Strong powerful women

[Jack Bauer 24]

Kudos to Beinoff and Weiss on the strong powerful women theme this season. Awesome stuff. From Sansa, Brienne, Ellaria, Sand Snakes, Olenna, Cersei, Margaery, etc this is a great message that they are sending.

[BootySeeker]

The Sand Snakes have been depicted as murderous psychopaths. A great message indeed.

[Channel4s-JonSnow]

12 hours ago, Jack Bauer 24 said:

Kudos to Beinoff and Weiss on the strong powerful women theme this season. Awesome stuff. From Sansa, Brienne, Ellaria, Sand Snakes, Olenna, Cersei, Margaery, etc this is a great message that they are sending.

I think the show has always had a wide variety of female roles, and that is a good thing. The show shouldn't be trying to go out of its way to make its theme 'strong females' or 'weak females'.. more it should be showing a variety. Hitting the show with some sort of odd feminist agenda is always problematic. I don't like it when people view it through that lens.

[Good Guy Garlan]

32 minutes ago, Channel4s-JonSnow said:

I think the show has always had a wide variety of female roles, and that is a good thing. The show shouldn't be trying to go out of its way to make its theme 'strong females' or 'weak females'.. more it should be showing a variety. Hitting the show with some sort of odd feminist agenda is always problematic. I don't like it when people view it through that lens.

This. There's no need for some misguided, pandering half-baked grrrl power message. Just give us well-rounded, layered characters. 

I'm digging this season, but in this I have to disagree with the OP. Ellaria and the Sand Snakes are horrible caricatures and murderous psychopaths to boot, Yara is dour and humorless, and Sansa's sudden push for Winterfell reeks of damage control after the clusterfuck that was her storyline last season. The rest are alright, though I have to admit that Cersei is starting to bore me. 

[The Fattest Leech]

13 hours ago, Jack Bauer 24 said:

Kudos to Beinoff and Weiss on the strong powerful women theme this season. Awesome stuff. From Sansa, Brienne, Ellaria, Sand Snakes, Olenna, Cersei, Margaery, etc this is a great message that they are sending.

I'm sorry, but if you feel what they are showing now in S6 is the definition of strong, powerful women, then you need to go have a conversation with your mom, sister, auntie, gramma, some female in your life that will talk openly with you. The 180 flip from being abuse bait to being obnoxious women of war is very forced and obvious. I don't get offended at much, ever (except for animal abuse) and I am finding this to be just wrong on all levels. And laughable on screen. I would never show this to my daughter and tell her, "strive to be like Sansa." And all of the EW "Women on Top" articles... as a male, do you even know how blatant and obnoxious that is for other girls to see and try to take serious?

"Women on Top", no pun intended, right?

The only one on screen that I could possibly give a pass to is Margaery because she actually didn't commit any serious crimes, yet she is being over-the-top punished for it and she wants to "save" her house.

[Channel4s-JonSnow]

If you were to try and view the show through that lens, I would say sometimes the show goes too far and falls into the standard trap a lot of tv and and movies fall into. That is, showing 'strong women' as a reaction to 'dumb, stupid, misogynist men'. Dany's bonfire just now is a decent example of that, showing her having to break free of the men who were keeping her in 'chains' , although there was at least some attempt to show the Dosh Kaleen as accepting the system and encouraging it. 

Its something you see a lot, and its often described as something awesome or inspiring, but actually its a little insulting, to men and women. Outlander I always bring up because its far from a good feminist tv show, seeing as it simply depicts men as stupid and weak misogynists. 

But there are enough women in GoT that you can't describe the whole show in those terms. 
 

[SuperMario]

14 hours ago, Jack Bauer 24 said:

Kudos to Beinoff and Weiss on the strong powerful women theme this season. Awesome stuff. From Sansa, Brienne, Ellaria, Sand Snakes, Olenna, Cersei, Margaery, etc this is a great message that they are sending.

Don't forget the three sex slaves Tyrion gave to the masters of Yunkai and Astapor. Powerful women indeed

[Ruhail]

#Season6Killweakmen

[The Fattest Leech]

10 minutes ago, Ruhail said:

#Season6Killweakmen

It's funny because I actually like to watch strong men, mentally and physically, lead and succeed where appropriate, but this season.... I dunno. Even the most well trained knight is turned into a squawking parrot or lap dog or not good for anything but burning.

I could probably buy it more if it wasn't obviously each-and-every-single-person-with-a-vag that was tearing down everything around them. I could buy a couple of the ladies in particular coming in to their own in a natural way, but now they all seem hysterical.

[Tianzi]

13 hours ago, Jack Bauer 24 said:

Awesome stuff. From Sansa, Brienne, Ellaria, Sand Snakes, Olenna, Cersei, Margaery, etc this is a great message that they are sending.

Ahahahahahahahahahahahahah.

Hahahahah.

Haha.

Sorry.

 

OK, but the topic in itself is interesting.

I agree with the previous posters that a success in this field isn't showing some GIRL POWER (which usually tends to be disastrous), but portraying the female characters as people. Which actually requires looking past fanservice and showing some insight into the female point of view. How well did D&D do?

Let's get the Sand Snakes out of the way. They're the best example of 'thinking that waving a weapon makes a girl cool' approach = disaster. And they're the stereotype of those hysterical, irrational, temperamental females crossed with the stereotype of those hysterical, irrational, temperamental foreigners, you know, where everything is so exotic and you just can't keep up with this mysterious, uncivilized nations killing each other. Ah, and that sexual liberty in those lands. You barely can get through a scene mentioning Oberyn without being informed that he fucked boys.

I initially liked the lighter nature of Show!Cersei, beacuse I thought the books were not using the potential of making her somewhat sympathetic. But they've overdone it. It's boring and too much attention on her womb. She is a mooooooom. It's, like, the most female thing in the world, let's exploit it endlessly.

I'm disappointed in 'Most girls are idiots!' Arya. I understand that some of us undergo this dumb period in our adolescence, but it was absent in the books. She was a tomboy, but also the one who supported the idea of Cersei's sigil being incorporated into royal sigil, because 'the wife is important too!' For example. D&D went for simplified approach. I hope they didn't think it was cool.

Sansa and Cat are IMO where they're lost. It's the 'woman's courage' without the machete waving and they seem to be out of their depth there to me. With Cat, they had books, and they gave her extra MOM points (Oooooooh, if she only loved Jon Show!). Sansa has some brownie points after the last episode (6.4), but her characterization is inconsistent and I get a feeling that they consider her violence-free book character arc not worth watching.

Brienne is simplified and stripped from some of her book characteristic, and maybe more brutish, but I think it's a standard character loss, not much related to her feminity.

Olenna and Marg are probably the best of their creations, at least Marg who had no personality in the books. The Tyrells' 'matriarchy' is overdone and at the cost of Mace and Loras becoming complete dopes, but these are the women seeing the world order for what it is and exploiting it shamelessly.

 

So, the wide range of female character types? Initially, yes, though I get a feeling that the show tries to narrow it down into its comfort zone: the MOM, the Xena, the distressed damsel, the seductress.

[Cas Stark]

Very little that happens in make believe TV and movies makes me actually sad, but it makes me sad and worried for the world that people would look at Ellaria and the Sand Snakes...who are impulsive, hysterical, murderous nuts...who in revenge for their family being killed, killed the rest of their family and smirked about it while they were dying, stabbed their own cousin in the back after promising to stand aside, poisoned a nice girl who embraced their culture....there is NOTHING here to praise.  And to me, anyone who sees murder as the road to women being empowered needs to wake up.

I wasn't too thrilled with Dany's murderous arson rampage either, but at least in this instance she was a captive so some kind of case can be made, though it's a weak one.  There is nothing to be said for Ellaria and the Snakes bizarro ideas of revenge.

Sansa has just done another of her 180s, and so after talking about her empowerment for 1.5 seasons, finally, we get it....but it seems a bit odd that she went from ready to give up over crossing a creek to now ready to take back winterfell with or without Jon.

 

[Mindwalker]

36 minutes ago, The Fattest Leech said:

I'm sorry, but if you feel what they are showing now in S6 is the definition of strong, powerful women, then you need to go have a conversation with your mom, sister, auntie, gramma, some female in your life that will talk openly with you. The 180 flip from being abuse bait to being obnoxious women of war is very forced and obvious. I don't get offended at much, ever (except for animal abuse) and I am finding this to be just wrong on all levels. And laughable on screen. I would never show this to my daughter and tell her, "strive to be like Sansa." And all of the EW "Women on Top" articles... as a male, do you even know how blatant and obnoxious that is for other girls to see and try to take serious?

"Women on Top", no pun intended, right?

The only one on screen that I could possibly give a pass to is Margaery because she actually didn't commit any serious crimes, yet she is being over-the-top punished for it and she wants to "save" her house.

I agree with this.

 

Also, I certainly wouldn't mind if the women happened to be (really) strong this season, while for one reason or another, the men happen to be weak/ weakened/ let themselves be weak for once. BUT the forced way this is portrayed... Take Marge and Loras, for example. He is broken, she will fight for them both? Fine, but show/ tell us a bit WHY he is so down. Oh wait, he said it: He's just never been strong. Gays, amirite?

Or Jaime... A long time ago, he started a sort of redemption arc, trying to find his honor... Now, he is Cersei's laptop again, his oaths (Sansa) forgotten, and managed to loose 2 of 3 of his children on his watch.

I kind of like Yara (not sure why exactly), but she was quite mean to bowed, bent, broken Reek. How is being mean to a weak person empowered?! Has nothing to do with real strength.I do expect her to calm down a bit, she's probably projedting the shirtless Ramsey debacle on him... But I do not expect her to end up ruling the II. D&D just love their bad guys and reward them, and it looks to me as if Euron will be filling that role, so...

[Channel4s-JonSnow]

16 minutes ago, Tianzi said:

Ahahahahahahahahahahahahah.

Hahahahah.

Haha.

Sorry.

 

OK, but the topic in itself is interesting.

I agree with the previous posters that a success in this field isn't showing some GIRL POWER (which usually tends to be disastrous), but portraying the female characters as people. Which actually requires looking past fanservice and showing some insight into the female point of view. How well did D&D do?

Let's get the Sand Snakes out of the way. They're the best example of 'thinking that waving a weapon makes a girl cool' approach = disaster. And they're the stereotype of those hysterical, irrational, temperamental females crossed with the stereotype of those hysterical, irrational, temperamental foreigners, you know, where everything is so exotic and you just can't keep up with this mysterious, uncivilized nations killing each other. Ah, and that sexual liberty in those lands. You barely can get through a scene mentioning Oberyn without being informed that he fucked boys.

I initially liked the lighter nature of Show!Cersei, beacuse I thought the books were not using the potential of making her somewhat sympathetic. But they've overdone it. It's boring and too much attention on her womb. She is a mooooooom. It's, like, the most female thing in the world, let's exploit it endlessly.

I'm disappointed in 'Most girls are idiots!' Arya. I understand that some of us undergo this dumb period in our adolescence, but it was absent in the books. She was a tomboy, but also the one who supported the idea of Cersei's sigil being incorporated into royal sigil, because 'the wife is important too!' For example. D&D went for simplified approach. I hope they didn't think it was cool.

Sansa and Cat are IMO where they're lost. It's the 'woman's courage' without the machete waving and they seem to be out of their depth there to me. With Cat, they had books, and they gave her extra MOM points (Oooooooh, if she only loved Jon Show!). Sansa has some brownie points after the last episode (6.4), but her characterization is inconsistent and I get a feeling that they consider her violence-free book character arc not worth watching.

Brienne is simplified and stripped from some of her book characteristic, and maybe more brutish, but I think it's a standard character loss, not much related to her feminity.

Olenna and Marg are probably the best of their creations, at least Marg who had no personality in the books. The Tyrells' 'matriarchy' is overdone and at the cost of Mace and Loras becoming complete dopes, but these are the women seeing the world order for what it is and exploiting it shamelessly.

 

So, the wide range of female character types? Initially, yes, though I get a feeling that the show tries to narrow it down into its comfort zone: the MOM, the Xena, the distressed damsel, the seductress.

See this is where you start having problems, viewing everything through a lens of 'feminism' or 'real women'. 

Because I think every single character on the show is boiled down to a more familiar archetype, because its a more understandable way of watching the show. Male or Female. 

The point at which we don't talk about this stuff is when a persons gender doesn't become even a relevant issue (although we will always need to accept that men and women are essentially different as a basis for all discussion)

[Tianzi]

1 minute ago, Channel4s-JonSnow said:

See this is where you start having problems, viewing everything through a lens of 'feminism' or 'real women'. 

Because I think every single character on the show is boiled down to a more familiar archetype, because its a more understandable way of watching the show. Male or Female. 

The point at which we don't talk about this stuff is when a persons gender doesn't become even a relevant issue (although we will always need to accept that men and women are essentially different as a basis for all discussion)

But the person's gender is a relevant issue in this show's portrayal and that is what I talked about.

Care to point those 'problems' to me?

[Mister Stoneheart]

The books have a wide variety of strong females, all acting in accordance to a medieval style world.  Most are not physically strong, but possess strength in other areas--sexuality, intrigue, love, advice--that they can use to their advantage (with Brienne and the saltwives (a nod to Viking women warriors?) as a physical exception).

In Weisseroff, strong females are video game characters.  Now I love video games--I play MMOs all the time, and I usually play female characters.  They are just as strong as men, kick ass, do vicious amazing things--that's because it's a video game, and females better be as tough and awesome as men.

I've said it before--the land of Weisseroff mirrors a lot of 1980s Dungeons and Dragons B movie conventions.  The women are empowered by kicking ass, stabbing and killing their own, boobs of resurrection, dragons and dragons and tits, the less clothing you wear the more bad ass you are.

This is not the world of A Song of Ice and Fire.  So, OP, you are correct in saying that women are empowered in the show--in Weisseroff they are very video game powerful.

In the books you get a more nuanced variety of power--one I much prefer.

[The Fattest Leech]

24 minutes ago, Tianzi said:

~snipped~

I initially liked the lighter nature of Show!Cersei, beacuse I thought the books were not using the potential of making her somewhat sympathetic. But they've overdone it. It's boring and too much attention on her womb. She is a mooooooom. It's, like, the most female thing in the world, let's exploit it endlessly.

~snipped~

This is what happened last season with Karsi.

Karsi was a show invented character that was the rare gem that transcended any bias from both Book and show fans. A huge amount of people loved her instantly. She was a great balance of warrior woman and mother of two young girls. She started out making logical decisions right along with the other leading men. Her gender was never talked about in those precious few minutes we had her.

But what happened to Karsi when she saw dead children... her womb took over and she died 50 feet away from her living children she was trying to save.

Your thoughts on this have been really well stated and entertaining. Don't let anyone derail your thoughts by throwing out the old standby insult that you are viewing anything as a terrible "feminist" because there is nothing wrong with not wanting women boiled down into stereotypes.

[Jack Bauer 24]

46 minutes ago, Mister Stoneheart said:

The books have a wide variety of strong females, all acting in accordance to a medieval style world.  Most are not physically strong, but possess strength in other areas--sexuality, intrigue, love, advice--that they can use to their advantage (with Brienne and the saltwives (a nod to Viking women warriors?) as a physical exception).

In Weisseroff, strong females are video game characters.  Now I love video games--I play MMOs all the time, and I usually play female characters.  They are just as strong as men, kick ass, do vicious amazing things--that's because it's a video game, and females better be as tough and awesome as men.

I've said it before--the land of Weisseroff mirrors a lot of 1980s Dungeons and Dragons B movie conventions.  The women are empowered by kicking ass, stabbing and killing their own, boobs of resurrection, dragons and dragons and tits, the less clothing you wear the more bad ass you are.

This is not the world of A Song of Ice and Fire.  So, OP, you are correct in saying that women are empowered in the show--in Weisseroff they are very video game powerful.

In the books you get a more nuanced variety of power--one I much prefer.

I don't really feel they are nuanced in the books. I mean Martin has used some cringey vocabulary in regards to women as well.

[Daske]

7 minutes ago, Mister Stoneheart said:

...

I've said it before--the land of Weisseroff mirrors a lot of 1980s Dungeons and Dragons B movie conventions.  The women are empowered by kicking ass, stabbing and killing their own, boobs of resurrection, dragons and dragons and tits, the less clothing you wear the more bad ass you are.

....

Myth #26 about the show. This clearly doesn't apply to lot of the female characters, e.g. Cat, Sansa, Talisa, Cersei, Marge, Roz, Shireen, QoT, Missandai, Selsye, Shae, Lysa and almost all of the secondary/walk-on female characters. (Roz and Shae are not depicted as 'badass' for being prostitutes or nude and are never depicted as powerful).

Yes, the Sand Snakes, Danny, Brienne, Asha, Ygritte, Mel and Arya are all depicted at times in the martial and/or sexual ways you mention in the show but are also depicted sometimes as such in the source material anyway. And Sand Snakes aside, conversely neither are they always shown this way in the show - all of them have had some thoughtful, bonding, jokey, luvy-dovey or whatever moments.

They have a good mix of good/bad/sexual/non-sexual/fighter/passive/clever/dumb women and a good mix of good/bad/sexual/non-sexual/fighter/passive/clever/dumb men. To say they are all badass whether by martial prowess or by wearing less clothes simply is not true.

**And I'm not saying that the Sand Snakes are 'empowered' characters, they are too thinly drawn in the show to make that conclusion and are probably the only ones that you can truly say are really like AD&D characters.

 

[b00gieman]

POTENTIAL SPOILERS

Quaithe gives Daenerys the following prophecy:

“To go north, you must journey south. To reach the west, you must go east. To go forward you must go back, and to touch the light you must pass beneath the shadow.”
 

Going back to Vaes Dothrak she will see the truth of the prophecy.  Basically she has only to determine where she needs to be and go the opposite direction.

 

Rand al’thor asked the following question of the Aelfinn:

How can I win the Last Battle and survive?"
 

They answered him with the following:

The north and the east must be as one. The west and the south must be as one. The two must be as one. If you would live, you must die.

 

For some time now I have believed that the two books seem to be companions to each other.  In this case the ASOIAF prophecy came first.  But since TWOT series is completed and the two prophecies seem similar can the answers to the last part of Dany’s prophecy from Quaithe be found in TWOT?


In TWOT Rand seized the Dark One and light itself exploded from him.  So will the last part of the prophecy “to touch the light you must pass beneath the shadow” mean something similar?  The Dark One is referred to as the “Shadow”.  Rand forged a peace between all the warring factions to make them all one.  While they were engaging the forces of the Shadow he and the Dark One fought on a metaphysical level.  In ASOIAF Rand’s character is split between both Dany and Jon Snow.  The following took place in TWOT can you draw any conclusions from it? 
 

“They took control of him. Callandor was flawed. Any man using it could be forced to link with women, to be placed in their control. A trap . . . and one he used on Moridin.

“Link!” Rand commanded.

They fed it to him. Power.

Saidar from the women.

The True Power from Moridin.

Saidin from Rand.

Moridin’s channeling the True Power here threatened to destroy them all, but they buffered it with saidin and saidar; then directed all three at the Dark One.

Rand punched through the blackness there and created a conduit of light and darkness, turning the Dark Ones own essence upon him.”

“Rand felt the Dark One beyond, his immensity. Space, size, time . . . Rand understood how these things could be irrelevant now.

With a bellow—three Powers coursing through him, blood streaming down his side—the Dragon Reborn raised a hand of power and seized the Dark One through the Bore, like a man reaching through water to grab the prize at the rivers bottom.

The Dark One tried to pull back, but Rand's claw was gloved by the True Power. The enemy could not taint saidin again. The Dark One tried to withdraw the True Power from Moridin, but the conduit flowed too freely, too powerfully to shut off now. Even for Shai’tan himself.

So it was that Rand used the Dark One’s own essence, channeled in its full strength. He held the Dark One tightly, like a dove in the grip of a hawk.”

“And light exploded from him.”



“The seals crumbled. The Dark One burst free.

Rand held the Dark One tightly.

Filled with the Power, standing in a column of light, Rand pulled the Dark One into the Pattern. Only here was there time. Only here could the Shadow itself be killed.

The force in his hand, which was at once vast and yet tiny, trembled. Its screams were the sounds of planets grinding together.

A pitiful object. Suddenly, Rand felt as if he were holding not one of the primal forces of existence, but a squirming thing from the mud of the sheep pens.

YOU REALLY ARE NOTHING, Rand said, knowing the Dark Ones secrets completely. YOU WOULD NEVER HAVE GIVEN ME REST AS YOU PROMISED, FATHER OF LIES. YOU WOULD HAVE ENSLAVED ME AS YOU WOULD HAVE ENSLAVED THE OTHERS. YOU CANNOT GIVE OBLIVION. REST IS NOT YOURS. ONLY TORMENT.

Note: I believe that the sentence "You would have enslaved me as you would have enslaved the others" was reimagined in ASOIAF to portray the COTF as the Dark One, Jon Snow as Rand and "The Others" as the others.  

 

Kit Harrington gave an interview describing how Jon Snow saw "oblivion" or nothing.  Where Rand wanted oblivion it was a terrifying experience for Jon.

 

At first, I was worried that he’ll wake up and he’s the same, back to normal — then there’s no point in that death,. He needs to change. There’s a brilliant line when Melisandre asks: ‘What did you see?’ And he says: ‘Nothing, there was nothing at all.’ That cuts right to our deepest fear, that there’s nothing after death. And that’s the most important line in the whole season for me. Jon’s never been afraid of death, and that’s made him a strong and honorable person. He realizes something about his life now: He has to live it, because that’s all there is. He’s been over the line and there’s nothing there. And that changes him. It literally puts the fear of god into him. He’s seen oblivion and that’s got to change somebody in the most fundamental way there is. He doesn’t want to die ever again. But if he does, he doesn’t want to be brought back.

 

The Dark One trembled in his grip.”

“YOU HORRIBLE, PITIFUL MITE, Rand said.

Rand was dying. His lifeblood flowed from him, and beyond that, the amount of the Powers he held would soon burn him away.

He held the Dark One in his hand. He began to squeeze, then stopped.

He knew all secrets. He could see what the Dark One had done. And Light, Rand understood. Much of what the Dark One had shown him was lies.

But the vision Rand himself had created—the one without the Dark One—was truth. If he did as he wished, he would leave men no better than the Dark One himself.

What a fool I have been.”

“Rand yelled, thrusting the Dark One back through the pit from where it had come. Rand pushed his arms to the side, grabbing twin pillars of saidar and saidin with his mind, coated with the True Power drawn through Moridin, who knelt on the floor, eyes open, so much power coursing through him he couldn’t even move.

Rand hurled the Powers forward with his mind and braided them together. Saidin and saidar at once, the True Power surrounding them and forming a shield on the Bore.

He wove something majestic, a pattern of interlaced saidar and saidin in their pure forms. Not Fire, not Spirit, not Water, not Earth, not Air. Purity. Light itself. This didn’t repair, it didn’t patch, it forged anew.

With this new form of the Power, Rand pulled together the rent that had been made here long ago by foolish men.”

“He understood, finally, that the Dark One was not the enemy.

It never had been.”

 

[Tianzi]

1 hour ago, The Fattest Leech said:

This is what happened last season with Karsi.

Karsi was a show invented character that was the rare gem that transcended any bias from both Book and show fans. A huge amount of people loved her instantly. She was a great balance of warrior woman and mother of two young girls. She started out making logical decisions right along with the other leading men. Her gender was never talked about in those precious few minutes we had her.

But what happened to Karsi when she saw dead children... her womb took over and she died 50 feet away from her living children she was trying to save.

Your thoughts on this have been really well stated and entertaining. Don't let anyone derail your thoughts by throwing out the old standby insult that you are viewing anything as a terrible "feminist" because there is nothing wrong with not wanting women boiled down into stereotypes.

Thank you

And I agree with you about Karsi, she also makes the best case about how the statement that character portrayal isn't gender-biased is pure bullshit. Can you imagine any male wilding commander in her place during that zombie children scene?

22 minutes ago, Daske said:

(Roz and Shae are not depicted as 'badass' for being prostitutes or nude and are never depicted as powerful).

Shae is given a knife in her hand and a boast in her mouth several times and I see several attempts of trying to make her look badass (though obviously nowhere near video game style). She also is a character definitely liked by the showrunners and I dare to say that there is a link between that and asserting that she is capable of chasing Sansa's serving girl with a knife and making threats. Empowerment^TM.

 

But I forgot about Starbuck's coffee crew nigthmare, AKA the poster girl of female violence fetishized (hey, she is hot!).

I won't hold this season's arson-murder against her, because when someone is threatening you with a gang-rape including horses, then here.

But let's go back one season, to the pretty picture of a terrified man in his knees, an open-minded man who had been willing to work with Daenerys despite the fact she invaded his city and put his father (also an open-minded individual, opposing cruelty to children) to long, painful death. Dany knows Hizdahr might be innocent. Dany doesn't really care, she's just put another maybe innocent noble to death by dragon fire. Dany decides to marry Hizdahr because of his position in the city, and he doesn't have much to say. The possibility of being fed to her monstrous pets is always here. During the wedding Dany allows her lover to humiliate her groom and threaten him with a knife. We didn't get to the wedding night, but we know that Hizdahr would have no choice, but to consumate (if he wouldn't be unable to perform out of fear, anyway), but hey, Dany is hot, what's the problem? From what we're shown, it looks like Dany having other lovers is his biggest husbandly problem.

Now, is Dany really different from say, Ramsay, here?

But as god-awful character as Ramsay is, he is never depicted as a Strong Man^TM because of his abuse.