Nissa Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 I'm reading DOD and I'm on the Prince of Winterfell chapter. Something is not adding up for me maybe someone can help. Theon is made to give away fake Arya to Ramsy in marriage by Lady Dustin and the Boltons. The reasoning they give for that being necessary is that Theon can back up the claim that it actually is Arya to any of the lords in the north who are skeptical. I can't help but think the skeptical lords would be furious that he "killed" Bran and Rickon and thus ruin that whole crap idea in the first place. How is this a good plan? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadows and dust Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 The idea wasn't to make skeptical lords happy, it was to keep them from questioning the authenticity of the bride. Theon is the noble in the North most likely to know what Arya Stark looks like. Those in attendance can be furious all they like about Theon Greyjoy giving away Arya Stark, so long as they're biggest gripes about wedding are that Theon Greyjoy is giving away Arya Stark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nissa Posted April 22, 2016 Author Share Posted April 22, 2016 22 hours ago, shadows and dust said: The idea wasn't to make skeptical lords happy, it was to keep them from questioning the authenticity of the bride. Thanks for replying this is still bothering me. I'm not very good at conveying my thoughts (especially online). My whole problem with the storyline is that I wouldn't trust the authenticity of the bride based on their "proof". Although I guess that's the whole point is that eventually the northmen are going to rebel against the boltons regardless. I just think Theon being the one to vouch for Arya being the real one is kind of ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Drunkard Posted April 29, 2016 Share Posted April 29, 2016 Well, Theon isn't the only reason they're accepting the marriage. Roose outnumbers them, has a Frey army supporting him, and has plenty of their family members down at the Twins as hostages, so even if they don't believe they have to pretend to or risk being destroyed. Wyman brings this up regarding the Red Wedding: he doesn't believe the werewolf story and the Freys know it, but he has to pretend regardless or they'd kill his son. Theon himself just adds a layer of legitimacy. It might not be definitive but it's something, and likely to sway at least a few people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blade of Sunlight Posted April 29, 2016 Share Posted April 29, 2016 Well, not many people alive and in the North have seen Arya Stark recently, none know her better and Theon who was nearly her adoptive brother. People may hate Theon for killing Bran and Rickon but none of them know Arya closely enough to be able to discredit Theon's word. And as The Drunkard said, they have a sword over their heads (more like their sons' heads) and so are even less inclined to oppose Bolton on what would be a hard claim to prove anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nissa Posted May 2, 2016 Author Share Posted May 2, 2016 On April 29, 2016 at 7:01 AM, The Drunkard said: Well, Theon isn't the only reason they're accepting the marriage. Roose outnumbers them, has a Frey army supporting him, and has plenty of their family members down at the Twins as hostages, so even if they don't believe they have to pretend to or risk being destroyed. Wyman brings this up regarding the Red Wedding: he doesn't believe the werewolf story and the Freys know it, but he has to pretend regardless or they'd kill his son. Theon himself just adds a layer of legitimacy. It might not be definitive but it's something, and likely to sway at least a few people. On April 29, 2016 at 9:15 AM, Blade of Sunlight said: Well, not many people alive and in the North have seen Arya Stark recently, none know her better and Theon who was nearly her adoptive brother. People may hate Theon for killing Bran and Rickon but none of them know Arya closely enough to be able to discredit Theon's word. And as The Drunkard said, they have a sword over their heads (more like their sons' heads) and so are even less inclined to oppose Bolton on what would be a hard claim to prove anyway. Thanks for the reply. I was thinking about making a post about how it seems like a stretch that Ramsey has gotten away with so many crimes but I'm thinking now the same reasons apply. I know pre-Ned things were different in the north but it's surprising that one man was keeping the whole north together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wendel Shoemaker Posted May 4, 2016 Share Posted May 4, 2016 Is their someone else you propose would be able to authenticate Arya more than Theon? It's more of a formality really, most people don't fully believe it, but are also not willing to outright rebel. Having Theon vouch for Arya wasn't a part of the big master plan, it was just a convenience brought forward from happening to have Theon as a hostage. I'm sure using Theon was also a message to the other Lords about what happens when you mess witht he Boltons. It's definitely more credible than no one vouching for Arya, and again, everyone hating on Theon kind of takes the spotlight away from jeyne. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Wolf Smith Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 @Nissa, Keep reading. There is always more to this series, then most of us see the 1st time. This whole storyline centered around WF at that point of the books, has quite a lot of things happening. This thread really should be posted on the still reading section. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadows and dust Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 On 4/21/2016 at 1:38 PM, shadows and dust said: Those in attendance can be furious all they like about Theon Greyjoy giving away Arya Stark, so long as they're biggest gripes about wedding are that Theon Greyjoy is giving away Arya Stark. On 4/22/2016 at 0:05 PM, Nissa said: I just think Theon being the one to vouch for Arya being the real one is kind of ridiculous. In addition to him being a logical choice as was said early, I think it's a good ruse play. Theon giving FArya away is clever slight of hand. Think, if you don't want someone to watch your bride too closely, give the people something that will divert their attention. So long as they're staring daggers at Theon, they aren't trying to pierce your veil. It's why a magician always comes equipped with a scantily clad assistant - draw the eyes elsewhere. Anytime you go into a lie, your best bet to avoid scrutiny needed to unravel you, is to build many straw man arguments to distract from the issue at hand. If you get people invested on the periphery they can lose sight of the target issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nissa Posted May 12, 2016 Author Share Posted May 12, 2016 On May 10, 2016 at 3:32 AM, Black Wolf Smith said: @Nissa, Keep reading. There is always more to this series, then most of us see the 1st time. This whole storyline centered around WF at that point of the books, has quite a lot of things happening. This thread really should be posted on the still reading section. I'll keep that in mind for future posts thanks! I finished DwD a couple weeks ago @Wendel Shoemaker @shadows and dust I think you both had a similar though thanks for the insight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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