Maester Murks Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 4 minutes ago, The Unborn said: Okay, let's get this straight. Hightower is the one sharpening his sword, Dayne is the one plunging his sword into the ground. The sword is Dawn. I'm not sure, but Dawn keeps his edge, no ? Presumably Dawn keeps its edge better than other swords. There's still no reason to thrust it into sandy ground. Especially when he drew that other sword just as quick from the scabbard as the one from the ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattnj81 Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 29 minutes ago, Ser Yorick Ampersand said: Arthur Dayne is a legend, Dawn is a mythical sword. Gerold Hightower was the Lord Commander of the Kingsguard. It is because of Arthur Dayne wielding Dawn that Ned went to Starfall and Ashara Dayne killed herself. Because of that people think Ashara might be the mother of Jon. I don't think that is a small detail. We hear about them a lot in the books. It completely changes the story. But was he a legend of Gin Alley? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattnj81 Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 20 minutes ago, House Cambodia said: I hadn't seen that. What superb production values! You could tell they really care about the source material. The acting is what it is, I don't think any of these guys are professionals. The guy playing Ned Stark is particularly bad. But they made a pretty faithful adaptation of Ned's dream, and included some nice little tidbits. Did you notice the Knight of the Laughing Tree shield on the wall inside the tower, and the blue rose petals? They did a great job with what they had to work with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Cambodia Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 Agree 100% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forlong the Fat Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 27 minutes ago, TwiceBorn said: A shield is usually strapped to an arm, so despite the mass it has enough grip. Also, unlike the blade, it protects most of your body even if you use it only in passive manner. And lastly: the bigger the shield the smaller the sword. Now that you brought it up: if only Ned and his men used shields... There's also parrying daggers. Those were blades that were useful for parrying. Who could imagine that the best sword fighter in history would be capable of using a second sword to parry? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cas Stark Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 3 minutes ago, mattnj81 said: You could tell they really care about the source material. The acting is what it is, I don't think any of these guys are professionals. The guy playing Ned Stark is particularly bad. But they made a pretty faithful adaptation of Ned's dream, and included some nice little tidbits. Did you notice the Knight of the Laughing Tree shield on the wall inside the tower, and the blue rose petals? They did a great job with what they had to work with. What exactly is the excuse that the most expensive show in television history would hire a poor actor who bears little resemblance to Sean Bean at any age except for his hair style to play the scene? The guy playing Ned Stark being actually good or great would mean the rest of the flaws would be greatly diminished...but instead they got the most important things wrong or done poorly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Unborn Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 6 minutes ago, Maester Murks said: Presumably Dawn keeps its edge better than other swords. There's still no reason to thrust it into sandy ground. Especially when he drew that other sword just as quick from the scabbard as the one from the ground. The answer is simple, probably for the visual, it's pretty and let's you see that the sword is Dawn, a detail most people missed. Funny thing, since a great many people noticed the dogs missing in episode 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattnj81 Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 1 minute ago, Cas Stark said: What exactly is the excuse that the most expensive show in television history would hire a poor actor who bears little resemblance to Sean Bean at any age except for his hair style to play the scene? The guy playing Ned Stark being actually good or great would mean the rest of the flaws would be greatly diminished...but instead they got the most important things wrong or done poorly. You're confused. This comment is referring to the fan made film I linked in my original comment, not the scene on GoT. Here is the link again if you missed it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A bowl of brown Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 Isn't Dawn a greatsword though? Requiring 2 hands to wield it unless you're Mountain sized. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Snow Bengal Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 I LOVED the sword fight! IMO the story wasn't really twisted after all, Ned did beat Dayne. Didn't Ned admit that Howland Reed 'saved' him? I'm sure he said at some stage that Dayne would've beat him if not for Howland. Just how Howland saved him wasn't discussed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maester Murks Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 4 minutes ago, The Unborn said: The answer is simple, probably for the visual, it's pretty and let's you see that the sword is Dawn, a detail most people missed. Funny thing, since a great many people noticed the dogs missing in episode 1 Well that's because not everybody knows about Dawn or what it looks like. If they wanted to give a little nod to book readers, they could have made the blade somewhat paler, although maybe "the Visual" prevented that. On the other hand: everybody (even show-only fans) knows, that dogs usually don't disappear into thin air. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xcorpyo001 Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 Strangely, I have no big problems with the dual wielding. They made it work to a point. We know that knights used mostly single swords, sword and shield, sword and parry dagger to fight other enemies. If Dayne is as good as everybody seems to think he is, he could make it work. Actually, since most fighters are used to fight people with 1 sword, sword and shield, or sword and parry dagger, some could find it difficult to fight a guy with two swords, if and only if he could use it skillfully. The downside of this technique is that using two swords makes you more exposed, especially when faced with multiple enemies, and you have less power behind blows, so you should be less effective against armored enemies, or multiple enemies with both swords and shields. Spartacus makes it works because enemies don’t have heavy armor, and Dayne makes it work because Ned&co have almost no armor, single handed swords(so Dayne could parry the blows with one hand without the hit breaking his guard) and no shields. Perhaps he has a shield, and against knights in full plate armor he could use Dawn with both hands, or take a shield, but he sees Ned from a distance and knows he doesn’t have anything to fear, because they lack both shields and armor. They are easy pickings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cas Stark Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 The two swords looked exactly alike to me. I'm not sure how a show only viewer would have possibly been able to tell one from the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Unborn Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 4 minutes ago, Cas Stark said: The two swords looked exactly alike to me. I'm not sure how a show only viewer would have possibly been able to tell one from the other. A show only viewer don't care about the name of his sword, or if it was legendary. Actually, a show only viewer don't care about half of what is discussed here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cas Stark Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 1 minute ago, The Unborn said: A show only viewer don't care about the name of his sword, or if it was legendary. Actually, a show only viewer don't care about half of what is discussed here. That's only because the show doesn't care. They did an entire scene when Tywin melted down Ice. It may be that Dawn isn't important in the story and all the set up for House Dayne in the books comes to nothing...but it would certainly have been easy to include Dawn in the show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corvinus85 Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 When I watched it again, I realized that Ned used the bracer on his left hand to block a couple of attacks from Dayne. So that was a nice touch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forlong the Fat Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 9 minutes ago, Cas Stark said: That's only because the show doesn't care. They did an entire scene when Tywin melted down Ice. It may be that Dawn isn't important in the story and all the set up for House Dayne in the books comes to nothing...but it would certainly have been easy to include Dawn in the show. You kind of answered your own question. Dawn is apparently not terribly important to the plot, even if it's an interesting element included in novels comprising several thousand pages. Of course it is fair to wonder whether it may reappear in some way in the books. But the treatment in the show seems to suggest that it will not play any important role (eg, it will not turn out to be lightbringer). This may be an example of the rich detail that makes the books great; part of "world building" is creating interesting details that aren't essential to plot. Making a TV show, without benefit of narration, and being hamstrung by the awkwardness of overt exposition, requires different choices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noveson Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 1 hour ago, Ser Yorick Ampersand said: Arthur Dayne is a legend, Dawn is a mythical sword. Gerold Hightower was the Lord Commander of the Kingsguard. It is because of Arthur Dayne wielding Dawn that Ned went to Starfall and Ashara Dayne killed herself. Because of that people think Ashara might be the mother of Jon. I don't think that is a small detail. We hear about them a lot in the books. It completely changes the story. You realize he had Dawn right? You guys will complain about anything. They literally show him stick it in the ground with a clear picture of the sun on the pommel. Also you will realize when Ned grabbed it he used two hands, not quite a two handed greatsword but it was still a decent size. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noveson Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 22 minutes ago, Cas Stark said: That's only because the show doesn't care. They did an entire scene when Tywin melted down Ice. It may be that Dawn isn't important in the story and all the set up for House Dayne in the books comes to nothing...but it would certainly have been easy to include Dawn in the show. They DID include Dawn in the show. Are you all blind? He stuck it in the ground right in front of the camera. Huge sun on the pommel and that weird damascus steel pattern on the blade(which probably looks much better on screen than white..). No it wasn't a massive greatsword, but since you're all complaining about how unrealistic dual wielding is, how unrealistic is it to duel with a 6 foot long sword!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nami Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 1 hour ago, mattnj81 said: You could tell they really care about the source material. The acting is what it is, I don't think any of these guys are professionals. The guy playing Ned Stark is particularly bad. But they made a pretty faithful adaptation of Ned's dream, and included some nice little tidbits. Did you notice the Knight of the Laughing Tree shield on the wall inside the tower, and the blue rose petals? They did a great job with what they had to work with. The promise me part was cringe worthy I doubt Ned just entered the room and Lyanna immediately said "promise me Ned" while showing off her baby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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