Red Priestess

[Mystrandir]

16 hours ago, jbob said:

Is Thoros supposed to be the only guy in this religious organisation or what? Seems like their all women on the show.

They showed another male Red Priest in Mereen earlier this season. Unless I'm forgetting someone the show has thus far shown two male priests and three female (including the one this thread is about).

[MtnLion]

10 hours ago, House Cambodia said:

Nope, that's not "fact" at all, not currently anyway. I'm beginning to have my doubt and am leaning towards Arthur Dayne being his father!

That does not fly.  Why would Ned conceal Jon's mother and father from him and Catelyn, if that was the case?  There is no sound reason, both his parents would be dead, and he has nothing to inherit.  On the other hand, if Rhaegar and Lyanna married, and Jon is the legitimate heir to the Iron Throne, it makes sense for Ned to conceal it.  Ned's dream (see the link in my signature) at the tower of joy confirms that Jon is the heir. 

[sj4iy]

4 hours ago, Darksky said:

Jon has actually fought against the main threat, he killed wights, he killed a White Walker. Daenerys doesn't even know they exist. She's been busy bossing her minions around, occasionally burning people and rolling in the sack with Daario.

Jon has faced the threat up close, if Daenerys ever gets a wake up call and joins the battle against WW, she still won't be getting her hands dirty, she won't be going up close since she's no warrior. She will do things on top of a dragon, which is a cop-out to me. A cheap way to have a fighting chance.

 

That is something I've also thought about, too.  There's no way that we don't get an epic 1v1 fight with the Night's King.  It would be too anticlimactic to just destroy the Night's King from afar...and Dany is not a warrior (in the traditional sense, anyway).  She can't wield a weapon or fight up close, and I just don't see it being her vs the Night's King in the end.  I think it has to be Jon...he has the history with the Night's King already, and it feels like their eventual fight was foreshadowed in Hardhome with the staredown.

[bent branch]

If this information is based on something from GRRM, then my theories on Varys in the books are probably correct. If this is true there will be a wailing and gnashing of teeth.

[Alex, Third of His Name]

6 hours ago, Darksky said:

Daenerys fitting the prophecy to a T and in a literal manner makes her an unlikely candidate. That's how Martin rolls.

Jon has actually fought against the main threat, he killed wights, he killed a White Walker. Daenerys doesn't even know they exist. She's been busy bossing her minions around, occasionally burning people and rolling in the sack with Daario.

Jon has faced the threat up close, if Daenerys ever gets a wake up call and joins the battle against WW, she still won't be getting her hands dirty, she won't be going up close since she's no warrior. She will do things on top of a dragon, which is a cop-out to me. A cheap way to have a fighting chance.

 

I'm rewatching the finale of season 2 right now, where Dany goes to the house of the undying. If any of the visions she sees come true, it implies that first she goes to kings landing, sees it destroyed (probably by Cersei) and then immediately goes north, beyond the wall. They didn't copy the exact things she saw in the book but all (or pretty much all) of the things she sees in the book come true, so I'm betting the same will be true in the show. Since in the show she sees Drogo again, maybe this is implying that she'll die beyond the wall, fighting the others.

[House Cambodia]

17 minutes ago, Alex, Third of His Name said:

I'm rewatching the finale of season 2 right now, where Dany goes to the house of the undying. If any of the visions she sees come true, it implies that first she goes to kings landing, sees it destroyed (probably by Cersei) and then immediately goes north, beyond the wall. They didn't copy the exact things she saw in the book but all (or pretty much all) of the things she sees in the book come true, so I'm betting the same will be true in the show. Since in the show she sees Drogo again, maybe this is implying that she'll die beyond the wall, fighting the others.

Sounds more than plausible to me.

 

Bent branch - what are your theories? Do you have a link?

[bent branch]

On ‎5‎/‎20‎/‎2016 at 8:56 PM, House Cambodia said:

Sounds more than plausible to me.

 

Bent branch - what are your theories? Do you have a link?

My theory is a simple one. Because of the voice that Varys heard when he was cut, he has been working towards bringing the AA/PTWP prophecies into fruition. The reason this would make a lot of people angry is because this would mean that Aegon is really the son of Rhaegar and Elia. The reason this would be is because a fake boy wouldn't fulfill the requirements of the prophecy.

I have in the past provided lots of quotes to back this idea up, but since most people reject the idea that Aegon is exactly who people think he is, any evidence I provide is rejected out of hand.

[House Cambodia]

Personally I think Aegon is a Targaryen, but a Blackfyre, so not 'The One'. I do agree that Varys supports him, however. But I'm interested in your views. Whose voice was it young Varys heard?

[LordImp]

We have seen two red priests saying that Dany is the " saviour of the world ". The priestess in Volantis last season and the red priest in Mereen this season. Guess Kinvara has the same opinion , she will try to convert Dany and actually make her fullfill their prophecies. 

I think the Red faith as a whole will support Dany , Melisandre will be the only one  to support Jon for now. 

So i can see the whole world wil think of Dany as a hero , but the real hero is the bastard Jon Snow. 

Also i think the red priests are a equal big threat to  the world as the WW . 

[House Cambodia]

24 minutes ago, LordImp said:

We have seen two red priests saying that Dany is the " saviour of the world ". The priestess in Volantis last season and the red priest in Mereen this season. Guess Kinvara has the same opinion , she will try to convert Dany and actually make her fullfill their prophecies. 

I think the Red faith as a whole will support Dany , Melisandre will be the only one  to support Jon for now. 

So i can see the whole world wil think of Dany as a hero , but the real hero is the bastard Jon Snow. 

Also i think the red priests are a equal big threat to  the world as the WW . 

Yes, that's been my position all along. It's getting quite comical how consistently Mel gets it wrong - EXCEPT that this time she inadvertently got it right, according to my mapcap theory. She addressed Jon not as AA, but as TPTWP and whereas most think they're 2 names for the same messiah, I think they're different. For me, Jon will be the 'messiah' to Daenerys' antichrist. AA is the agent of R'hllor, the god of bloodmagic, child sacrifice and shadow baby assassins, the god of Asshai. Satan, in effect.

[LordImp]

2 hours ago, House Cambodia said:

Yes, that's been my position all along. It's getting quite comical how consistently Mel gets it wrong - EXCEPT that this time she inadvertently got it right, according to my mapcap theory. She addressed Jon not as AA, but as TPTWP and whereas most think they're 2 names for the same messiah, I think they're different. For me, Jon will be the 'messiah' to Daenerys' antichrist. AA is the agent of R'hllor, the god of bloodmagic, child sacrifice and shadow baby assassins, the god of Asshai. Satan, in effect.

Agree. While some think Daenerys and the red faith will be the heroes against the Others , i think they will be equally dangerous as the Others. I think Jon will fight them both. I just wonder if Jon will be converted by Melisandre like Stannis? Hope not. Most likely Jon will remain loyal to the old gods. 

[House Cambodia]

There seems to be a general view that Mel's story is all but over now. I think that's partially the case, and she won't have much influence over Jon, but if my suppositions are right, her story will be of some interest yet.

She'd virtually lost her faith in herself and her prophesies before Jon's resurrection; now she's full of herself thinking she's right about Jon. No, she's not right - she's never right!! She's assuming TPTWP is synonymous with Azor Ahai, the messiah sent by her god R'hllor. Boy oh boy, what has she done?? She's resurrected the messiah who will defeat her god's chosen one, Daenerys. I hope she lives to see just how massively she's ballsed up, and to see that her god is actually the Satanic figure, not The Great Other!

Jon in the meantime will be assisted by Bran, who may turn out to be or turn into an 'old god'.

[Smoke317]

On May 19, 2016 at 1:51 PM, Alex, Third of His Name said:

Why would Rhaegar kidnap Lyanna and then have Arthur Dayne be the father? Why would that really be some kind of big secret that needs to be hidden?

Spoiler

Here's the kicker.  Lyanna was not kidnapped by Rhaegar.  From what we know of Lyanna, she's often referred to as headstrong and not very ladylike like Arya.  Could you see Arya falling head over heels for some prince and running off?  Arya is a warrior just like her Aunt Lyanna was. She didn't run off to get married. She ran off because she didn't want to be forced to marry the womanizing Robert Baratheon. She ran off to become a female kingsguard.  During this time she and Dayne and Whent were protecting Rhaegar and the woman who would actually bear his next child since Elia couldn't anymore. That woman was Ashara Dayne. His best friends sister and also a very close friend of his wife's. Someone I could see his wife giving him her blessing to father other children with. But Lyanna eventually falls in love with Arthur during their time together and she gets pregnant with Jon. In the books the ToJ is basically a watchtower in the middle of nowhere used to spot incoming raiders from far away. Why would the crown prince take his new love there when they could simply go to Starfall a house loyal to the targs??  And why risk having Jon (if he is Rhaegar's son) in such an impossible to defend location?  They were begging to be slaughtered along with the baby. The kingsguard were at the tower to spot and head off any incoming Baratheon forces. After Ned kills Dayne, Lyanna tells him the truth. He goes to Starfall and tells Ashara. She doesn't jump from the tower but is allowed to flee with baby Aegon. Thus Ashara is the current Septa Lemore and Aegon is her son with Rhaegar. Also Ashara allows Ned to take Dawn with him to give to Jon when he grows up because he will be the new Sword of the Morning when the Long Night returns. Dawn is buried in the crypts with Lyanna. 

 

[Smoke317]

On May 19, 2016 at 4:55 PM, White lilly said:

This theory is just bizarre. They turned a bunch of people into wights, attacked Hardhome... but are actually allies? I think GRRM is trying to show that there is no sheer good or evil and sometimes is survival mode. I think that whatever Bran discovers about The Others is what's gonna make him go back south.

Totally agree!! To me, this whole Azor Ahai theory is just boring nonsense. They're in the story to give some depth and background but that's it. I don't think it's ever mentioned on the show, is it?

Why would Dayne get involved with the woman his prince kidnapped? He's not only good friends with Rhaegar but he's also a member of the Kingsguard, where the knights are sworn for life to protect and obey the royal family. Dayne is also known for being very respectful and honorable. Rhaegar left Lyanna to go into battle so if she really was pregnant then it was during that period which makes very unlikely for Arthur to go behind the prince's back.

Spoiler

Here's the kicker.  Lyanna was not kidnapped by Rhaegar.  From what we know of Lyanna, she's often referred to as headstrong and not very ladylike like Arya.  Could you see Arya falling head over heels for some prince and running off?  Arya is a warrior just like her Aunt Lyanna was. She didn't run off to get married. She ran off because she didn't want to be forced to marry the womanizing Robert Baratheon. She ran off to become a female kingsguard.  During this time she and Dayne and Whent were protecting Rhaegar and the woman who would actually bear his next child since Elia couldn't anymore. That woman was Ashara Dayne. His best friends sister and also a very close friend of his wife's. Someone I could see his wife giving him her blessing to father other children with. But Lyanna eventually falls in love with Arthur during their time together and she gets pregnant with Jon. In the books the ToJ is basically a watchtower in the middle of nowhere used to spot incoming raiders from far away. Why would the crown prince take his new love there when they could simply go to Starfall a house loyal to the targs??  And why risk having Jon (if he is Rhaegar's son) in such an impossible to defend location?  They were begging to be slaughtered along with the baby. The kingsguard were at the tower to spot and head off any incoming Baratheon forces. After Ned kills Dayne, Lyanna tells him the truth. He goes to Starfall and tells Ashara. She doesn't jump from the tower but is allowed to flee with baby Aegon. Thus Ashara is the current Septa Lemore and Aegon is her son with Rhaegar. Also Ashara allows Ned to take Dawn with him to give to Jon when he grows up because he will be the new Sword of the Morning when the Long Night returns. Dawn is buried in the crypts with Lyanna. 

 

[Smoke317]

On May 19, 2016 at 6:15 PM, MtnLion said:

That does not fly.  Why would Ned conceal Jon's mother and father from him and Catelyn, if that was the case?  There is no sound reason, both his parents would be dead, and he has nothing to inherit.  On the other hand, if Rhaegar and Lyanna married, and Jon is the legitimate heir to the Iron Throne, it makes sense for Ned to conceal it.  Ned's dream (see the link in my signature) at the tower of joy confirms that Jon is the heir. 

Spoiler

Ned conceals Jon's true parentage because his sister asked him to "promise" he would. Plus if word got out that Jon was Lyanna's baby with WHOMEVER, Robert would have him killed. He still acted like he loved her all these years later. Plus Robert would assume that WHOMEVER was the father raped her and would carry great anger and despise Jon whether he was Rhaegar's or Arthur's. He would be a child born from team Targaryen regardless. Also factor in that Ned was probably a little ashamed and embarrassed to admit he that his sister ran off because she didn't want to get married to my womanizing best friend and a war was started that killed his father, brother, and thousands of others and toppled a dynasty.  Not something you would probably want to tell anyone. 

 

[GeorgeIAF]

23 hours ago, Smoke317 said:

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Ned conceals Jon's true parentage because his sister asked him to "promise" he would. Plus if word got out that Jon was Lyanna's baby with WHOMEVER, Robert would have him killed. He still acted like he loved her all these years later. Plus Robert would assume that WHOMEVER was the father raped her and would carry great anger and despise Jon whether he was Rhaegar's or Arthur's. He would be a child born from team Targaryen regardless. Also factor in that Ned was probably a little ashamed and embarrassed to admit he that his sister ran off because she didn't want to get married to my womanizing best friend and a war was started that killed his father, brother, and thousands of others and toppled a dynasty.  Not something you would probably want to tell anyone. 

 

Then why Lyanna's words haunt Ned for the rest of his life ? Like he didn't manage to keep his promise ? 

I think the promise Ned made was that he will reveal to Jon all about his parentage and right to inherit the Iron Throne, but he didn't, because he wanted to protect Jon from Robert's rage. I guess Ned was shocked to learn about how ruthlessly Rhaegar's children were murdered, we see that in his dialogue with Robert. And then he decided that Jon's parentage won't be revealed to the world, breaking Lyanna's last wish.

[daemonTheBlack]

On 22/05/2016 at 3:29 PM, Smoke317 said:

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Ned conceals Jon's true parentage because his sister asked him to "promise" he would. Plus if word got out that Jon was Lyanna's baby with WHOMEVER, Robert would have him killed. He still acted like he loved her all these years later. Plus Robert would assume that WHOMEVER was the father raped her and would carry great anger and despise Jon whether he was Rhaegar's or Arthur's. He would be a child born from team Targaryen regardless. Also factor in that Ned was probably a little ashamed and embarrassed to admit he that his sister ran off because she didn't want to get married to my womanizing best friend and a war was started that killed his father, brother, and thousands of others and toppled a dynasty.  Not something you would probably want to tell anyone. 

 

And why would Lyanna want Jon's parentage hidden? Arthur Dayne is a definitive knight, highly unlikely to father bastards especially with the wife (possibly) of his best buddy. And Robert is not cruel. Confirmed several times. He pardoned so many people, even Dany at the end. He would not kill a baby (unless its a son of Rhaegar, whom Tywin et al would force him to kill).  It makes no sense.... or at least is too speculative.

[CockroachCaptain]

They made Maggy the Frog young and hot, why not Moqorro?

[rumple9]

I reckon there will be a big fight between Kinvara and Melisandre when they meet

[grufolo]

On 16/5/2016 at 8:21 PM, SuicideSheep said:

Who is the new  Red Priestess ? I've heard that her name is Kinvara , but who is she ? What is her purpose ?

 

But she has a glamour too!!! So there's some news about her too, for example ...

Spoiler

is she the second-hand sorcerer who cut Varys as a kid and that's why she knows of the flames and the details?