Which bear for the fire kissed maiden fair?

[Boutoo]

Now that Sansa's escaped Ramsay & GRRM has hinted that the bear & maiden is a theme, do people think that Sandor or Tyrion will end up being her bear? 

I would like to see her with Tyrion now that she has a greater understanding of the world & can appreciate him more & he would thrive in a truly loving relationship. I also think that if they teamed up they would be formidable enough to take on LF, Cersei & co which Sandor wouldn't be able to manage.

Perhaps Sandor is learning more genteel ways whilst being a gravedigger?

[Woman of War]

Welcome to this forum, Boutoo!

I share your spontaneous liking. But with that topic you really have opened a can of worms here since there are some posters  who will try to convince that your hope is dirty and pure horror. Apart from being ...... Insert any insult

We don't know what Martin intends, maybe Sansa, Tyrion and Sandor will be dead all three in the end.

But I personally think that any future history of Sandor will be a tragic one if he should ever meet Sansa again. He might die for her or because of her, it will be fascinating  but not exactly a happy ending. On the other hand there is the remote possibility - remote since I just like anyone here know nothing of Martin's plans - that Tyrion and Sansa agree to a relationship like Cat and Ned, starting as political agreement and turning into friendship and love. I think this outcome would have the beauty of a rounded story arc. 

Some posters will declare it impossible, IMPOSSIBLE! that Sansa could ever agree to be  with Tyrion, some may insist that Tyrion would never want to be with Sansa. While OF COURSE Sansa will want Sandor and assuming that Sandor would take Sansa any time.

Only the characters in the end will want exactly what the author will make them want, not what fans wish them to want. After all Martin is the god of his realm. Apart from that who says that anyone in these books or the series ever gets what he or she wants.

Sad topic. And so much room for vitriolic bitterness among posters. I hope I have the serenity to stay out of it.

[Stangler]

I have a hard time seeing Sansa having a marriage or romance with someone like the Hound. I can see her being friends or being able to manipulate them but that is about it. I tend to think Sansa's role will be a political one and her marriage will be one. I am not sure love is in the cards for her and if it is I am not sure it will be with the person she married. 

[Tianzi]

3 hours ago, Woman of War said:

Welcome to this forum, Boutoo!

I share your spontaneous liking. But with that topic you really have opened a can of worms here since there are some posters  who will try to convince that your hope is dirty and pure horror. Apart from being ...... Insert any insult

We don't know what Martin intends, maybe Sansa, Tyrion and Sandor will be dead all three in the end.

But I personally think that any future history of Sandor will be a tragic one if he should ever meet Sansa again. He might die for her or because of her, it will be fascinating  but not exactly a happy ending. On the other hand there is the remote possibility - remote since I just like anyone here know nothing of Martin's plans - that Tyrion and Sansa agree to a relationship like Cat and Ned, starting as political agreement and turning into friendship and love. I think this outcome would have the beauty of a rounded story arc. 

Some posters will declare it impossible, IMPOSSIBLE! that Sansa could ever agree to be  with Tyrion, some may insist that Tyrion would never want to be with Sansa. While OF COURSE Sansa will want Sandor and assuming that Sandor would take Sansa any time.

Only the characters in the end will want exactly what the author will make them want, not what fans wish them to want. After all Martin is the god of his realm. Apart from that who says that anyone in these books or the series ever gets what he or she wants.

Sad topic. And so much room for vitriolic bitterness among posters. I hope I have the serenity to stay out of it.

I'm quite sure I read almost exactly the same post in another thread not long ago, up to declaration of staying out of this topic

 

I'm in the IMPOSSIBLE camp, and I'm not a fan of this resolution either (yeah, two different things), but there is one aspect in the that bothers me:

15 hours ago, Boutoo said:

I would like to see her with Tyrion now that she has a greater understanding of the world & can appreciate him more & he would thrive in a truly loving relationship. I also

...the assumption that the only problem was her not being smart enough to appreciate him. Like she couldn't be just not interested.

But D&D might be of the opinion that Saint Tyrion Just. Deserves., so who knows when they take us. (my 'IMPOSSIBLE' opinion is about the books, not the show)

[Boutoo]

@Woman of War She's been pondering on the kiss he gave her after the Battle of Blackwater, but I can't see it turning out well between them either. Maybe he'll become master of swords at Winterfell? GRRM has said he's going for bittersweet....having him around, but keeping them apart would be just that.

@Taylor_Swift Jon? Ummmmm that's a bit out of the blue, care to elucidate? (I prefer Arya, but probably as I have more in common with her)

@Stangler same here & for those reasons

@Tianzi in the book it's her that puts the kaybosh on anything happening on their wedding night. Being only 13, she only sees his physicality & pities him which kills both her desire & her compassion. He, in turn, is very hurt & not completely forgiving of that as he picks up on it. As much as he doesn't like the situation, he is prepared to be a the best kind of husband he can & to commit completely...up until she gives him that look & tells him never. & then the Red Wedding happened..... Yet he was always kind to & genteel with her, which is more than any other man she's met since she left Winerfell. Even with the wounds, he's the best medicine for Ramsay psycho nastiness.

My thinking is that they'll put them together, but with all the current & future wounds unhealed (bittersweet again) which would make both of them not completely willing, yet recognising it's the best way forward for them, especially if it ends up with Sandor hanging around too. So, I agree that it would begin as a political/convenience match, but they did manage to become friends before everything else got in the way & that puts them a few steps ahead of many.

What will happen in the books? Well, there won't be any straight lines to whatever resolution GRRM comes up with & the journey will be interesting for many. I can't wait ti see what happens to the Freys, LF & Ramsay....I hope he survives the battle of the bastards, but not in tact.....maybe Jon'll give him to Theon to play with, or Ghost  

 

[Tianzi]

16 minutes ago, Boutoo said:

@Tianzi in the book it's her that puts the kaybosh on anything happening on their wedding night. Being only 13, she only sees his physicality & pities him which kills both her desire & her compassion. He, in turn, is very hurt & not completely forgiving of that as he picks up on it. As much as he doesn't like the situation, he is prepared to be a the best kind of husband he can & to commit completely...up until she gives him that look & tells him never. & then the Red Wedding happened..... Yet he was always kind to & genteel with her, which is more than any other man she's met since she left Winerfell. Even with the wounds, he's the best medicine for Ramsay psycho nastiness.

You started with the books and ended with Ramsay, which version are you talking about?

If it's the book version, then he got convinced by papa Tywin to take her for the benefits like Winterfell and her pretty ass, and I'm not a bit sorry for him that he didn't get laid. And she didn't view him purely physically, she correctly view him as one of her Lannister jailors, albeit the kindest of them. And along with being kind, he is also needy and his resentment that his little prisoner wife isn't thrilled with him is probably humane - but not too noble.

In the show he is far more sympathetic, as he is thrown into this marriage about just as against his will as she is, and they manage to get along (unlike in the books where I'd say that there was a personality clash) until the RW. She probably could 'appreciate' him. But that doesn't mean loving and I don't like the implication that the Nice Guy just deserves the girl's love (the uglier he is, the more) and if she doesn't give it to him there must be some error in her judgment.

[Boutoo]

I don't think he deserves her love....love isn't about being deserving. It's more that he's more lovable (in both books & show) than most of the men tat she comes into contact with & she doesn't have the best taste when you think about it....Joff was a monster & Loras is gay. The reason I think he's more lovable is because he's the least 'Lannister' of the Lannisters & he has a huge heart aside from being extremely intelligent. Yes, Tywin convinced him in the books, but he wan't keen there either, he did argue back as much as anybody could argue with Tywin (he makes most peoples parents look like angels lol) & he stands up to Tywins tantrum about making an heir after the RW as well....I'm pretty sure that's in both.

Forgetting that he's a Lannister for a second, he's actually a half way decent person who tries to do the right thing by those around him who aren't either morons or evil gits & he gives the evil gits what they justly deserve. There aren't many others in the book who get referred to as being giants (the actual giants aside) or kingly as often as he does. That being said, I don't think he's an angel or a saint by any stretch of the imagination - he's a drunk & a lech - but with a family like his, who wouldn't be? Having Tywin for a Father would make anyone needy - just look at Cersei & Jaime & they had each other.

I don't feel sorry for him. I just understood both of them....why she rejected him & why he was hurt by that rejection. I think he understood her reasons as well, but who would like being seen that way, justified or not? He wanted to be seen for himself & let himself be vulnerable towards that end...it didn't work for the reasons you stated, c'est la vie

With regards to Sansa - yes, she sees 'Lannister' as well as his grotesqueness. My point was more that she only sees the surface things about him & yes that has a lot to do with her experiences with Joff & Cersei so I both understand & don't blame her for the way she sees things at that point. I just think that what's happened since plus some reflection might change her mind.

Oh I talk about both & don't always remember to distinguish, sorry...I'm getting old

In the books the Vale situation is pretty complicated all by itself & it's too long since I read 4 & 5 for me to speak confidently about that tangent....that's why I went for the show, I think - I'm rereading (well, listening) 2 atm, so will get to them reasonably soon & get back to you

Hmmmmmm maybe LF will get Ramsey? That would be fun considering how disgusting & creative he is

[ArabellaVidal]

If Tyrion has a future, it is likely at Dany's side or at Casterly Rock. Sansa's storyline is taking her to Winterfell (books as well as show). While there is a big chance of them meeting again during or after the battle for dawn, their story arcs don't seem to point to their ending up together.

Yes, there is great deal of indication (in the book) that Sansa and Sandor Clegane will have a significant meeting in the future, likely framed romantically, in order to complete the beauty and the beast narrative. This doesn't mean, of course, that they will end up happily ever after necessarily. Florian was never married to Jonquil and neither was Aemon the Dragonknight to Naerys. If Sansa ever marries again, it will be for political reasons (WoW spoiler below):

Spoiler

as is indicated in her perceived willingness to marry Harry Hardyng in the Alayne WoW gift chapter.

Her willingness to go along with a political marriage, despite her repulsion in being married for her claim, has to do with going to and remaining in Winterfell. Though I find it difficult to believe that the Sansa in the show will ever want to marry at all. A (realistic) show Sansa has a long way to go before she ever gets in any romantic or physical relationship any time soon, whether it's Tyrion or Jon or Sandor Clegane.

[Sigrid]

On the show as of right now my "Bear and Maiden Fair" is Tormund and Brienne.  I am loving it!

Re: Show Sansa she just needs a little "me" time, focus on herself for awhile.  This story has so little in the way of romance that I don't really think a proper partner for Sansa is high on the priority list.