[Spoilers] Rant and Rave without Reprecussions - Season 6 Edition

[Morna The Maid]

So let me get this straight. I haven't seen the episode, but let me guess:

 

The WOW play from last episode, dealing with the death of Ned Stark, (and based on the certified GRRM material) was a comedic farce, with lame dialogue in rhyme, the whole thing Monty Pythonesque. While--let me guess--its pure D/D sequel dealing with the death of Joffrey Lannister was high Shakespearean drama by comparison., with more sophisticated dialogie and a whole different tone.  ("see what the lowly 'content creator' writes, versus what we geniuses write.")

That's offensive enough. (Hey, I called D/D using Mercy to treat the Starks like crap, I called that one a month ago.) But to openly suggest that the thing that turns Arya into a human being again is being made to feel sympathy for the woman who murdered her family, I'm sorry I don't can't process that. You mean she never cried or felt sorry for anyone in all the long travail and all she saw of the Wof5K. To also suggest that Arya could not decide whether or not to kill the actress until she had seen this performance, until after she had been emotionally manipulated, was the worst. You mean even as she sat though the first play she wasn't  wondering "she's just an actress. An ordinary commoner. I don't care if I don't like her role, what has she done *as a person* that is so awful that she deserves to die?" D/D suggest that the portrayal of Cersei was such a gift to humanity and she should be spared for such brilliance ALONE.  (Or maybe I'm giving them far too much credit...:)) So Arya is not supposed to question the subject's guilt or innocence, that has no bearing in the decision to kill, BUT if she is emotionally manipulated then guilt or innocence becomes important.

 

I wonder too if Arya will reassess  her new opinion of Cersei as she heads deeper into Westeros and sees just what the land has become. Will she remember too her family and who really was responsible. It would be great to see some contempation of manipulation by entertainment but nah. Her talking Cersei off her kill list b/c she really believes that Cersei losing Joffrey (that paragon, she KNEW him) is just as awful as herself losing her mother and brother...oh wait....nobody remembers anything!

[rosehustle1]

17 minutes ago, Stannis is the man....nis said:

Exactly this is why they should of done the idea Rickon as Jenye for Theon and had Sansa manipulate the Vale to go North while LF is in KL so she comes with the save for the Battle of Ice. It would of been true to the arch they were promising at the end of 4

That would have been slightly better. The only problem with it was that whole Locke plot. He was trying to find Rickon and Bran to kill them for Ramsay. If they had just took out all that Craster's Keep crap, then I think Rickon being found and held as a hostage to keep control over the Northern houses would have worked.

[The Knight in Motley]

2 minutes ago, Morna The Maid said:

So let me get this straight. I haven't seen the episode, but let me guess:

 

The WOW play from last episode, dealing with the death of Ned Stark, (and based on the certified GRRM material) was a comedic farce, with lame dialogue in rhyme, the whole thing Monty Pythonesque. While--let me guess--its pure D/D sequel dealing with the death of Joffrey Lannister was high Shakespearean drama by comparison., with more sophisticated dialogie and a whole different tone.  ("see what the lowly 'content creator' writes, versus what we geniuses write.")

That's offensive enough. (Hey, I called D/D using Mercy to treat the Starks like crap, I called that one a month ago.) But to openly suggest that the thing that turns Arya into a human being again is being made to feel sympathy for the woman who murdered her family, I'm sorry I don't can't process that. You mean she never cried or felt sorry for anyone in all the long travail and all she saw of the Wof5K. To also suggest that Arya could not decide whether or not to kill the actress until she had seen this performance, until after she had been emotionally manipulated, was the worst. You mean even as she sat though the first play she wasn't  wondering "she's just an actress. An ordinary commoner. I don't care if I don't like her role, what has she done *as a person* that is so awful that she deserves to die?" D/D suggest that the portrayal of Cersei was such a gift to humanity and she should be spared for such brilliance ALONE.  (Or maybe I'm giving them far too much credit...:)) So Arya is not supposed to question the subject's guilt or innocence, that has no bearing in the decision to kill, BUT if she is emotionally manipulated then guilt or innocence becomes important.

 

I wonder too if Arya will reassess  her new opinion of Cersei as she heads deeper into Westeros and sees just what the land has become. Will she remember too her family and who really was responsible. It would be great to see some contempation of manipulation by entertainment but nah. Her talking Cersei off her kill list b/c she really believes that Cersei losing Joffrey (that paragon, she KNEW him) is just as awful as herself losing her mother and brother...oh wait....nobody remembers anything!

If your theory is that in D&D's interpretation Arya won't kill Cersei because Lena Headey is such a great actress, then I'm forced to agree with you.

[Stannis is the man....nis]

1 minute ago, rosehustle1 said:

That would have been slightly better. The only problem with it was that whole Locke plot. He was trying to find Rickon and Bran to kill them for Ramsay. If they had just took out all that Craster's Keep crap, then I think Rickon being found and held as a hostage to keep control over the Northern houses would have worked.

Well they could of done several things 1) Have the wildlings go with Stannis in place of the mountain clans so SJ does the same routine of handing Rickon over or 2) have Greatjon live so SJ hands Rickon over but he is pulling a Wyman to get his dad free with a plan to bust Rickon out

[rosehustle1]

2 minutes ago, Stannis is the man....nis said:

Well they could of done several things 1) Have the wildlings go with Stannis in place of the mountain clans so SJ does the same routine of handing Rickon over or 2) have Greatjon live so SJ hands Rickon over but he is pulling a Wyman to get his dad free with a plan to bust Rickon out

The second plan you propose would have been interesting and would show that the Umbers aren't actually loyal to Bolton. The lack of any Northern hostages makes the actions of the Umbers in the show very strange.  Well, the show has established that Ramsay flagrantly flayed the Lord and Lady of House Cerwyn last year, which wouldn't go unnoticed by the other Northern families, so the Umbers giving this defenseless kid over in season 6 makes them look even dumber. I hate how they screwed over one of the most loyal bannermen of the Starks.

[Le Cygne]

1 hour ago, Morna The Maid said:

I wonder too if Arya will reassess  her new opinion of Cersei as she heads deeper into Westeros and sees just what the land has become. Will she remember too her family and who really was responsible. It would be great to see some contempation of manipulation by entertainment but nah. Her talking Cersei off her kill list b/c she really believes that Cersei losing Joffrey (that paragon, she KNEW him) is just as awful as herself losing her mother and brother...oh wait....nobody remembers anything!

Maybe Sansa goes on the list. She is the real monster. And she wants Carol dead and all.

Carol, the paragon of motherly virtue! Everyone should love her, just like Larry!

[TheCasualObserver]

Anyone care to summarize for me? I'm probably giving this episode a miss.

[rosehustle1]

50 minutes ago, TheCasualObserver said:

Anyone care to summarize for me? I'm probably giving this episode a miss.

http://turtle-paced.tumblr.com/post/145136661077/606-was-an-improvement

 

She does pretty great analysis of the show and calls attention to things others give a pass.

[Maid So Fair]

So - did anything happen in this episode? Anything at all? This was basically all setup. Very meh.

[Tijgy]

So ... Bran learned Summer and Hodor died, he saw in the vision his brother also died, ... and the whole point of the Ben & Bran scene was again just the answer of another mystery (where was Ben Stark?)

We get 15 minutes or more of focusing on the fact Randyll was an awful father but we cannot spend one second on Bran's feelings on Summer, seeing his uncle, ...

Oh, wait Bran's storyline is of course not about Bran. 

[Maid So Fair]

3 hours ago, TheCasualObserver said:

Anyone care to summarize for me? I'm probably giving this episode a miss.

You're not missing much. Basically:

• Bran and Meera get rescued by Coldhands Benjen. No one seems to find this strange. Bran watches a S1-S5 best moments trailer + Mad King.
• Horn Hill sitcom - Sam and Gilly arrive at Horn Hill, which seems Improbably huge. Gilly is sassy (and in a dress - that part was pretty funny). Randyll is an asshole. Sam is cowed but then decides to steal Heartsbane and GTFO.
• Freys are bummed about losing Riverrun (not sure when they got in in the first place? ). They remind us they still have Frank Randall  Edmure.
• Jaime and the Tyrells decide to finally attack the Faith to prevent Marg doing a WOS for the sin of being rich. But surprise! Marg has already repented by converting TomTom to the Faith. No one is sure what happened to Loras or what Marg's game is. TomTom is pissed of about the intervention and sends Jaime to RL. 
• Arya tells play!Cersei she is a great actress let down by shitty writing, thus breaking the 4th wall for good. She puts poison in her drink but then knocks it out of her hand. The Waif is happy shell finally get to beat her to death with a stick but Arya is onto that shit and retrieves Needle before going to bed (in the HoBaW because she's that confident I guess).
• Drogon shows up an he's been doing some weights training. Dany gives a rousing speech in the middle of nowhere to people that already follow her. The end.
   

[Neds Secret]

Is anybody else creeped out by Tommens weak as piss voice and accent, where is it from? He grew up in Kings Landing but seems to have picked up some ridiculous little nasally yuk voice?? Als, remember back in the good old days S3E1 Jeor Mormont with terror in his voice when quizzing Samwell "did you send the Ravens"? "That was your job, your only job"! Because if Sam didn't "Everyone you've ever known will be dead before winters over" It seemed so ominous and so present, so poignant and urgent and yet 4 seasons later Sam is having dinner down south where it is safe with his militarily minded father and yet has not mentioned the white walkers or the threat they represent right now!! Has Sam just deserted Jon Snow?? It would also seem to be important how Sam as a member of the "hold no lands, father no children, take no wives" nights watch has somehow come home with a wife and kids , but we get no explanation or nothing, it's like none of these characters have a brain and ask pertinent and relevant and obvious questions! In short, they are not human beings at all, the writing is so god damn awful because none of them act like human beings with minds, they just act like the plot demands. Evidence of this is the waif , she is apparently training Arya to be  no one whilst the waif herself still very much acts like some one!! Geez, she dislikes Arya, is jealous of her, is threatened by her nobility, and seems to have asked Jaquen to promise her that she could kill Arya if Arya doesn't measure up, so the waif has hopes, dreams, goals, prejudices, so how can she be training Arya, it makes no sense? It's absurd!

[Tijgy]

As someone who claims she wants to have smaller, quieter, ... moments, I actually should probably be happy with the whole Sam and his family drama? They tried to put the focus on the tensions between Sam and his father, ... So I feel a little hypocritical to say this ... but I do see this as filler. Yes, it was a way to flesh out the character but we already know/should know how Sam feels about his father. He told this to us. Do the writers always justice to his trauma? No, but what we learned about his character is nothing new? So I am not really sure how we get something regarding his character out of this?

Or can you see Sam stealing the sword and saying I do not care he follows me as a sort of character development? He found the courage to stand up against his father because Gilly believes in him? 

Still I am not really happy with this allocation of time&money? Should it could not have been spent on some more time with the direwolves, time with Bran talking about the fact Summer and Hodor died and he realized his brother and mother also died and his Uncle Ben is a corpse? Those are new developments - Sam and his father relationship, not really? Should it maybe not been spend on Dany suddenly controlling Drogon without any problem? 

I think the choice to spend some time with Sam's family might have been good if they had more episodes. But if everything has to get streamlined, I am not really sure what those scenes had to be included?

[Tyrek Lannister]

7 hours ago, BlueNightzx said:

Jaime's role is beyond redemption at this point in the series, he is my favorite book character, but i'm hoping that he dies in the show, and be set free from this torture to his character and the wonderful actor.

Right now Jaime/Cersei storyline is beyond salvation. That episode was the last chance of them "breaking up" and instead we've got more twincest. Burned letter will 100% not happen.

[Tyrek Lannister]

41 minutes ago, Maid So Fair said:

 

Bran watches a S1-S5 best moments trailer + Mad King.

[Tianzi]

6 minutes ago, Chett said:

Right now Jaime/Cersei storyline is beyond salvation. That episode was the last chance of them "breaking up" and instead we've got more twincest. Burned letter will 100% not happen.

I don't have a problem with that. Right now I only want Tommen dead and Joffrey resurrected.

[Spark7]

I don't know if anyone said it, a small thing really, but when Jaime slays Aerys, it actually is Nikolaj Coster-Waldau but with short hair...

[Ser Gareth]

Benjen's return was a bit underwhelming.  There are way too many undead characters now and it's ridiculous.  Ignoring the Wight's completely we have:

Mel - Not undead but ridiculously old.

Jon - Died, brought back.

Gregorstein - One of the weakest most ridiculous things in the entire show.

Benjen - He's undead.  Of course he is.  I hope he just stays dead in the books because any explanation for his survival now would be pathetic.

Sir Beric - Interesting initially but then the concept was ruined when he was brought back from death more than once.

Stoneheart - They just better not but I fear they will.......

And to think the main charm of AGOT was that it isn't high fantasy......

 

[Ruhail]

Goddamnit. Fuck this carolxLarry garbage, i want my plot back and i want my jaime!

[Ser Quork]

Just watched the ep.  Not quite as offensive as the first five, but still lacking.

I have a lot of difficulty with Meera dragging a fully-grown Bran around (aside from outrunning the sooper speedy skellingtons nonsense).

BenHands ex Machina appears!  I quite enjoyed the wight-smashing in a comic book way.  Still makes no sense, but the scene was good.

Gilly's new front teeth are nice.

Sam: "Now it's autumn ..." *grinds teeth*

I'm wondering why Sam & Gilly are in such a nice carriage with mounted guards.  Did they meet them at the teleport station?

KL - this plot is a giant snore (even though Jonathan Pryce is still knocking it out of the park).

Gilly scrubs up nicely.  I did laugh at the way she walked in the stiff dress. *makes notes on writers' distraction technique*

I didn't mind the dinner scene as much as others do.  I could see Sam would struggle to be strong under his father's abuse and the memories this would have brought back for him of a father that was prepared to kill him. I'm sorry Sam's newly-found confidence and knowledge didn't have a chance to shine, even belatedly though.  That said, Gilly saying he's a greater warrior than Randall Tarly is, of course, dumb.  That said, I would rather have had Sam go to the Citadel, but there it is.

The play.  I think Maisie again shines in her reactions.  I wondered if the writers were having her being sympathetic to Cersei (I would have been really angry for that), but her telling Lady Crane that Cersei would be angry I think shows Arya read Cersei's character pretty accurately.  I'm delighted she's leaving the FM, but it's not apparent what has been pivotal in this change.

"You have no right to an opinion," said the play's author to Lady Crane when she wants to make a suggestion.   Meta much?

Waif's supercilious smirk is really annoying - not as annoying as Marge's, but still annoying. 

Back to KL where the Cybermen are marching on the sept.  Mace is too-dumb-to-sit-a-horse and has to get an update from his mummy.  It's all a bit slapstick for my liking.

I see the new armour with Faith sigil was made very quickly.  Why am I even surprised?

Each time I see Jon / Sansa in the bowdlerised Northern plot, I think it's the worst thing the show has done.  Then I see Jamie and/or Cersei ...

Back to Bran who is, apparently, the 3ER now.  BenHands (who still has that terrible wig) was brought back by an obsidian dagger to stop the Other's magic making him a wight. I think a little more explanation of these concepts would have been nice, especially if Bran is supposed to be so vital to the war against the Others.  Why is there so little set up for anything to do with Bran?

Kelly C: "Just got to get something.  Brb."

*pops back on double-sized Drogon*

*blinks*  Such lazy-arse storytelling.  Seriously, this should have been ep 10 of season 5 or the first episode of this season.

P.S. Emilia is much better when she's speaking the in-verse languages.

Edit: Forgot to add: Are the Wildlings really an issue for Randyll Tarly?  That seemed to hit a rather false note.