A Ghost of Someone Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 Cersei demanding Lady's death was out of her own viciousness. I am glad this is being brought up as so many people, thanks to the show trying to turn her into "Carol", the loving Tiger mom, have forgotten that she is the story's main antagonist in Wersteros, South of the Wall. She is evil, arrogant and narcissistic to the extreme. Robert was intimidated as half of the realm was indebted to her dad, financially. Ned was never born to be an Alfa - leader so he obeys. Sansa lied and Arya was being Arya. Joff was the little Twat and his Mommy attacked on his behalf even though she knew he was a liar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Le Cygne Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 I'm pretty clear on Ned not letting Lady go like Arya did with Nymeria was the choice Ned regretted/the parallel. But what he didn't realize was something wonderful happened, in the form of providence, if you will... a Lady to Hound handoff as well as a Father to Beast handoff... she may be happier. Poor Ned, poor Cat, they loved their children, and they did their best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Le Cygne Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 2 hours ago, A Ghost of Someone said: Cersei demanding Lady's death was out of her own viciousness. I am glad this is being brought up as so many people, thanks to the show trying to turn her into "Carol", the loving Tiger mom, have forgotten that she is the story's main antagonist in Wersteros, South of the Wall. She is evil, arrogant and narcissistic to the extreme. Robert was intimidated as half of the realm was indebted to her dad, financially. Ned was never born to be an Alfa - leader so he obeys. Sansa lied and Arya was being Arya. Joff was the little Twat and his Mommy attacked on his behalf even though she knew he was a liar. Show did a bad thing there, also turning LF into Hero of the North. They do have a thing for villains. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tijgy Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 Just now, Le Cygne said: I'm pretty clear on Ned not letting Lady go like Arya did with Nymeria was the choice Ned regretted/the parallel. But what he didn't realize was something wonderful happened, in the form of providence, if you will... a Lady to Hound handoff as well as a Father to Beast handoff... she may be happier. Oh, that is sad . About the whole Ned, Sansa, ... the one person who should be blamed in the end is Cersei. She is the villain here and I belief sometimes the whole putting it on Ned or Sansa, is actually putting everything what happened on the victims and not the real perpetrator. And I belief the show is indeed doing this wrong. They are constantly whitewashing all those dark grey characters/villains like Cersei, Tywin, LF, ... while at the same time they reduce the more moral (but still flawed) other characters, like Brienne (the Brute ), the end of the mythology of the Ned, ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Time Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 Don't forget the utter assassination and dumbing down of Stannis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Le Cygne Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 3 minutes ago, Tijgy said: Oh, that is sad . About the whole Ned, Sansa, ... the one person who should be blamed in the end is Cersei. She is the villain here and I belief sometimes the whole putting it on Ned or Sansa, is actually putting everything what happened on the victims and not the real perpetrator. And I belief the show is indeed doing this wrong. They are constantly whitewashing all those dark grey characters/villains like Cersei, Tywin, LF, ... while at the same time they reduce the more moral (but still flawed) other characters, like Brienne (the Brute ), the end of the mythology of the Ned, ... No, I meant the Beauty and the Beast beast, I was trying to put a happy spin on it! GRRM aka providence gave her someone to protect her, after all. In the form of a very gruff but devoted dog. He words the passage where she pets the hound at the Fingers the same way Ned pets Lady in those final moments, too. He thinks of everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neds Secret Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 34 minutes ago, Lost Time said: Don't forget the utter assassination and dumbing down of Stannis. SATannis? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tijgy Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 33 minutes ago, Le Cygne said: No, I meant the Beauty and the Beast beast, I was trying to put a happy spin on it! GRRM aka providence gave her someone to protect her, after all. In the form of a very gruff but devoted dog. He words the passage where she pets the hound at the Fingers the same way Ned pets Lady in those final moments, too. He thinks of everything. It is something bittersweet then. And some happiness is indeed needed ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcus Agrippa Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 56 minutes ago, Lost Time said: Don't forget the utter assassination and dumbing down of Stannis. Everyone has a right ot be angry at the whole fucking stannis deal. I am still annoyed. STILL ANNOYED. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosehustle1 Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 1 hour ago, Marcus Agrippa said: Everyone has a right ot be angry at the whole fucking stannis deal. I am still annoyed. STILL ANNOYED. And if you read Stephen Dillane's interview about leaving the show and his involvement, his statements are very Stannis-like. They had the perfect person to embody this character and they wasted his potential. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Quork Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 6 hours ago, rosehustle1 said: They really screwed things up when they took her out of the Vale. It had the biggest domino effect on her and various other characterizations. They made a big mistake in only allowing one Stark the warging ability. That's a big reason Arya's current arc is so boring and repetitive. Huge mistakes, unnecessary missteps. This George guy - helluva storyteller. D&D - not so much. As GRRM said: butterflies have become dragons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HashRouge Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 39 minutes ago, rosehustle1 said: And if you read Stephen Dillane's interview about leaving the show and his involvement, his statements are very Stannis-like. They had the perfect person to embody this character and they wasted his potential. I was about to post more or less the same thing - somehow it makes it even worse that they had the PERFECT actor yet still made a mess of it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordImp Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 Kevan , Pycelle and Tommen are goners. Which else major character dies? Im thinking Olenna , Darioo , Missandei and Grey Worm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shk12344 Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 5 minutes ago, The_half_fan said: Can you share a link? I sent you a message with a link Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tijgy Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 Guys, it is against forum rules to discuss any leaks, ... from not released episodes. So I would advise you to stop talking about this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonSnow** Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 Send me link as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweetsunray Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 On 21-5-2016 at 9:57 AM, Tijgy said: That is actually the point? Sansa has been forced into all those political marriages, engagements, ... without she has any say to be with. Sandor is the one of whom she dreams about, ... I think it would be beautiful if in the end she is with him because she and only she chose him and with someone because he is political suitable. I don't even get the whole idea why Sandor would be politically unsuitable. House Clegane is a house of landed knights, right? Sandor isn't a stable boy. He's a nobleman and for far longer than LF is for example. When the Mountain dies, Sandor is the heir of House Clegane. And then there's the whole chthonic stuff. North = underworldly. Starks = rulers of the underworldly North. (ya know Hades and all that). Direwolves AND House Clegane = Cerberus, the three headed hellhound. You only need to take a look at their sigil and Sandor's helm to relate him to it. Cerberus was stolen from Hades by Hercules, who wore a lion skin, and this was a serious problem for Hades the underworld and Hades the ruler of it. But eventually Cerberus did return to the underworld to do his job. When aGoT starts in the timeline, the North is without its hellhounds. The direwolves were prevented from getting south of the Wall through the black gate at the Nightfort, because of not-so-good Queen Alysanne. And House Clegane serves the "lions", house Lannister in the Westerlands. But Sandor ditches the lions and wishes to join the direwolves. And in the North it doesn't matter whether someone is a knight. They have warriors there, not knights (with Jorah as the exception). Sandor would fit right in. So, I think that House Clegane might actually be moving from the Westerlands to the North and given an area to rule there... Like House Manderly once was ousted from the South and welcomed in the North at Wolf's Den of White Harbor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArabellaVidal Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 19 hours ago, LadySoftheart said: Yeah. I'm reading with as pro-Sansa a stance as possible and ... she's not coming off that well in these chapters. She's on a big learning curve and she's 11, so her actions are perfectly believable but they are not perfect. (What I can't stand are people who hate her for those imperfect actions and continue to hate her for the rest of the series. Whatever she did was not deserving of the terrible things that happened to her afterwards. Seriously, in a series that contains the likes of Tywin Lannister and Roose Bolton, my jaw drops when I see people hating on Sansa and Catelyn - both fundamentally good, but flawed people.) However, the opposite, insisting that both Cat and Sansa never put a foot wrong and have always been flawless is also a disservice to the complex humanity of both these characters. It's not just Sansa and Cat. Tyrion, Dany, Stannis can also be put in this category. They seem to have the most polarizing effect on fandom. A large number of readers either hate them or love them. (I think we might add Rhaegar on this list too.) It's strange because the books are entirely character-driven. There are some actions we cannot excuse but that doesn't mean we cannot understand why so-and-so would react in a particular manner or have particular motivation, even if that motivation is self-deluded. Judging from the very first times we see these people on the show, it is clear that D&D hold similar biased views. They allowed their preference or abhorrence to colour the portrayal of these characters from the very beginning and now the show is suffering for it.They completely ignored the character-driving force of the narrative and focused instead on events. This is why their favourites have become extremely boring because they have no grey areas, and now that the plot demands that the people they hate (i.e. Sansa and Stannis) do something positive or heroic, they have to resort to character-180-degree-turns or just plain murder them off. Honestly, GRRM should have questioned D&D more about stuff like themes and characterization. Or D&D should repeat 8th grade English Lit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HairGrowsBack Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 Just putting it here, Brienne : Books vs Show http://turtle-paced.tumblr.com/post/144706943452/books-vs-show-brienne-of-tarth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maid So Fair Posted May 22, 2016 Share Posted May 22, 2016 So, where is LF going to teleport to next? I'm voting for Dany's camp in the middle of the Dothraki sea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.