch a ride on the Arab ships but this might take like two years one way. I forget the exact history but at a certain point the Byzantines did manage to steal silkworms from China and set up their own silk industry, I forget the date, so there was some contact, but how she managed to get to Norway boggles the mind. I guess she could have gotten there via the Artic Ocean North of Asia but I'm not even sure if this route was even used back then. Her story definitely has some holes in it maybe she is not being truthful with Ragnar at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorral Posted March 23, 2016 Share Posted March 23, 2016 This has been discussed several times already in this and the other Vikings thread. Trade routes, slave trade, booty, etc. Not at all that weird for traders buying merchandise to take further west in the polyglot cities in the Black Sea region, the middle east, north Africa, Mediterranean, etc. You all know how trade and mercantilism work, right? In any case, if one's boogying Vikings merely for the entertainment, cares nothing / know nothing about history, trade routes, cross culturation, etc., why the worry about an Asian in 9th century Scandia? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veltigar Posted March 24, 2016 Author Share Posted March 24, 2016 20 hours ago, dbunting said: Does anyone find it strange that a question posted in 2010 on a forum (in which the author says they are gathering info for a book) matched identically to the plot line from this episode? My first thought was a writer was fleshing out ideas for the series back then. See my previous post on this subject Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenlyIsNotRight Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 Well at least Kalfs boring ass is finally dead. Hopefully Erlandur will follow suit. Idk overall not really feeling this show the way I used to. I still like it but it feels more like mindless entertainment now where it used to have a bit more depth to it. I agree with prior posts that they haven't really been able to do anything that has matched Athelstans arc in the first two seasons providing the Viking/Judeo-Christian contrast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kairparavel Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 This flaming turd of an episode makes me sad. It didn't need to be this way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Bauer 24 Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 On 3/20/2016 at 7:37 PM, Spockydog said: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnar of Skagos Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 What's the drug that Ragnar keeps getting cheeched on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Antony Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 Never go full Lysa Arryn, Back to hating Aslaug. Another Odo dungeon scene, sigh. Also pretty meh on the Chinese girl/Ragnar on drugs shit. So yeah yet another mostly mediocre episode but at least they have gone raiding again, hopefully there is a good battle scene next week. I just want Bjorn to kill Erlandur already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corvinus85 Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 The Chinese girl definitely annoys me. Now she gets to wear a Chinese shirt. Those trade routes are really paying off. But since when did Chinese women, noble women, kept their hair short? I thought their hair tended to be very long. There was a good opportunity there for Bjorn to kill Erlendur. And Torvi should have spat in Erlendur's face and told him that Bjorn knows. Let the chickenshit piss himself. Odo needs to go. His dungeon crap is tiresome. On the other hand, I admire the mistress for putting up with it to get what she needs. I hope Rollo comes through and does some badass stuff, not just stare at people from horseback. Kattegat quickly became less interesting once only Aslaug was left. I hope something worthwhile comes out of the mysticism surrounding Harbard. Ivarr continues to scare me. That Lysa Arryn moment was just too much. And Sigurd doesn't seem to be much better. Of course, the biggest "what the fuck" moment came once again courtesy of Eckbert. Way to screw your son there again. Do all pilgrimages have to be done on foot? I suppose a cart would be too much. But I think the whole purpose is to time Aethelwulf being in Rome when Bjorn arrives. That clash may be interesting. I liked that they showed the cruelty of Harald and his brother. And Floki's reaction to seeing Rollo was great. Loved the send off song. That was Einar Selvik, again, wasn't it? And Ragnar's vision of his old home was pretty good, and so was the accompanying score. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Unborn Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 Hirst was bitching about GoT prior to season 4, yet we've had : The Jaime/Cersei sex scene Ragnar fingering a whore in littlefinger's brothel Harald's sacrifice to R'hllor The Aslaugh Arryn breastfeeding. More ?... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raksha 2014 Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 3 hours ago, Corvinus said: The Chinese girl definitely annoys me. Now she gets to wear a Chinese shirt. Those trade routes are really paying off. But since when did Chinese women, noble women, kept their hair short? I thought their hair tended to be very long. There was a good opportunity there for Bjorn to kill Erlendur. And Torvi should have spat in Erlendur's face and told him that Bjorn knows. Let the chickenshit piss himself. Odo needs to go. His dungeon crap is tiresome. On the other hand, I admire the mistress for putting up with it to get what she needs. I hope Rollo comes through and does some badass stuff, not just stare at people from horseback. Kattegat quickly became less interesting once only Aslaug was left. I hope something worthwhile comes out of the mysticism surrounding Harbard. Ivarr continues to scare me. That Lysa Arryn moment was just too much. And Sigurd doesn't seem to be much better. Of course, the biggest "what the fuck" moment came once again courtesy of Eckbert. Way to screw your son there again. Do all pilgrimages have to be done on foot? I suppose a cart would be too much. But I think the whole purpose is to time Aethelwulf being in Rome when Bjorn arrives. That clash may be interesting. I liked that they showed the cruelty of Harald and his brother. And Floki's reaction to seeing Rollo was great. Loved the send off song. That was Einar Selvik, again, wasn't it? And Ragnar's vision of his old home was pretty good, and so was the accompanying score. Yidu, the chinese slave girl/emperor's daughter/Ragnar's drug supplier, is annoying. I keep thinking she's got some kind of plan of her own; and I wish she'd get around to setting it in motion already. Maybe she caught the Modern Short Hair virus from Gisela, who seems to have shorter (and nicely styled as if she used a blow-dryer) hair than she did earlier in the season. Sigurd doesn't seem like a bad kid; just a rather lonely little guy whose bigger brothers have gone away raiding and he's left with Mom and told to go play with the little girl toddler. He's probably annoyed and feeling at loose ends. Aslaug has Harbard to help her fiddle away the tedious hours; oh joy. Maybe he'll teach Boneless to be even angrier? Erlendur should indeed be dead by now - hopefully he will be skewered by Bjorn soon. I think Ecbert was smart to send Aethelwulf packing - otherwise Aethelwulf would be continuing to shack up with Kwenrith and the two of them might just decide to unseat Dad; or at least cause dissension to his rule (if Aethulwulf had been the one to seat Kwenrith on her throne again, he just might have stayed; and it's unwise for Ecbert to allow Kwenrith to keep him under her thumb). As for the pilgrimage; I hope they're not going to force a four-year-old boy to walk 12 miles a day! Hopefully they'll have him do some riding with the guards. The send-off of the fleet was wonderful, one of the best scenes in the last two years. Looking forward to a Ragnar/Rollo slamfest; that is, if Ragnar ever stops taking the drugs. He's getting more and more useless; if he doesn't watch out, Skunky Finehair will take over his kingship and send Ragnar on the run... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HexMachina Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 Oh, Harbard is back, just what we all wanted. What fun I'm also convinced Ragnar dies this season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jarl the climber Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 If Aethwulf gets to walk barefoot the whole way while flagellating himself he will probably have the time of his life. The only thing he will miss is looking impotent in front of his wife and the guilt he feels every time he nails Kwentwirth. I understand the how far back trade routes go, they existed pre history to a certain extent but the whole emperors daughter and her magic drug takes the stupidity to a new level. The only reason I can find for Erlendurs continued existence is that no one thinks he is worth killing. The alliance he worked out with Kalf and by marrying Tovi seems to have fallen to pieces, so him dying at this point makes a lot of sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnar of Skagos Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 Yah I'm starting to get really tired of the whole "mother breastfeeding her obviously too-old son" cliche. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wmarshal Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 7 hours ago, Raksha 2014 said: Yidu, the chinese slave girl/emperor's daughter/Ragnar's drug supplier, is annoying. I keep thinking she's got some kind of plan of her own; and I wish she'd get around to setting it in motion already. Maybe she caught the Modern Short Hair virus from Gisela, who seems to have shorter (and nicely styled as if she used a blow-dryer) hair than she did earlier in the season. Sigurd doesn't seem like a bad kid; just a rather lonely little guy whose bigger brothers have gone away raiding and he's left with Mom and told to go play with the little girl toddler. He's probably annoyed and feeling at loose ends. Aslaug has Harbard to help her fiddle away the tedious hours; oh joy. Maybe he'll teach Boneless to be even angrier? Erlendur should indeed be dead by now - hopefully he will be skewered by Bjorn soon. I think Ecbert was smart to send Aethelwulf packing - otherwise Aethelwulf would be continuing to shack up with Kwenrith and the two of them might just decide to unseat Dad; or at least cause dissension to his rule (if Aethulwulf had been the one to seat Kwenrith on her throne again, he just might have stayed; and it's unwise for Ecbert to allow Kwenrith to keep him under her thumb). As for the pilgrimage; I hope they're not going to force a four-year-old boy to walk 12 miles a day! Hopefully they'll have him do some riding with the guards. The send-off of the fleet was wonderful, one of the best scenes in the last two years. Looking forward to a Ragnar/Rollo slamfest; that is, if Ragnar ever stops taking the drugs. He's getting more and more useless; if he doesn't watch out, Skunky Finehair will take over his kingship and send Ragnar on the run... I would agree with you half way if Ecbert didn't completely create all the reasons his son hates him. A say half way because it is idiotic to send his best if not only battle commander away when he plans a long term war for England. Ecbert skills lie completely on backed handed skims not battle. I just don't understand where the drugs are from, Yidu spends all her time in a cabin Nothing about Asluag subplot makes any sense anyone with a mouth would tell Ragnar what is happening, why do we need a breast feeding when she literally walked away from him killing someone to convey how horrible she is. what the heck with that dialogue with fairhair and halfdan? The idea they are somehow worst then all the Vikings we been following who rape, deal in Slavery and random killings is so forced. best thing again was Ragnar invisioning what we all miss: season 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Bauer 24 Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 31 minutes ago, Wmarshal said: I would agree with you half way if Ecbert didn't completely create all the reasons his son hates him. A say half way because it is idiotic to send his best if not only battle commander away when he plans a long term war for England. Ecbert skills lie completely on backed handed skims not battle. I just don't understand where the drugs are from, Yidu spends all her time in a cabin Nothing about Asluag subplot makes any sense anyone with a mouth would tell Ragnar what is happening, why do we need a breast feeding when she literally walked away from him killing someone to convey how horrible she is. what the heck with that dialogue with fairhair and halfdan? The idea they are somehow worst then all the Vikings we been following who rape, deal in Slavery and random killings is so forced. best thing again was Ragnar invisioning what we all miss: season 1 This show really has become a disaster hasn't it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astromech Posted March 25, 2016 Share Posted March 25, 2016 2 hours ago, Wmarshal said: I just don't understand where the drugs are from, Yidu spends all her time in a cabin Breaking Bad, the Beginning. It's probably just mold. That cabin is dank. I keep getting the feeling Yidu will be the one betraying Ragnar this season. 10 hours ago, Raksha 2014 said: Sigurd doesn't seem like a bad kid; just a rather lonely little guy whose bigger brothers have gone away raiding and he's left with Mom and told to go play with the little girl toddler. He's probably annoyed and feeling at loose ends. Aslaug has Harbard to help her fiddle away the tedious hours; oh joy. Maybe he'll teach Boneless to be even angrier? 14 hours ago, Corvinus said: The Chinese girl definitely annoys me. Now she gets to wear a Chinese shirt. Those trade routes are really paying off. But since when did Chinese women, noble women, kept their hair short? I thought their hair tended to be very long. Little Siggy is the most unfortunate kid in the series: her dad doesn't want anything to do with her, her mom ran off, she's dirty, her uncles are dicks to her. Cosette had it better with the Thenardiers. I'm waiting for Siggy's rendition of Castle on a Cloud. Ragnar cut her hair in that romantic, drug-fueled sex bath. 10 hours ago, Raksha 2014 said: Erlendur should indeed be dead by now - hopefully he will be skewered by Bjorn soon. They still need him and his crossbowmen Despite my complaints with the show, I'm still enjoying each episode. I'm relieved they finally returned to Paris. It was stagnant in Kattegat. Finehair and Halfdan have been a nice addition to the season. I'm happy they are shown as being cruel. Hirst seems to have been hesitant to show his lead characters as anything but for a few seasons. I love how Bjorn is filling in her for Ragnar who continues the tough love, while grooming him for leadership. Ragnar really hates being king. He's not long for this world. Hirst is really telegraphing it this season. The vision of his family was too obvious.This show will feel very empty without Ragnar and Fimmel's portrayal of him. I still have no idea if Lagertha is actually pregnant. And why does she keep Erlendur around. Damn that is annoying. It gives the impression she is naïve, when we all know she is actually quite cunning. I suppose we'll just have to see how it plays out and what her long game is. I still love Floki, even though his possible betrayal of Ragnar has become trite. Looks like Kwen is in trouble. Hopefully with the Rome pilgrimage we'll get less of Wessex. We may finally get a worthwhile story in Paris now that the Vikings have returned. ETA: Ivar is fantastic, but Aslaug is quickly going off the deep end. Haha, love the Lysa Arryn comment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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