Let's Find The Swords

[Seams]

I know you're looking for clues that will help to locate the literal swords, so maybe this is off-topic. An excerpt posted on another thread led me to recall some other allusions to sword names that I had noted in passing and I found a few others using the search site:

If I find proof that the Lannisters murdered Jon Arryn . . .”

He felt Catelyn tremble in his arms. Her scarred hands clung to him. “If,” she said, “what then my love?”

That was the most dangerous part, Ned knew. “All justice flows from the king,” he told her. “When I know the truth, I must go to Robert.”

(AGoT, Eddard IV)

There are numerous examples of literal and threatened eating of hearts so, like the example with justice and truth (above), the words may be just coincidence. But here is an example with a blade that seems to be relevant to Heart Eater:

The knight raised his voice instead. "Joffrey is the black worm eating the heart of the realm! Darkness was his father, and death his mother! Destroy him before he corrupts you all! Destroy them all, queen whore and king worm, vile dwarf and whispering spider, the false flowers. Save yourselves!" One of the gold cloaks knocked the man off his feet, but he continued to shout. "The scouring fire will come! King Stannis will return!"

Joffrey lurched to his feet. "I'm king! Kill him! Kill him now! I command it." He chopped down with his hand, a furious, angry gesture . . . and screeched in pain when his arm brushed against one of the sharp metal fangs that surrounded him. The bright crimson samite of his sleeve turned a darker shade of red as his blood soaked through it. "Mother!" he wailed.

(ACoK, Sansa VIII)

"Dark" and "sister" are pretty common words, so I looked for a passage where the words were linked; where the sister was described as dark:

"Your place." The voice echoed; it was a hundred voices, a thousand, the voices of all the Lannisters since Lann the Clever, who'd lived at the dawn of days. But most of all it was his father's voice, and beside Lord Tywin stood his sister, pale and beautiful, a torch burning in her hand. Joffrey was there as well, the son they'd made together, and behind them a dozen more dark shapes with golden hair.

(ASoS, Jaime VI)

Stannis gave him a sour look. "Not for me, ser. I want no widows wailing in my wake. The women will remain here, with the old, the wounded, and the children. They will serve as hostages for the loyalty of their husbands and fathers. The wildling men will form my van. The Magnar will command them, with their own chiefs as serjeants. First, though, we must needs arm them."

(ADwD, Jon IV)

Like the Dark Sister excerpt, here the Lady is described as Forlorn:

Lord Ramsay had already left the hall. His bride, forlorn and seemingly forgotten, sat hunched and silent beneath the banner of House Stark, clutching a silver goblet in both hands. Judging from the way she looked at him when he approached, she had emptied that goblet more than once. Perhaps she hoped that if she drank enough, the ordeal would pass her by. Theon knew better. "Lady Arya," he said. "Come. It is time you did your duty."

(ADwD, The Prince of Winterfell)

This passage from TWoW is what motivated me to post this comment on the thread:

Spoiler

 

Raff the Sweetling looked up sharply as the long thin blade came sliding from her sleeve. She slipped it through his throat beneath the chin, twisted, and ripped it back out sideways with a single smooth slash. A fine red rain followed, and in his eyes the light went out.

(TWoW)

 

 

I acknowledge, these are all just the same words, and not references to the swords themselves. And some of these swords are not among your missing, "Most Wanted" list. But it strikes me that many of these references occur in passages where blades or swords are featured - Catelyn has just given Ned the dagger from the attack on Bran (and re-reading the scene has highlighted details about Ned personifying a sword of which Catelyn takes hold) as well as Ned's reference to the King's Justice; Jaime's dream where his father has given him a sword; Stannis about to use Night's Watch weapons to arm the wildlings. Maybe the names of swords aren't supposed to send us on a hunt for literal swords, but are clues to be found in the text, pointing us towards significant insights into characters.

[Curled Finger]

4 hours ago, Seams said:

I know you're looking for clues that will help to locate the literal swords, so maybe this is off-topic. An excerpt posted on another thread led me to recall some other allusions to sword names that I had noted in passing and I found a few others using the search site:

If I find proof that the Lannisters murdered Jon Arryn . . .”

He felt Catelyn tremble in his arms. Her scarred hands clung to him. “If,” she said, “what then my love?”

That was the most dangerous part, Ned knew. “All justice flows from the king,” he told her. “When I know the truth, I must go to Robert.”

(AGoT, Eddard IV)

There are numerous examples of literal and threatened eating of hearts so, like the example with justice and truth (above), the words may be just coincidence. But here is an example with a blade that seems to be relevant to Heart Eater:

The knight raised his voice instead. "Joffrey is the black worm eating the heart of the realm! Darkness was his father, and death his mother! Destroy him before he corrupts you all! Destroy them all, queen whore and king worm, vile dwarf and whispering spider, the false flowers. Save yourselves!" One of the gold cloaks knocked the man off his feet, but he continued to shout. "The scouring fire will come! King Stannis will return!"

Joffrey lurched to his feet. "I'm king! Kill him! Kill him now! I command it." He chopped down with his hand, a furious, angry gesture . . . and screeched in pain when his arm brushed against one of the sharp metal fangs that surrounded him. The bright crimson samite of his sleeve turned a darker shade of red as his blood soaked through it. "Mother!" he wailed.

(ACoK, Sansa VIII)

"Dark" and "sister" are pretty common words, so I looked for a passage where the words were linked; where the sister was described as dark:

"Your place." The voice echoed; it was a hundred voices, a thousand, the voices of all the Lannisters since Lann the Clever, who'd lived at the dawn of days. But most of all it was his father's voice, and beside Lord Tywin stood his sister, pale and beautiful, a torch burning in her hand. Joffrey was there as well, the son they'd made together, and behind them a dozen more dark shapes with golden hair.

(ASoS, Jaime VI)

Stannis gave him a sour look. "Not for me, ser. I want no widows wailing in my wake. The women will remain here, with the old, the wounded, and the children. They will serve as hostages for the loyalty of their husbands and fathers. The wildling men will form my van. The Magnar will command them, with their own chiefs as serjeants. First, though, we must needs arm them."

(ADwD, Jon IV)

Like the Dark Sister excerpt, here the Lady is described as Forlorn:

Lord Ramsay had already left the hall. His bride, forlorn and seemingly forgotten, sat hunched and silent beneath the banner of House Stark, clutching a silver goblet in both hands. Judging from the way she looked at him when he approached, she had emptied that goblet more than once. Perhaps she hoped that if she drank enough, the ordeal would pass her by. Theon knew better. "Lady Arya," he said. "Come. It is time you did your duty."

(ADwD, The Prince of Winterfell)

This passage from TWoW is what motivated me to post this comment on the thread:

  Hide contents

 

Raff the Sweetling looked up sharply as the long thin blade came sliding from her sleeve. She slipped it through his throat beneath the chin, twisted, and ripped it back out sideways with a single smooth slash. A fine red rain followed, and in his eyes the light went out.

(TWoW)

 

 

I acknowledge, these are all just the same words, and not references to the swords themselves. And some of these swords are not among your missing, "Most Wanted" list. But it strikes me that many of these references occur in passages where blades or swords are featured - Catelyn has just given Ned the dagger from the attack on Bran (and re-reading the scene has highlighted details about Ned personifying a sword of which Catelyn takes hold) as well as Ned's reference to the King's Justice; Jaime's dream where his father has given him a sword; Stannis about to use Night's Watch weapons to arm the wildlings. Maybe the names of swords aren't supposed to send us on a hunt for literal swords, but are clues to be found in the text, pointing us towards significant insights into characters.

I love this, Seams.   Hadn't thought to look for the words simply together, and I've ignored many of the passages you supplied because the statements didn't relate directly to the swords.   Nice. Nice. Nice.   I'd like to see a new topic from you addressing this at length.   I'm working on a timeline for the swords and beefing up my spread sheet.   I hope that because you've found some allusions to character that you're not giving up on the hunt for our literal swords!   What says these passages aren't pointing us to the Dozen Companions!   

[XIIIsnow]

@Curled Finger I have a question about you sword math  I am following your posts all over the forum for some time and I think that most of your theory about "geographical distribution" of the swords a nd their possible voyage to the north is rather awesome, but here's what bothers me. There are different stories preserved in different shapes and forms regarding the Long NIght, Last Hero and his companions. Is it possible (and I know that thousands of years passed) that such info as valuable as VS as ultimate weapon for defeating the Others was lost? We have awesome stories, and many details on that event so I would expect that Old Nan keep saying something like: only the Ice could beat the Winter....just thinking randomly

[Curled Finger]

5 hours ago, XIIIsnow said:

@Curled Finger I have a question about you sword math  I am following your posts all over the forum for some time and I think that most of your theory about "geographical distribution" of the swords a nd their possible voyage to the north is rather awesome, but here's what bothers me. There are different stories preserved in different shapes and forms regarding the Long NIght, Last Hero and his companions. Is it possible (and I know that thousands of years passed) that such info as valuable as VS as ultimate weapon for defeating the Others was lost? We have awesome stories, and many details on that event so I would expect that Old Nan keep saying something like: only the Ice could beat the Winter....just thinking randomly

Oh stop it you're making me blush!   It's all just supposition and theory until all the books are written and read and there is no way to defend an idea any longer.  My sword math leaves me with questions, too.  Now, I love ideas, if you've been reading you know this is fact.   Knowledge that a weapon like VS could defeat the Others? Probably not.   I recently participated in a really fun topic wherein the OP thinks right along these same lines.   My problem with this is that there was no VS 8000 years ago.   The Valyrian Freehold was established roughly 5000 years ago.    I don't think the technology was there at the original Long Night.   But they had dragon steel--whatever that is.   All we really have is Jon and Sam spitballing that dragon steel may be VS.   It would make sense that it would be except for the dates.   Which are all screwed up if you ask me.   I hate myself for even bringing it up because I don't want Dawn to be Lightbringer because it's so commonly assumed it will be.   Reluctantly I will tell you that Dawn is rumored to be 10,000 years old and is at least 2000 years old.   It's ancient compared to every sword we have in play.   It's rumored to be made from the heart of a meteor.   Again, rumors!  But I do think this is the way it will shake out.   VS is such relatively new technology and certainly new to Westeros, I just can't see it really being dragon steel.   If you can find a way to even the dates up I will be on board 100%.  

Still I dig your Nan dialogue and it would have been a very cool touch.  (Bad pun intended, sorry!)  I'm afraid Ice has gone by the wayside and it will not be reforged.   I think the whole object behind reforging Ice instead of simply applying a new pommel is to get our VS sword count up to the number 12.  Stupid move on Tywin's part, if you ask me.   Brightroar was a greatsword.    A bitchen VS sword for each of our fated hero companions.   Whomever ends up taking on the role of the Last Hero (team Bran here!!) will carry the dragon steel.  

I love this old topic.  Never ever get tired of the swords!   Let me know what you think when you have time.   

[XIIIsnow]

@Curled Finger That's where I was going  We know that last Ice is even much younger than the Original one, and there were no VS during the first Night, at least that we know of  so, we have to assume that people of Westeros had some other weaponry at their display??? VS were made in Valyria, but DS could be something much older  we know that Valyrians only tamed the dragons, and that Dragons were much older. I specially like excerpt from the Septon Barth's unnatural history:

"In Asshai, the tales are many and confused, but certain texts—all impossibly ancient—claim that dragons first came from the Shadow, a place where all of our learning fails us. These Asshai'i histories say that a people so ancient they had no name first tamed dragons in the Shadow and brought them to Valyria, teaching the Valyrians their arts before departing from the annals. "

So, maybe VS had something in common with DS, but I would like to think that there is something much older and sinister

[Curled Finger]

Well count me in then @XIIIsnow.  We don't know anything about original Ice, do we?   I think it's great.   And I think you've been thinking about this.   I would love to read the whole theory if you've got more?   6 posts and I will bet the farm you've read these books multiple times.   It is a great idea.   Make a topic, my friend.   We've got some really brilliant world book detectives around here.   I'm just a sword geek so I"m not able to speak with authority on the ancient things.   But as a geek, I can tell you I like this whole train of though and encourage you to flesh it out if you haven't already.  

[sweetsunray]

10 hours ago, Curled Finger said:

 I'm afraid Ice has gone by the wayside and it will not be reforged.   I think the whole object behind reforging Ice instead of simply applying a new pommel is to get our VS sword count up to the number 12.

Agreed. I really hoped and wished it was reforged for sentimental reasons, but functionally Ice becoming Oathkeeper and Widow's Wail brings the count up of the number of available swords to get the 12 + 1 team a la the Last Hero. I guess we'll have to comfort ourselves with the fact that it wasn't the original Ice to begin with, and I have been wondering whether the original Ice may actually have been a literal icy sword, an Other sword that was taken from them (or the NK's sword) and used against them.... There's something to be said for defeating the enemy with its "own weapons" after all, which Joffrey suggests - kill a dog with a dog.

[Khal Shaggydog]

Littlefinger smuggling the sword out of KL with the tapestries is genius. That is such a hilariously significant move  - are they Targaryen tapestries so LF can declare his eventual allegiance to Dany? Do they contain some other information? Secrets of dragonbreeding/dragontaming? Are they just nice and fancy to distract the KL crowd from Littlefinger making bigger moves? At this point, they still think he is on their side, a fancy little guy sucking up to the eternally powerful, so that feint could fit his narrative with Cersei that he is concerned with trappings of power.

But I love the idea of him grabbing that sword when there is no one particularly competent to keep track of it. Tywin should be pretty aware of that - he is the one that crossed some serious honor lines with Ice to get his family back in the VS club, but did he pay that much attention to the details of the sword? And LF taking it back to Ned's daughter is the kind of crap he would pull.

I also do think there has to be some connection between BR and Howland Reed. I agree with most posters, BR kept Dark Sister for as long as he wanted it, which meant taking it on his quest to the Wall (he was searching, there is no way he just goes along with a "banishment"). I dont think its Longclaw, but am not totally convinced it isnt. That story is supported if Joer just lies a little to Jon about timing. But i do believe there is more to the connection between BR and the Reeds.

Meera and Jojen both know about him, from both Jojen's green dreams and their father. They know to go find Bran. They know to head north to the tree. BR and Howland are both confirmed greenseers, Howland most certainly from the KOTLT, as he took a trip to the isle of faces. So perhaps BR stashed the sword there? Perhaps Howland knows that it was deposited with the Mormonts?

 

Also, lets not sleep on the valyrian steel dagger, and the awesome arakh. Serious weapons.

[sweetsunray]

20 minutes ago, Khal Shaggydog said:

Howland are both confirmed greenseers, Howland most certainly from the KOTLT, as he took a trip to the isle of faces.

Actually HR is not a confirmed greenseer. He's a confirmed magician.

[Khal Shaggydog]

20 minutes ago, sweetsunray said:

Actually HR is not a confirmed greenseer. He's a confirmed magician.

Like, card tricks and rabbits out of a hat? Or Nick Cage in that movie with the guy from Undeclared?

 

[sweetsunray]

12 minutes ago, Khal Shaggydog said:

Like, card tricks and rabbits out of a hat? Or Nick Cage in that movie with the guy from Undeclared?

 

Here is the relevant quote that has Meera clarify that HR has no "green dreams" but knows "magic".

 

Quote

 

"Once there was a curious lad who lived in the Neck. He was small like all crannogmen, but brave and smart and strong as well. He grew up hunting and fishing and climbing trees, and learned all the magics of my people."

Bran was almost certain he had never heard this story. "Did he have green dreams like Jojen?"

"No," said Meera, "but he could breathe mud and run on leaves, and change earth to water and water to earth with no more than a whispered word. He could talk to trees and weave words and make castles appear and disappear." (aSoS, Bran II)

 

 

A greenseer is someone who is a skinchanger who has green dreams. HR does not have green dreams, hence he is not a greenseer. He does however know water and earth magic. HR wanted to learn more than crannog magic and went to the Green Men at the Gods Eye. We can speculate he learned other magic there. So, he's a magician in the sense of a "sorcerer" who can do spells.

[Khal Shaggydog]

Sweetsunray, you are, of course, correct. I was correlating his magic and specifically his trip to the Isle of Faces to put forward that he has to have some kind of contact, or at least awareness of Bloodraven, and vice versa. They are both Neck deep in COTF magic (pun?). Greenseer was not correctly applied to Howland. green magic acquaintance is probably more apt.

Talking to trees is what these guys do, so I just think there is some overlap between them. Im not buying much about secret births, Jon/Meera twins, or a Dayne in hiding, but I cant shake the feeling of some older connection between BR and Howland through the COTF, and with that connection, there might be some shared knowledge that may or may not have to do with the Targaryen blade Dark Sister.

[sweetsunray]

I can certainly agree that HR would know what greenseers are, and it's enitrely possible the Green Men and HR on the isle communicated with BR or had some type of contact. It was the claim that he's a confirmed greenseer I corrected you on. It's not an uncommon, but mistaken belief. 's all. We all make mistakes at times - I do too. Being corrected may make me blush, but it's usually just meant to help.

[Khal Shaggydog]

Ive had to step in and correct people on the whole "skinchanger" vs. "warg" usage. No biggie. Im all for the precise usage of language.

I like this idea of assembling a specific number of swords that can do battle with the Others. Little bit of poetry to have them scattered throughout the 7K, sitting and waiting for the adults to get together to team up, cast aside internal differences, and subsume their egos to the greater good. Or some of them (like Jon) know that is what they need to do, but they dont do it and the series ends in winter. But pulling together characters like Corbry, Tarly, and the others with VS blades, such as the random Iron Islanders, the Hightowers, Brienne and Jon, is an attractive potential plot arc. I also think that it gives the possibility of the successors to the current holders to take over their roles of wielders of these important weapons. Such as Dickon Tarly stepping up, etc. And Tyrion gets the dagger to kill somebody.

[Khal Shaggydog]

Another thought Ive always tied to theories of missing VS swords is the fact that the maesters seemingly have some supply of Valyrian Steel, and the means to work it, at least into some chain links, as well as the mask and rod of a certain mysterious maester.

[Curled Finger]

13 hours ago, sweetsunray said:

Agreed. I really hoped and wished it was reforged for sentimental reasons, but functionally Ice becoming Oathkeeper and Widow's Wail brings the count up of the number of available swords to get the 12 + 1 team a la the Last Hero. I guess we'll have to comfort ourselves with the fact that it wasn't the original Ice to begin with, and I have been wondering whether the original Ice may actually have been a literal icy sword, an Other sword that was taken from them (or the NK's sword) and used against them.... There's something to be said for defeating the enemy with its "own weapons" after all, which Joffrey suggests - kill a dog with a dog.

I wish you had joined the conversation in the beginning--it was a blast.   I didn't know other people saw what I saw until you gave me a gentle 12 + 1 wink in another thread.  Fortunately, there could be another book coming some day and we know it's got VS armor so all my fingers and toes are crossed for some hidden VS swords to be revealed!  I like where this thing is headed.  Thanks for stopping in sweetsunray, it's always a pleasure to hear what's on your mind.   

[Curled Finger]

@Khal Shaggydog, geez Louise you have a lot on your mind!   I actually went through your posts at work and made some notes.   I don't want to go into Bloodraven and Howland Reed here.   This is our special place for our special swords.  But it would be an interesting conversation if you ever needed something to create a topic about.   So let's get to it, shall we?   

The tapestries idea was great.  Sadly, we know that WW is still in Kings Landing from an SSM.  It would suck, but I will find the quote if you need me to.   The tapestries themselves decorated the throne room when Robert was king.   They are pictorials of hunting scenes if I'm not mistaken.  If you read the Alayne chapter from TWOW you can find out all about them and what purpose they served.  

LC = DS  Negative, Hightower.  Dark Sister has a custom blade; a slim long sword fit for a woman's hand.  Longclaw is a big ass garden variety bastard sword.  Longclaw is just Longclaw and may be the most mysterious of our known blades.   You might laugh, but we talked about this in our Let's Figure Out The Mormonts discussion, among other places.  Go see what folks have to say about all the possible secret identities of Longclaw, it's a lot of fun.   I am with you in thinking Bloodraven took DS with him to the Wall and that he may well have been on a quest rather than punishment.  Take that ball and run with it.  That's another fascinating topic. 

I think every single piece of VS we have in story is important. LF's dagger sure got Tyrion in some trouble and I'm hoping we get to see the Celtigar's battle axe in action.  We saw Marwyn with his mask and rod, so I wonder if that isn't exactly how the glass candles work?  The point is each piece has a part to play.  Lots of folks believe the IT itself could be made into VS because it was Dragon flamed.  Maybe it could, but I doubt it.   It won't come down to armies facing off against the Others.   It didn't last time and all the swords are aligning to work it out to a hero and a dozen companions with a dozen VS swords.  The sword the hero will wield?  I reckon it has to be Lightbringer.  I've got multiple lunch and drink dates riding on Lightbringer absolutely not being made of Valyrian Steel.  Pick a date and I'll bet you too.   

I like that you have so many ideas about this.   You sure look like a sword geek in the making.   This topic has a companion piece called Let's Find the Heroes.   Do you see a pattern forming with the topic titles?  I would love for you to take a breath and see if you see things through my myrish lens.  12 VS swords and 12 Hero Companions.  Northbound.  Other butt kicking.  I'd love to see who you match to what and why.   I've got a list of 28 potential heroes and have only absolutely settled on 4.   The only match up I really have is Brienne and Oathkeeper.  It's not as easy as folks think putting these swords in the right hands.  I really liked Lady Forlorn for Sansa then I remembered Sansa couldn't fight her way out of a wet paper bag.  But Arya can.  Are you willing to see Arya die on a quest like this?  That kind of stuff.  I think you would be really good at this.  

I'm not trying to bring you down and hope you don't take my disagreement as such.  Your ideas are as good as any I've seen and at least 2 of them are worthy of their own topic.   Do it, Man!   Thanks for having some fun with us in this dusty corner.    

[Curled Finger]

@Khal Shaggydog!  Brand new search engine!  Here is the SSM verbatim from The Man...

[Where is the sword Widow's Wail?]

Still at the Red Keep, until such time as King Tommen is old enough to wield it.

[Khal Shaggydog]

14 hours ago, Curled Finger said:

@Khal Shaggydog!  Brand new search engine!  Here is the SSM verbatim from The Man...

[Where is the sword Widow's Wail?]

Still at the Red Keep, until such time as King Tommen is old enough to wield it.

I'll take the notes, but Im going to cling onto some possibility because I like the idea so much (I swear im not just pushing this for alternate facts). Do we know when GRRM was saying that and how close that hews to the current book timeline? Also, I always read SSM's as a balance between actual "author based fact" and "unreliable narrator/as far as we are told" facts...But yea, its still a distant speculation at this point. I also see the timeline GRRM gives (until Tommen is old enough) to imply its sitting somewhere and probably neglected by the morons that are left there. Which gives an opening to the snake in the grass LF to pilfer/possibly dummy up a replacement, etc. Yes - full on crackpot there.

Widows wail in KL then, in relation to finding the blades of the 12/13 heroes, can be there for sometime to take on. Im slightly on board with the Loras theory...jeweled blade that Tommen likes and Cersei wouldnt realize the significance of...and that also could potentially tie Loras into some kind of redemptive, butterfly like arc. That would raised the estimation of the Tyrells greatly, and give a little mirror to Jaime's post-KG redemption arc. Or it could be picked up by Jaime himself, or someone wild like Aurane who can seize onto the Valyrian blood link and his ability to quickly get north via his awesome ships.

I agree that Longclaw is just Longclaw, but that mostly rests on the fact that it seems a bit too presumptuous of anyone (ie: BR) to trust a generation or two with that deception. But...given the remotness of Bear Island, and when BR went up there, we're probably looking at Jeors father as the potential guy that took on that sword. So just one fireside lie to baby Jeor, and we've got a 300 year history. Its weak, but possible. Not sure what that achieves, unless the full story is also passed down at death, but there might be more to the story considering Jorah didnt sell it, and family honor didnt stop him from besmirching that...but perhaps some serious magic did stop him from making a move on the sword. I get the size comparison, but I do have a hard time putting too much stock in exact descriptions since they come from such wildly different times and sources. But I also dont like the overreliance on fake identities, so I'll keep LC as just LC, DS as just DS, and leave it at that.

Im also in agreement that there isnt VS in the iron throne. Too valuable, even to Aegon and sisters.

But..to the topic...I think the maesters are thick into this. Their proximity the the Hightowers, and Vigilance, is significant in my mind. Not just the name of the sword itself, but the repository of ancient knowledge, their actual relevance to the original Westerosi Targaryens, and their aloofness/magical insinuations/water access, makes me think they know more about the Long Night, the Others, and all that then say, the Tyrells. So I think they have an actual sword, and I think between them and the Maesters they know more than we do about Valyrian steel and how to work it, what its used for, etc. Marwyn is a fucking wild card - guy is rocking some VS bling. How precise do their smiths have to be to make a ring and a MASK out of this stuff? I mean, the rod and the ring he couldve picked up in Qohor or something, but no way he happened upon a random ArchMaester mask outside of Oldtown. So between their ability to work it and the intent to work it, they know its got a bigger purpose. I think they may be sitting on a blade or two as well, since a random Tyrion quote gives us a much much larger number in Westeros than we're dealing with. How did they get their hands on them? It would foremost require knowledge and access, (if we're assuming a Marwyn spearheaded conspiracy or plan), and no one more than a maester would have access or knowledge of a family's VS blades.

 

[Leo of House Cartel]

Hey guys I'm new around here and I must say it's an honour.

Great post OP, some wonderful ideas flying around.

In regards to Nightfall and Red Rain, does anyone find it strange that "The Blackest Pirate ever to Raise Sail" Euron Greyjoy seemingly makes no attempt to claim the highly sought after Valyrian blades for himself?

While I understand that taking the blades from the current owners would be a bad move politically as Euron is still in the process of stabilising his political rule amongst the Iron men, would Euron really have undermined his own rule by sending some catspaw to retrieve either Dark Sister or Red Rain? It's difficult to say with any certainty but in the wake of the kingsmoot, couldn't the Crows Eye have made an offer to an ambitious member of either House Drumm or Harlaw, something along the lines of "Bring me the blade and I'll give you one of the Shields, money etc. 

Valyrian Swords are near priceless artifacts which would go nicely with other items in Eurons collection. With all his plans of marrying Dany, gaining a dragon through his Valyrian horn and sitting the Iron Throne, one would assume that weilding a Valyrian Sword could be highly usefull symbolically for the new Iron King.

Take the history of Nightfall itself. Taken from a dead corsair by no less an Ironborn hero than the Red Kraken, Dalton Greyjoy. Nightfall is a physical embodiment of "paying the iron price", aswell as embodying House Greyjoys power and status.

Dalton was Lord of the Isles at the age of 15, returning from abroad to claim the dead lords Seastone Chair (similiar to Euron returning from exile to claim Balons chair) then openly defied the green party during the Dance of Dragons (perhaps similiar to Euron defying both the current regime in KL and planning to defy Dany). We know reaving songs are sung to this day recounting the raids of the Red Kraken, so why did Euron seem otherwise uninterested? This was his families sword after all, would it be to much trouble to orchestrate some "fall from a bridge" for Ser Harras?

 When the Red Kraken took the Seastone Chair, he commanded the building of ships, training of soldiers and such, his reasoning when ased?  "The storm is coming" - very similiar to Eurons boasts of "I am the storm".

Red Rain is anothert blade one would assume would catch Eurons Eye. Another physical embodiment of "paying the iron price" - the blade was taken from a knight  by Hilmar the Cunning, using nothing but "wits and a wooden cudgel". If we look at historical members of house Drumm, we see several nicknames which may hint at a connection to the "higher mysteries"- names such as "Raven-Feeder", "The Necro Mancer", "The Dread" and "Old Father"  (and make no mistake,  all this is total speculation at this point) . The Crows Eye seemingly has an interest in the dark arts, one has to wonder why he would allow Dunstan Drumm and his party to return to the Isles with such a valuable and potentially lore filled sword (if the Isles are indeed where they ended up) and risk the blade being stolen or even sold.

While we don't know how Nightfall passed to house Harlaw, the fact that it is now weilded by Ser Harras Harlaw raises an eyebrow. As someone who identifies as a knight, and has the blood of the green lands coursing through his veins, one could imagine the current Lord of Greyshield having several targets on his back. Surrounded by other Ironmen on the shields, what's really to stop someone like Nute the Barber from trying to steal the blade from this jumped up "sheep to the seven". This is something I'm sure Euron would have taken into account, and yet Euron not only allows Harlaw to keep Nightfall on Grey Shield, he also shows a certain disregard for the Shield Islands, seemingly positioning them as perhaps a diversion for potential Hightower or Redwyn naval forces, thus perhaps endangering the blade even more.

King Euron also has other Valyrian items in hs collection. Some of his toys I would like to turn my attention to are the Valyrian daggers which are unloaded from Eurons chest at the kingsmoot. The Captain of The Silence has become known for his open-handedness, making extravegant gifts left, right and centre. While we don't know exactly who recieved one of these daggers, one could imagine that if it's Eurons own loyal men who got the blades then those men would be of a certain low repute. Achieving political "sway" through gifting entire islands is one thing, but arming a crew of bloodthirsty reavers with such valuable weaponry seems odd. One reason could be the Crows Eyes affinity for the higher mysteries. Could Euron somehow be aware of the looming threat posed by the White Walkers? Maybe he's arming his men for "One last Storm"

This brings me to Dark Sister. (I apologize if I've waffled on a bit)

If the Euron=Bloodravens former apprentice theories have some semblance of thruth, I could certainly imagine the possibility of Lord Rivers gifting a young Crows Eye with the sword weilded by legendary dragons such as Visenya, the Dragon Knight, Rogue Prince etc. Of course if Euron ever made it to BRs cave then who's to say he didn't steal it.  Again this is all just speculation and I don't belive a word ive wrote but if Euron was already in possession of Dark Sister, this could explain his generority when it comes to the other VS blades he encounters. 

As a last point, I can't help but think the names of these swords fit nicely with Eurons current standing. 

Red Rain gives the image of a "sea of blood", imagery which surrounds several Euron related theories.

Nighfall fits well with the Crows Eyes placement as the third and maybe forth act villIain, aswell as the dark lore surrounding the Iron King himself. 

Dark Sister could mayhaps represent Eurons relationship with Dany.He seems to be a pretty corruptive force and If he intends to make her his queen, one could imagine he intends to corrupt her too. Thus maybe making a new mad king and turning Dany into a Dark Sister in her own way.