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Houses of the Westerlands/ Westerlands Discussion


norwaywolf123

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1. Have i placed the Houses in the right category?

2. Do you know where the unknown houses belong?

3. What houses do you think might go extinct or be exiled or stripped of tittle?

4. Is there any houses you want to extinct?

- House Spicer

5. What do you think about the Last Lord Tarbeck stories?

- Lord Walderan Tarbeck was executed during the Reyne-Tarbeck rebellion, and his wife, Lady Ellyn, and last surviving son, Tion the Red, died during the assault on Tarbeck Hall by Lord Tywin Lannister. Ellyn's daughters, Rohanne and Cyrelle, were taken captive and forced to join the silent sisters. Rohanne's husband had been executed alongside Walderan, and their three-year-old son disappeared during the assault. Although the boy was probably thrown down a well by Ser Amory Lorch, one of Tywin's knights, some stories claim the boy was smuggled to Essos and became a bard popular for his sad ballads.[1]

- If Last Lord Tarbeck lives as the story speculates he might come with fAegon and the Golden Company?

6. Who deserves Castamere?

- I think that Kevan Lannister should have been granted Castamere since he was so loyal and a Lannister.

7. Ironborn invasion/raiding of the Westerlands?

8. Will the Westerlands conquer the Iron Isles and add them to the realm of Casterly Rock?

9. Could House Reyne be descendant from House Casterly or of the male line of House Lannister, as the Lannister are descendant from the Andal knight Joffrey Lydden and from Lann the Clever only in the female line? They obviously thought long before Tytos that they were the rightfull lord paramount of the westerlands.

10. Who will the Westerlands support in the next dance of the dragons (Dance 2.0) Daenerys or fAegon or Tommen/Myrcella or Neutrol?

11. Other stuff? Or questions!

Westerlands

Andal Houses:

  • Algood
  • Bettley
  • Brax, of Hornvale
  • Doggett
  • Drox
  • Falwell
  • Ferren
  • Jast
  • Lannister, of Casterly Rock
  • Lannister, of Lannisport
  • Lannett
  • Lanny
  • Lanntell
  • Lefford, of the Golf Tooth
  • Lydden, of Deepden
  • Marbrand, of Ashemark
  • Parren
  • Peckledon
  • Prester, of Feastfire
  • Ruttiger
  • Sarsfield, of Sarsfield
  • Sarwyck
  • Serret
  • Stackspear
  • Yarwyck

First-Men Houses:

  • Banefort
  • Broom
  • Casterly, of Casterly Rock
  • Crakehall
  • Farman, of Faircastle
  • Foote
  • Greenfield
  • Hawthorne
  • Moreland
  • Myatt
  • Payne
  • Plumm
  • Reyne, of Castamere
  • Westerling, of the Crag
  • Westford
  • Yew

Unknown

  • Clegane
  • Clifton
  • Estren
  • Garner
  • Hamell
  • Heatherspoon
  • Kenning
  • Lorch
  • Spicer
  • Swyft
  • Tarbeck
  • Turnberry
  • Vikary
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1 hour ago, norwaywolf123 said:

3. What houses do you think might go extinct or be exiled or stripped of tittle?

4. Is there any houses you want to extinct?

Clegane is extinct, and I'm not sorry that it's gone. Given what went on in Clegane's Keep, the sooner they burn it down, the better.

It'd be nice if the Spicers suffer some kind of comeuppance for their role in the Red Wedding, but GRRM will want to focus on the Freys, so I can live with it if we never hear from them again.

1 hour ago, norwaywolf123 said:

6. Who deserves Castamere?

- I think that Kevan Lannister should have been granted Castamere since he was so loyal and a Lannister.

Maybe, but Castamere isn't worth much, as far as I recall. Most of their gold mines were flooded with water. Plus it's a cautionary tale to anyone who might rebel against the Lannisters. So giving it to Kevan might send the wrong message.

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8. Will the Westerlands conquer the Iron Isles and add them to the realm of Casterly Rock?

No. Holding the Iron Islands wouldn't work unless you massacred the Ironborn. And as brutal as their lifestyle is, I don't know if I'd wish that on them.

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10. Who will the Westerlands support in the next dance of the dragons (Dance 2.0) Daenerys or fAegon or Tommen/Myrcella or Neutrol?

The Westerlands will likely support Tommen and Myrcella. If they die, who knows. It depends on who holds the Westerlands and whether the Lannisters might actually be deposed and/or wiped out.

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I'm pretty sure the Lannisters are a First Men house. 

I want to say that Clegan is a First Men house because they have grey eyes and grey eyes are usually associated with the First Men in the story. I also think and hope they go extinct. 

I think the Lannister will lose some land but they'll still be LP of the Westerlands. 

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3 hours ago, Floki of the Ironborn said:

No. Holding the Iron Islands wouldn't work unless you massacred the Ironborn. And as brutal as their lifestyle is, I don't know if I'd wish that on them.

I don't think it would take wiping out every living person on the island. I got the understanding from Theon POVS  (I think) it is only the Knight and Lord class esthat abide by the reaver lifestyle. So I think changing that lifestyle would take about the same amount as it would to, say, convince any regions north of the Boneway they have to abide by Rhoynar inheritance laws. Kill a few leaders and replace with smallfolk

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5 hours ago, The Wolves said:

I'm pretty sure the Lannisters are a First Men house. 

Not anymore, after Joffrey Lydden who was married to the kings daughter was crowned he became the first andal king of the rock

5 hours ago, The Wolves said:

 

I think the Lannister will lose some land but they'll still be LP of the Westerlands. 

Lose what land?

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10 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

What do you think about the Last Lord Tarbeck stories?

- Lord Walderan Tarbeck was executed during the Reyne-Tarbeck rebellion, and his wife, Lady Ellyn, and last surviving son, Tion the Red, died during the assault on Tarbeck Hall by Lord Tywin Lannister. Ellyn's daughters, Rohanne and Cyrelle, were taken captive and forced to join the silent sisters. Rohanne's husband had been executed alongside Walderan, and their three-year-old son disappeared during the assault. Although the boy was probably thrown down a well by Ser Amory Lorch, one of Tywin's knights, some stories claim the boy was smuggled to Essos and became a bard popular for his sad ballads.[1]

- If Last Lord Tarbeck lives as the story speculates he might come with fAegon and the Golden Company?

Maybe Tom of Sevenstrems is that lord tarbeck? Lel

It would fit into theory. He is bard as well, like sad songs and his age feats as he would be 42 years old now. Tom was stated to look around fifty, but his hair isn't gray yet so he could be younger these few years .

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2 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

Not anymore, after Joffrey Lydden who was married to the kings daughter was crowned he became the first andal king of the rock

They are descendants of First Men and Andals. Like the Starks. Like almost every noble house around. 

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1 hour ago, Lointain said:

They are descendants of First Men and Andals. Like the Starks. Like almost every noble house around. 

Actually Starks have very little andal blood. Very rarely they have married outside north.

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15 minutes ago, Paxter Redwyne said:

Actually Starks have very little andal blood. Very rarely they have married outside north.

I know that.

What im trying to explain, is that almost every noble house (Lannisters, Starks, etc...) cannot say they are "pure andal" or "pure first men", because, for several times, they intermingled with someone from a diferent ethnic background.

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31 minutes ago, Lointain said:

I know that.

What im trying to explain, is that almost every noble house (Lannisters, Starks, etc...) cannot say they are "pure andal" or "pure first men", because, for several times, they intermingled with someone from a diferent ethnic background.

Yeah, this is why i never undesrstood why arryns consider themselves as purest andals if even grandson of artys arryn, king roland arryn have married woman from house hunter. This mean that they already intermarried with first men in third generation.

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8 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

Not anymore, after Joffrey Lydden who was married to the kings daughter was crowned he became the first andal king of the rock

Doesn´t matter - they did a matrilineal marriage and he took her family name as his own. The Lannister name exists as long as people want to and there s no reason the differentiate between different ways to inherit.

Lannister is as old as a First men house and can track its history to that period. Therefore, they are a First men house. Compare with Orys Baratheon who completely removed the Durrandons as a house and started up a new House in its place.

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18 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

1. Have i placed the Houses in the right category?

Lannisters are a First Men house. The fact that Joffrey Lydden became a king at some point means nothing - Lannisters are still descendants by a direct inheritance line, even though not by a direct male one. Joffrey was simply lucky enough to be married to a woman who would inherit Casterly Rockbut it did not change the Lannister House in any way - it is still the very same House, founded by Lann. And Lannisters of Lannisport branched off from the main line thousands years before Joffrey Lydden became a king, so even by your standards they should be a First Men House (all Lannisters should be, anyway).

18 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

2. Do you know where the unknown houses belong?

I don't think George had released this information.

18 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

3. What houses do you think might go extinct or be exiled or stripped of tittle?

House Clegane is endangered the most for now.

18 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

4. Is there any houses you want to extinct?

None, really.

18 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

- If Last Lord Tarbeck lives as the story speculates he might come with fAegon and the Golden Company?

I think the last Lord Tarbeck was in fact killed by Amory Lorch.

19 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

6. Who deserves Castamere?

Kevan would have been a nice choice by I don't really care either way. Spicers can get it for all I care.

19 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

7. Ironborn invasion/raiding of the Westerlands?

Always ended badly for Ironborn. No wonder Balon didn't want to risk attacking them, and then Euron later chose to attack the Reach.

19 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

8. Will the Westerlands conquer the Iron Isles and add them to the realm of Casterly Rock?

Would be nice but historically Lannisters were never interested in Iron Isles for some reason. 

 

19 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

9. Could House Reyne be descendant from House Casterly or of the male line of House Lannister, as the Lannister are descendant from the Andal knight Joffrey Lydden and from Lann the Clever only in the female line? They obviously thought long before Tytos that they were the rightfull lord paramount of the westerlands.

Nobody thinks that Lannisters descended from a Lydden. Nor is it not obvious that Reynes thought that they were the rightful lords paramount of the Westerlands. If anything it appears they they knew that they weren't legitimate and just didn't care when they rebelled against the Lannisters.

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5 hours ago, norwaywolf123 said:

Dont it go in the male line? 

What is really important is to keep the family name and the lineage: the Starks descend from an wildling bastard and it is perfectly possible that the Arryns will only survive through some distant cousin.

In truth, the Lannisters descending from an marriage between an female Lannister and an male Lidden is nothing special; they will be all Lannisters in the end.

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I'm a bit confused by the first post to be honest. But as mentioned the Lannisters are indeed a First Men House and while its been Andalized I don't think that anyone in Westeros claims it isn't as old as its said to be.

In regards to the Reynes and Tarbecks they had it coming. I personally would not have gone as far as Tywin did, but I don't hold it against him since it has created the perhaps most unified region in the whole of Westeros, behind its Great House.

As for the end, I think that the Lannisters will win it, but if they would not I think that Daenerys will win and given her earlier decisions she don't look or sound like the person to destroyed House because of the deeds of dead relatives. In fact I think that its a hint in Meereen when she don't want to hurt her hostages that she will not seek to attack those Lannisters, for an example, who were not part to the blow against Aerys for that sake alone. If these Lannisters would cause problem for her she'll probably go after them, but only if they actually do something. Aegon and JonCOn are the opposites of this approach.

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