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Arya's Big Hit


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So I just finished re-reading Dance. This might be a little crackpot but I think her prayer list is very important. She has been saying her prayer of death wishes since what Clash? One of the ways we know the FM determine their targets is when people come and pray for the deaths. She determines that she has prayed long and hard enough and decides to desert and start working on her list.

Long story short Arya starts knocking people off her prayer list and the FM send someone after her for her desertion. A FM catches up to her after she kills someone big, I want it to be Cersei but I don't think it'll really be her. 2 things could happen next: Everyone is dead on Aryas list and she gives the many faced god her life as payment. Or she and the FM determine that by killing everyone in her prayer she has finally killed Arya of House Stark and taken her final step in becoming no-one.

Haven't been able to get this idea out of my head since finished up my re-read and then I saw this topic.

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It's Lady Stoneheart. Black Walder will comwimission the hit once he is heir to the Twins.

Arya will get out of the faceless men because they broke the rules sending her to kill someone she knows who is already dead.

Arya will "kill" Lady Stoneheart by hugging her.  Remember Beric promised on his honor as a knight that he would see that Arya would be returned to her mother's arms, that's why he gave the kiss of life to Catelyn.

 

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If Martin decides to screw with the prophecy, I can see Cersei fleeing Kings Landing and running into Nymeria and her pack on the way to Casterly Rock. Cersei had Nymeria's sister killed, it would be very appropriate if Arya warged for that one.

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On ‎2016‎-‎07‎-‎01 at 7:43 PM, lujo said:

If Martin decides to screw with the prophecy, I can see Cersei fleeing Kings Landing and running into Nymeria and her pack on the way to Casterly Rock. Cersei had Nymeria's sister killed, it would be very appropriate if Arya warged for that one.

That would be nice:-) Hope Arya will get back wit´h Nymeria.

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 2016-06-08 at 7:37 PM, aryagonnakill#2 said:

One of the reasons I think this is a good possibility is because so far Arya has gotten very skilled for sure, but hasn't learned anything truly spectacular.  I think she has to learn the actual face switching techniques in order for her plotline to truly pay off.  Sending her to kill a queen with dragons would necessitate teaching her the skill, especially if they know about Missendei.

In what way is Missandei important for Aryas possible killing of Dany? 

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Out of left field I know, but it has been mentioned a few times that the Valerian language is not gender specific.

 

So crackpot theory, could Arya be the valonqar as the youngest Stark daughter. 

 

If Sansa some how ends up queen, it would link the two sections of Maggi's prophesy together. The younger more beautiful queen takes the throne and her younger sister kills Cersei.

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  • 2 months later...

I would like to focus on Arya and the Faceless Men.

1) Will she be able to acquire all skills of the FM? I think: YES

Arya seems to be able to even surpass in some respects the FM => she hides her "Arya-identity" better and better.

From my memory:

- Arya thinks at one point of hiding herself (her "Arya-identity") deep down in a dark corner, unseen for all others (even the FM)

- she controls better and better not to chew her lip (which is a common reaction of "Arya" when she starts thinking)

- she makes her prayers (the list of names) in silence now, because she knows she cannot be sure who listens in the House of Black and White, even in her sleeping chamber

- her connections to "Arya" (Needle hidden away  and her wolf-dreams) are unknown to the FM

- she is able to hide things she knows from the FM (e. g. her capabilites like skinchanging into a cat to use the cat's eyes)

- the only skill lacking her - as I see it - is to put a mask on herself without the help of a FM + the weaker type of disguise made by glamour only (which in fact she would not need once she mastered the real mask)

Thus, as long as she "serves" the FM, there is no reason for the FM to stop her training.

2) Would Arya be able to leave the FM without risking to be punished and killed by the FM?

Most posts I have seen assume, that Arya would not outlive a treason or abandoning the FM. Where is that written? The FM never kill, so they say, someone they know.

3) I admit a weakness in my argumentation, which comes from the Mercy-chapter. It seems evident, that the FM will conclude that the death of Raff the Sweetling is Arya's doing. And that could lead to her exclusion of the FM order and/or the end of her training

On the other hand:

- last time she was caught making a kill of her own Motivation (the Night's Watch deserter), she was only lightly punished with blindness, a step of training she would have passed through anyway, though later

- maybe she will even suceed (by ability or luck) not to be made responsible for that killing

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2 hours ago, Greywater-Watch said:

I would like to focus on Arya and the Faceless Men.

1) Will she be able to acquire all skills of the FM? I think: YES

Arya seems to be able to even surpass in some respects the FM => she hides her "Arya-identity" better and better.

From my memory:

- Arya thinks at one point of hiding herself (her "Arya-identity") deep down in a dark corner, unseen for all others (even the FM)

- she controls better and better not to chew her lip (which is a common reaction of "Arya" when she starts thinking)

- she makes her prayers (the list of names) in silence now, because she knows she cannot be sure who listens in the House of Black and White, even in her sleeping chamber

- her connections to "Arya" (Needle hidden away  and her wolf-dreams) are unknown to the FM

- she is able to hide things she knows from the FM (e. g. her capabilites like skinchanging into a cat to use the cat's eyes)

- the only skill lacking her - as I see it - is to put a mask on herself without the help of a FM + the weaker type of disguise made by glamour only (which in fact she would not need once she mastered the real mask)

Thus, as long as she "serves" the FM, there is no reason for the FM to stop her training.

2) Would Arya be able to leave the FM without risking to be punished and killed by the FM?

Most posts I have seen assume, that Arya would not outlive a treason or abandoning the FM. Where is that written? The FM never kill, so they say, someone they know.

3) I admit a weakness in my argumentation, which comes from the Mercy-chapter. It seems evident, that the FM will conclude that the death of Raff the Sweetling is Arya's doing. And that could lead to her exclusion of the FM order and/or the end of her training

On the other hand:

- last time she was caught making a kill of her own Motivation (the Night's Watch deserter), she was only lightly punished with blindness, a step of training she would have passed through anyway, though later

- maybe she will even suceed (by ability or luck) not to be made responsible for that killing

I think the assumption that the FM truly want her to join them is still questionable. They must know about Needle and her wolf dreams - yet they continue to train her. The blindness wasn't a punishment, it was a reward. A fast-track to the next level which saved her a year and half. She already came to them very young... this might be unprecedented.

I think it's going to be interesting how the FM will react once Arya flowers and is able to bring life into this world. That's something they do not do. 

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On ‎3‎/‎13‎/‎2016 at 5:49 PM, MGraham said:

She'll be asked to kill someone who will test her loyalty. My guess is Jon, she's had a special connection with him from day 1 with him giving her needle. She'll stick him with the pointy end.

I think she's on her way home after killing Raff in the mercy sample chapter. she will not complete her fm training, she will not retain any ability to change her face, and the fm will not send her on any further missions. She will not be no one. She will return to being Arya of house Stark. I don't know if she will leave the FM or they will kick her out; or whether they will let her go her way peacefully, or she will be looking over her shoulder for the rest of her life. My guess is that she leaves, and they let her go in peace. and, I predict the next time we see arya after the mercy chapter is in westeros. there could be a transitional chapter where she has some kind of confrontation with the kindly man and/or finds a ship to take her to westeros, but I think it's more likely she just appears at some dramatic moment, perhaps cutting walder frey's throat or leading a pack of wolves with Nymeria in an attack on some Frey soldiers.

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On ‎7‎/‎21‎/‎2016 at 4:09 AM, pogo said:

Out of left field I know, but it has been mentioned a few times that the Valerian language is not gender specific.

 

So crackpot theory, could Arya be the valonqar as the youngest Stark daughter. 

 

If Sansa some how ends up queen, it would link the two sections of Maggi's prophesy together. The younger more beautiful queen takes the throne and her younger sister kills Cersei.

works for me. the only issue to me is whether Jaime is the better candidate. I guess the only thing that  makes Jaime a worse candidate is that he is the best candidate; i.e., in a certain sense, the most obvious. I will say that I would put some money on the proposition that it is either Jaime or Arya that kills Cersei.

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48 minutes ago, Brother Seamus said:

I think she's on her way home after killing Raff in the mercy sample chapter. she will not complete her fm training, she will not retain any ability to change her face, and the fm will not send her on any further missions. She will not be no one. She will return to being Arya of house Stark. I don't know if she will leave the FM or they will kick her out; or whether they will let her go her way peacefully, or she will be looking over her shoulder for the rest of her life. My guess is that she leaves, and they let her go in peace. and, I predict the next time we see arya after the mercy chapter is in westeros. there could be a transitional chapter where she has some kind of confrontation with the kindly man and/or finds a ship to take her to westeros, but I think it's more likely she just appears at some dramatic moment, perhaps cutting walder frey's throat or leading a pack of wolves with Nymeria in an attack on some Frey soldiers.

I think is she does leave the FM after killing Raff (we get the hint that she is saying goodbye to the Mercy identity at the end of her Winds chapter) I think Arya might be taken in by The Black Pearl courtesan before she actually leaves for Westeros. The Black Pearl has already taken interest in Arya, and GRRM makes a point of re-introducing this new character in the Mercy and Arya's own fascination with her is made obvious. This is a continued interest in courtesans is something GRRM has carried over through many of Arya's Braavos chapters. 

Quote

The courtesans of Braavos were famed across the world. Singers sang of them, goldsmiths and jewelers showered them with gifts, craftsmen begged for the honor of their custom, merchant princes paid royal ransoms to have them on their arms at balls and feasts and mummer shows, and bravos slew each other in their names. As she pushed her barrow along the canals, Cat would sometimes glimpse one of them floating by, on her way to an evening with some lover. Every courtesan had her own barge, and servants to pole her to her trysts. The Poetess always had a book to hand, the Moonshadow wore only white and silver, and the Merling Queen was never seen without her Mermaids, four young maidens in the blush of their first flowering who held her train and did her hair. Each courtesan was more beautiful than the last. Even the Veiled Lady was beautiful, though only those she took as lovers ever saw her face. - Cat of the Canals

She is Blind Beth and Arya tells the Kindly Man that the Merling Queen's new mermaid is lovely. KM calls her out lol This is an interesting evolution in Arya's feelings towards very feminine qualities. Now imagine Arya learning from one of the most famous courtesans - the one that just so happens to be a Targaryen decedent. How very interesting. 

Quote

 

"The Merling Queen has chosen a new Mermaid to take the place of the one that drowned. She is the daughter of a Prestayn serving maid, thirteen and penniless, but lovely."

"So are they all, at the beginning," said the priest, "but you cannot know that she is lovely unless you have seen her with your own eyes, and you have none. Who are you, child?"

"No one."

"Blind Beth the beggar girl is who I see. She is a wretched liar, that one." - Blind Beth 

 

 

When Arya leaves Braavos, it will likely be after meeting Jeyne Poole, Arya's Pretender, who is currently with the Iron Bank operative Tycho Nestoris. Once they find Jon "dead" at the Wall, leaving Jeyne there would be impossible. The links between the FM/IronBank become even more worthy of examination. Arya will also find out about Jon's stabbing at this point. That plus meeting the fake Arya will be the two triggers that send Arya Stark home. But she will return to Westeros a very different girl, a maiden and pretty much nothing like the little girl that left on Titan's Daughter.

 

 

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Arya will leave when she's ready for it. I think the FM kindof see her as someone who is not just trained to be an assassin but who has a special link to the Many Faced God, that she sort of knows who's time is up. The reason why they want to train her is so that she does not confuse "her personal desire" with "knowing who's time is up".

Raff is a gift. Mercy thinks the MFGod sent him to her. Also, before she even has seen him and arrived at the theater, she wakes and thinks this will be her last day and obviously prepares for a special job (rape+death): separate coins, a key and the sword hidden in pockets and sleeve. Then she goes to the theater and all that's in the script of the mummer's play is "the rape", but not "death". The coins, key (think keyholder) and sword (true steel, not theater make-believe sword) suggests she must frame someone somehow and cause a scandal. We know from aDwD that the Iron Bank is backing Stannis. They're dumping Cersei. But imo they'll go about it the sly way. If there's a scandal that erupts in Braavos that points to KL's envoy Lord Harry Swyft, then the news spreads both in Essos AND Westeros that the Lannisters lost their backing of the Iron Bank, publically for the scandal. Now guess who the sellsword companies will be flocking to? Certainly NOT the Lannisters, because there's no guarantee they'll get paid.

Mercy's job is to create the scandal, and she has several scenarios at her disposal. When she recognizes Raff though, she knows he's the ideal set-up for the scandal. Raff's colleague knows he was a Gregor man and sees him take a girl-child who hasn't even flowered yet to somewhere private. Raff doesn't return. Mercy does not show up at work the next day at the theater. Someone calls on her at her rented room. They see all that blood. In the public's eye who killed who here? The small, kind, always smiling pretty girl-child actress of 11 who chastices anybody reaching for her titties (that she doesn't have yet) OR the big Westerosi guard who talked of murdering an actor and bragged about the good raping times with Gregor? The public will think that Raff killed Mercy and dumped her in the canals and then fled. Big scandal. Public demanding to kick that Harry Swyft and their child-raping murderers out of the harbor back to King's Landing and the Iron Bank makes the official statement that "Sorry, we cannot lend you anything anymore, nor extend your loans."

Mercy dies, no one returns to HoBaW and gets a pat on her back for a job well done, and new training. ETA: And we'll know that was the plan as Harry Swyft returns to KL with the bad news, at some small council with Cersei as POV.

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57 minutes ago, sweetsunray said:

Arya will leave when she's ready for it. I think the FM kindof see her as someone who is not just trained to be an assassin but who has a special link to the Many Faced God, that she sort of knows who's time is up. The reason why they want to train her is so that she does not confuse "her personal desire" with "knowing who's time is up".

Raff is a gift. Mercy thinks the MFGod sent him to her. Also, before she even has seen him and arrived at the theater, she wakes and thinks this will be her last day and obviously prepares for a special job (rape+death): separate coins, a key and the sword hidden in pockets and sleeve. Then she goes to the theater and all that's in the script of the mummer's play is "the rape", but not "death". The coins, key (think keyholder) and sword (true steel, not theater make-believe sword) suggests she must frame someone somehow and cause a scandal. We know from aDwD that the Iron Bank is backing Stannis. They're dumping Cersei. But imo they'll go about it the sly way. If there's a scandal that erupts in Braavos that points to KL's envoy Lord Harry Swyft, then the news spreads both in Essos AND Westeros that the Lannisters lost their backing of the Iron Bank, publically for the scandal. Now guess who the sellsword companies will be flocking to? Certainly NOT the Lannisters, because there's no guarantee they'll get paid.

Mercy's job is to create the scandal, and she has several scenarios at her disposal. When she recognizes Raff though, she knows he's the ideal set-up for the scandal. Raff's colleague knows he was a Gregor man and sees him take a girl-child who hasn't even flowered yet to somewhere private. Raff doesn't return. Mercy does not show up at work the next day at the theater. Someone calls on her at her rented room. They see all that blood. In the public's eye who killed who here? The small, kind, always smiling pretty girl-child actress of 11 who chastices anybody reaching for her titties (that she doesn't have yet) OR the big Westerosi guard who talked of murdering an actor and bragged about the good raping times with Gregor? The public will think that Raff killed Mercy and dumped her in the canals and then fled. Big scandal. Public demanding to kick that Harry Swyft and their child-raping murderers out of the harbor back to King's Landing and the Iron Bank makes the official statement that "Sorry, we cannot lend you anything anymore, nor extend your loans."

Mercy dies, no one returns to HoBaW and gets a pat on her back for a job well done, and new training.

I love reading your posts! Always giving excellent insight and you paint a very clear picture. 

Arya returns, the Kindly Man does what next? They understand she has this gift of knowing who the MFG wants dead. They send her to her next place of training, after completing her mummers training with Izembaro: the way she kills Raff puts all her acting/mummers skills to use. What does the Kindly Man? And how does that eventually culminate in her leaving Braavos? 

Also with the political trouble Mercy causes by Raff's death, Harry Swyft being sent away and the Lannisters getting cut off... With the Iron Bank already making loans to Stannis, was this something pre-planned with the FM and the Iron Bank? If so, with Tycho know where the true Arya Stark is? 

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20 minutes ago, DutchArya said:

Arya returns, the Kindly Man does what next? They understand she has this gift of knowing who the MFG wants dead. They send her to her next place of training, after completing her mummers training with Izembaro: the way she kills Raff puts all her acting/mummers skills to use. What does the Kindly Man? And how does that eventually culminate in her leaving Braavos? 

IMO? I'd say first training a skill at the House, like the blinding, but another sense instead, another "handicap", together with learning glamors and more specifics about the faces, and then under the wings of a courtesan to lead her into her oncoming womanhood, since the waif cannot do that. She gets a new mission (possibly while servicing the courtesan, like a handmaiden or companion). She completes it or she gets the sense that the target's time of life was not yet done. She has some encounter or some news during and decides to return to Westeros after that.

 

31 minutes ago, DutchArya said:

Also with the political trouble Mercy causes by Raff's death, Harry Swyft being sent away and the Lannisters getting cut off... With the Iron Bank already making loans to Stannis, was this something pre-planned with the FM and the Iron Bank? If so, with Tycho know where the true Arya Stark is?

Yup: the IB hired the FM for a mission to sabotage Harry Swyft as envoy in Braavos and create a public scandal that enables the IB to wipe their hands off Cersei and the Lannister regime.

Tycho possibly knows or not. Not sure on that yet. I don't think the FM keyhold (kindly man) tells the other Braavos true keyholders more than they need to know. But it may have been relayed for Braavos interest reasons.

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2 hours ago, sweetsunray said:

Arya will leave when she's ready for it. I think the FM kindof see her as someone who is not just trained to be an assassin but who has a special link to the Many Faced God, that she sort of knows who's time is up. The reason why they want to train her is so that she does not confuse "her personal desire" with "knowing who's time is up".

Raff is a gift. Mercy thinks the MFGod sent him to her. Also, before she even has seen him and arrived at the theater, she wakes and thinks this will be her last day and obviously prepares for a special job (rape+death): separate coins, a key and the sword hidden in pockets and sleeve. Then she goes to the theater and all that's in the script of the mummer's play is "the rape", but not "death". The coins, key (think keyholder) and sword (true steel, not theater make-believe sword) suggests she must frame someone somehow and cause a scandal. We know from aDwD that the Iron Bank is backing Stannis. They're dumping Cersei. But imo they'll go about it the sly way. If there's a scandal that erupts in Braavos that points to KL's envoy Lord Harry Swyft, then the news spreads both in Essos AND Westeros that the Lannisters lost their backing of the Iron Bank, publically for the scandal. Now guess who the sellsword companies will be flocking to? Certainly NOT the Lannisters, because there's no guarantee they'll get paid.

Mercy's job is to create the scandal, and she has several scenarios at her disposal. When she recognizes Raff though, she knows he's the ideal set-up for the scandal. Raff's colleague knows he was a Gregor man and sees him take a girl-child who hasn't even flowered yet to somewhere private. Raff doesn't return. Mercy does not show up at work the next day at the theater. Someone calls on her at her rented room. They see all that blood. In the public's eye who killed who here? The small, kind, always smiling pretty girl-child actress of 11 who chastices anybody reaching for her titties (that she doesn't have yet) OR the big Westerosi guard who talked of murdering an actor and bragged about the good raping times with Gregor? The public will think that Raff killed Mercy and dumped her in the canals and then fled. Big scandal. Public demanding to kick that Harry Swyft and their child-raping murderers out of the harbor back to King's Landing and the Iron Bank makes the official statement that "Sorry, we cannot lend you anything anymore, nor extend your loans."

Mercy dies, no one returns to HoBaW and gets a pat on her back for a job well done, and new training.

Well said, sweetsunray. I too don't believe she'll leave the FM that easily.

GRRM has clearly built up the FM to have a larger presence in the overall story than simply being a training house for Arya. We have the matter of Jaqen/Pate in the Citadel, their connection to the Doom of Valyria (curiously, TWOIAF didn't go into detail there, indicating that the information on the Doom will come from the main series), the similarities between the Children's Magic and FM Magic, Euron's dragon egg, so on.

If there's anyone who's in prime position to uncover the secrets and plans of the FM, it's Arya. There's hardly any narrative sense for her to leave the FM now itself and go back to Westeros to kill a couple of people (seriously, what does she do after that?). IMO, it makes for a far more intriguing story for her to be giving us insight into the entire motivations of the FM, and it opens up the possibility of her having a much larger role in this series than just killing some characters.

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1 hour ago, Little Scribe of Naath said:

Well said, sweetsunray. I too don't believe she'll leave the FM that easily.

GRRM has clearly built up the FM to have a larger presence in the overall story than simply being a training house for Arya. We have the matter of Jaqen/Pate in the Citadel, their connection to the Doom of Valyria (curiously, TWOIAF didn't go into detail there, indicating that the information on the Doom will come from the main series), the similarities between the Children's Magic and FM Magic, Euron's dragon egg, so on.

If there's anyone who's in prime position to uncover the secrets and plans of the FM, it's Arya. There's hardly any narrative sense for her to leave the FM now itself and go back to Westeros to kill a couple of people (seriously, what does she do after that?). IMO, it makes for a far more intriguing story for her to be giving us insight into the entire motivations of the FM, and it opens up the possibility of her having a much larger role in this series than just killing some characters.

Yes, it's not a martial arts training camp. It's magic, political and religious. Sure she'll leave, just like Bran will leave Bloodraven's cave at some point and Sansa will emerge from the Vale. Bran won't be a tree. Arya will never be no one. And Sansa will never be a mini-LF. Oh and Rickon will return from Skagos too. Arya's story is her story and how she has an impact, even over a distance on Westeros, while she gets to know people (secondary and tertiary characters) of her story or reconnects with such characters of her story. She's not meant to be a secondary character in Dany's story, or Sansa's or even Jon's. Nor are any of them secondary characters in her story. Of course it will conjoin at some point, but that imo will be aDoS and not tWoW. She's got some sowing to do first ;)

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Loved sweetsuray's post. Very interesting. When I first read Mercy, I felt she was in hot water with the FM for the unsanctioned killing. Now, perhaps not.

In terms of a 'hit', let's just examine the list. Of the 13 names on it, 7 are dead: With Arya present for six of them, I think (Chiswyk and Weese are 2 of Arya's 3; she sees Vargo's bear kill Amory Lorch; Polliver and the Tickler are eliminated by the Hound and Arya at the Inn at the Crossroads; she does Raff the Sweetling, or Mercy does).That's six.  King Joffrey is dead. That's seven.

Arya removed the Hound from the list, and she left him to die anyway. She thinks he's dead. She's wrong but doesn't know it. Ser Gregor is dead (sort of). That's nine. That leaves Dunsen (not real important). Ser Ilyn. Ser Meryn. And Cersei. The Freys aren't on the list since she didn't know their names. Or that Roose was involved as well. Or Tywin (who is dead anyway).

So, if it is someone on the list, it almost has to be Cersei. Though Ser Meryn would come close. Cesei is the last name on the list, FWIW. She's at fault for most of the ills to House Stark (though not the Red Wedding, she is still a Lannister). Lady.  MIcah. Ned. Sansa. She's in all that. She could put on Myrcella's face and kill Cersei. Arya is two years older, but likely smaller/shorter than Myrcella for her age.

How she gets there, I have no idea.

 

 

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