Jump to content

Redeeming Dorne


Eilif

Recommended Posts

15 hours ago, Ser Hyle said:

When it came time for Dorne, they had no interest in the convoluted politics between the knee-jerk elements and the long game/big picture planning of the viper in the grass. They wanted the charismatic and sexually liberal Oberyn taking KL by storm and then ending in a gruesome death, and they wanted his sexy and deadly bastard daughters, nothing else. Oberyn's arc in the show was great, and a fan favourite because it was closely based on the source material. Everything else Dorne related is original material, which is why the Sand Snakes and the Dornish subplot in general seems to be parachuted into the series from a 1980's B movie. "You want a good girl, but you need the bad pussy" says it all. There's no hope for redemption. The only hope is that the killing of Doran/Areo/Trystane is a killing of the subplot and a cutting of losses for the series.

I agree. Dorne plot in books is very political, and they don't really like that unless it involves the Lannisters, because the Lannisters fuck each other. I mean, what political plot they have done so far? Sansa marrying Roose? Come on, that had only one purpose. Even the Faith's actions have been simplified into "let's clean this place and start by killing all the gays".

I also agree with the opinion of Dorne being impossible to save. I mean, I guess someone with a lot of imagination and knowledge of the world of Ice and Fire could possibly come up with something, but they won't involve much of their times doing this. Also, people don't really like Dorne any more. Even if Ellaria suddenly reveals to own a dragon, people won't care. They failed to present likeable characters and you can't have a storyline without having characters that people feel empathy for.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm very dissapointed with the Dorne storyline in the show too. And I don't think, they can redeem it. Ellaria and the sandsnakes are made as unlikeable as possible and as a woman I must say, I'm offended, if that's the writers opinion of strong women.

It's sad, because the Dornish storyline was among my favorites in the books and I really liked Doran and his big plan. Why cast someone as brilliant as Alexander Siddig in that role, if they don't really use that character? Tthat was a waste.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Redeem Dorne after cutting out Darkstar, Arianne and her plot-line, Quentyn and his plot-line, Doran's long-term game, Ellaria's heart, and (f)Aegon's arc? Salvage Dorne after gutting Ellaria and the Sand Snakes to where they lose all of the traits that made them likable and demonize them to where they murder Doran and Trystane in cold blood? And now all of Doran's guards are okay with it even though they'd arrested Ellaria in the previous season under Doran's orders? Not to mention how Areo Hotah goes down in a pathetic manner?

No. There can be no redemption despite D&D's apparent denial.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 hours ago, Clash said:

It seems Quentyn and Arianne don't exist in the show. Since Quentyn is already Meereenese Fried Chicken and Arianne is seemingly headed for a showdown with KL in the book, a similar situation will develop in the show, except with Ellaria in the lead rather than Arianne. So the purpose of getting rid of Doran and Trystane in the show was to give Ellaria control of Dorne (I can't think of anyone else in the show who has any succession rights) and lose the less hawkish elements so that a war can exist between Dorne and KL.

Ellaria has zero succession rights. She is just a bastard paramour who popped out a few daughters for the second prince of Dorne. Let's not forget that Dorne doesn't just consist of the Martell's and Sunspear. In all reality Dorne would be in open civil war. The other houses would be fighting one another for the rights to rule Dorne. Now this is the show, so they would never introduce this, this late in the game. There are two possible directions this plot can go.

1. They honestly just scrapped the story line and the remaining characters will slowly die off (unlikely with the money already invested into it)

2. Ellaria aligns herself with Dany when she comes. D&D are really pushing the female empowerment roles after all the bad criticism they received with Sansa's story line. 

Number two is most likely, even though it makes zero sense in the world GoT is based in.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

29 minutes ago, Captain Hype Train said:

Ellaria has zero succession rights. She is just a bastard paramour who popped out a few daughters for the second prince of Dorne. Let's not forget that Dorne doesn't just consist of the Martell's and Sunspear. In all reality Dorne would be in open civil war. The other houses would be fighting one another for the rights to rule Dorne. Now this is the show, so they would never introduce this, this late in the game. There are two possible directions this plot can go.

1. They honestly just scrapped the story line and the remaining characters will slowly die off (unlikely with the money already invested into it)

2. Ellaria aligns herself with Dany when she comes. D&D are really pushing the female empowerment roles after all the bad criticism they received with Sansa's story line. 

Number two is most likely, even though it makes zero sense in the world GoT is based in.

I don't see Dany going to Dorne tbh. Neither in the book nor the show is this really looking likely. In the book, Victarion is the likely provider of ships for her and he would hardly counsel going to Dorne. Apart from the fact that the gravest threat to Westeros comes from north of thw wall and that's where Dany should be. But we're in guesswork territory now. The 'female empowerment' trope is a sideshow imo, the story is still called A song of Ice and Fire.

As for the succession to Dorne, perhaps there are other contenders but since they haven't been introduced in the show, I can't see them adding another layer to that storyline with three seasons remaining. There's just about enough time for a war between the Lannisters and Dorne. Another set of political manoeuverings would be time consuming and pointless.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, Lord Lannister said:

When as a viewer I find Cersei Lannister more sympathetic and likable than the Sand Snakes, you've done screwed that up. The only thing they can do to enrage more people is have them join Dany and enrage her fans as well.

Yep.  They need to stay as contained as possible and also die ASAP.  That's the best case.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

25 minutes ago, Miley the Monstrous said:

It's a terribly executed plot device, that's the problem. 

Meh. It's adequate for its purpose. We should know by now that when the show arc deviates from the book arc for reasons of expediency, what we get will be bare bones with a cow hide thrown over them. In the right light it will look like a cow, but don't look too closely.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, Clash said:

Meh. It's adequate for its purpose. We should know by now that when the show arc deviates from the book arc for reasons of expediency, what we get will be bare bones with a cow hide thrown over them. In the right light it will look like a cow, but don't look too closely.

Well it doesn't look like a cow to me, it looks like shit even if I squint. 

I give the show a pass with a lot of stuff but dorne is inexcusable even from a casual show watcher perspective. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Miley the Monstrous said:

Well it doesn't look like a cow to me, it looks like shit even if I squint. 

I give the show a pass with a lot of stuff but dorne is inexcusable even from a casual show watcher perspective. 

But you're not a casual show watcher, so you don't have that perspective. Casual show watchers I know haven't said a dicky bird about Dorne, good or bad.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 minutes ago, Clash said:

But you're not a casual show watcher, so you don't have that perspective. Casual show watchers I know haven't said a dicky bird about Dorne, good or bad.

The ones I know have. But why settle for anecdotal evidence? See for yourself in this thread for non-readers and how most of them dislike dorne. It's damn near unanimous. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 minutes ago, Miley the Monstrous said:

The ones I know have. But why settle for anecdotal evidence? See for yourself in this thread for non-readers and how most of them dislike dorne. It's damn near unanimous. 

 

Ok, apologies for the previous post. I have to approach this with care but I have noticed that people generally take a view and run with it rather than quaetion the basis for that view. Three separate occasions I have responded to posts here about Jon's body turning into a wight and I might not have bothered posting despite the fact that the posts I responded to were clearly and demonstrably wrong. People don't want to go against the flow.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...