CockroachCaptain Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 On 6/2/2016 at 4:59 AM, Good Guy Garlan said: Fixed it for you But really. If we're going to have book characters be around and do nothing of substance, might as well name some of the extras Victarion, Aeron, and Strong Belwas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragon in the North Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 19 minutes ago, tormund's beard said: but she doesn't SHOW US that she cares i can't see inside her head like in the books, she should be raging about how dorne killed her daughter the heir to the iron throne a princess of the seven kingdoms BUT SHE ISN'T. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eEvNBrBbjs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tormund's beard Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 9 minutes ago, Dragon in the North said: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eEvNBrBbjs and then agent J came from the summer isles with a neuralyzer and everyone forgot about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragon in the North Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 28 minutes ago, tormund's beard said: and then agent J came from the summer isles with a neuralyzer and everyone forgot. No, they didn't forget. In the Small Council meeting, Jaime and Cersei wanted to march on Dorne, but Kevan Lannister and the Tyrells have bigger things to worry about, like the High Sparrow holding Margary hostage. Besides, as many have pointed out, Dorne is nearly impossible to conquer and would be smarter to let Ellaria make the first move. Besides, that clip completely shatters your argument that Cersei doesn't care about Myrcella's death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tormund's beard Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 to each is own i guess. to my myrcella's death is being very poorly handled from a storytelling point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SerMixalot Posted June 5, 2016 Share Posted June 5, 2016 On 6/3/2016 at 11:32 PM, Smoke317 said: Let's make this more clear. Dorne isn't difficult to conquer. It has proven IMPOSSIBLE to conquer. Any success in bringing Dorne into the fold was through marriage. Now granted Cersei is batshit crazy and is indeed nuts enough to send troops there to be slaughtered... But she's not in charge. The Tyrells who have the strongest remaining army ain't sending their troops there to be slaughtered. Plus the Lannisters are dealing with the Faith whom Cersei foolishly gave power and has allowed to basically take over the city. There will be no immediate justice for Myrcella if there will be any at all... Just as there was no justice for Elia, Rhaenys, and Aegon... Did Dorne send there army to KL to seek vengeance? Nope and neither will the Lannisters. Not even if Tywin were still in charge. You do realize Tywin started the Wot5K because the son he hated was taken prisoner, right? You do realize that the central tenet of Tywin Lannister is the dignity of his house, how any insult small or large MUST be addressed-you know A Lannister Always Pays His Debts? You know that guy, right? So it is established in show, that the Lannisters will do anything and everything to keep the dignity of their house. Tyrion sends Myrcella to Dorne, Cersei reacts with terrific anger. She loathes the idea of Myrcella leaving Ok since then, in show Joffrey was killed and Cersei insisted that Tyrion pay with his life. Of course we haven't heard anything about Tyrion for a couple of seasons in KL, even though a Westerosi Dwarf and Bald Eunuch are running Mereen. And don't give me the word didn't get back cause, T and V know pretty much all that is happening in Westeros. Tywin (IN SHOW) attempted all he could to keep his family strong and safe, he was going to allow Tyrion to take the Black. Tywin dies at Tyrion's hands. Cersei then Kevan/Tommen take over KL Cersei receives the necklace from Dorne-viewing it as a threat against Myrcella She sends Jamie to Dorne to retrieve Myrcella Jamie returns with a poisoned Myrcella Cersei does not freak out about Myrcella's death, more of an introverted reaction She and Jamie go to Small Council to determine what action is to be taken, they are rebuffed because the Small Council has larger problems to deal with. What are these matters? In no particular order. 1. Loras and Margery held by High Sparrow 2. Riverlands? 3. Boltons marrying a Stark? 4. Dorne in Rebellion 5. Myrcella assasinated Riverlands can and should be addressed by Walder Frey-he is the liege lord and isolating Riverrun is fine. Why would that take priority over other problems? Boltons marrying a Stark? Noone seems concerned by this in KL, it is never mentioned, Sansa is wanted for regicide, right? She is already married to Tyrion, right? Nope no mention, no action taken Loras and Margery held by the High Sparrow-It takes CERSEI to get them to take the OBVIOUS action-use the Tyrells to force their release! But hey, it seems to be resolved by the end of the episode, right? So the crown does what? They send Jamie to the Riverlands? WHAAAAA? Noone is visibly outraged by Dorne's actions Noone is mentioning retribution Noone is making plans or discussing options Myrcella's death is swept under a rug The killing of the head of Dorne-what was (in show) an effective ally of the crown is ignored. And again, the throne is in serious jeopardy right now. Tommen is the only Lannister child left. Myrcella was the Lannister's ace in the hole. If Tommen dies, the Tyrells take the throne threw Margery. The Lannisters SHOULD be freaking out. But as evident from the show Kevan is an idiot. He had to be told what to do with the High Sparrow. Cersei is now passive, not freaking about Myrcella, not threatening anyone or anything to get vengeance. Jamie is meekly doing what he is told, Kevan is an idiot not realizing that he is placing the Lannister legacy in terrible jeopardy-by closely aligning with the Tyrells. Noone is doing what the show established they SHOULD be doing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragon in the North Posted June 5, 2016 Share Posted June 5, 2016 2 hours ago, SerMixalot said: So it is established in show, that the Lannisters will do anything and everything to keep the dignity of their house. No, it is established that Tywin Lannister will do anything and everything to keep the dignity of their house, not all Lannisters. As others have mentioned numerous times, Dorne managed to withstand an invasion by Aegon the Conqueror, so attacking it would be a very stupid move on Kevan's part,. The much smarter option would be to allow Ellaria to make the first move and bring the fight to them. The Riverlands was a problem that could be solved in a matter of months and would finally bring the Riverlands into the fold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoke317 Posted June 5, 2016 Share Posted June 5, 2016 4 hours ago, SerMixalot said: You do realize Tywin started the Wot5K because the son he hated was taken prisoner, right? You do realize that the central tenet of Tywin Lannister is the dignity of his house, how any insult small or large MUST be addressed-you know A Lannister Always Pays His Debts? You know that guy, right? So it is established in show, that the Lannisters will do anything and everything to keep the dignity of their house. Tyrion sends Myrcella to Dorne, Cersei reacts with terrific anger. She loathes the idea of Myrcella leaving Ok since then, in show Joffrey was killed and Cersei insisted that Tyrion pay with his life. Of course we haven't heard anything about Tyrion for a couple of seasons in KL, even though a Westerosi Dwarf and Bald Eunuch are running Mereen. And don't give me the word didn't get back cause, T and V know pretty much all that is happening in Westeros. Tywin (IN SHOW) attempted all he could to keep his family strong and safe, he was going to allow Tyrion to take the Black. Tywin dies at Tyrion's hands. Cersei then Kevan/Tommen take over KL Cersei receives the necklace from Dorne-viewing it as a threat against Myrcella She sends Jamie to Dorne to retrieve Myrcella Jamie returns with a poisoned Myrcella Cersei does not freak out about Myrcella's death, more of an introverted reaction She and Jamie go to Small Council to determine what action is to be taken, they are rebuffed because the Small Council has larger problems to deal with. What are these matters? In no particular order. 1. Loras and Margery held by High Sparrow 2. Riverlands? 3. Boltons marrying a Stark? 4. Dorne in Rebellion 5. Myrcella assasinated Riverlands can and should be addressed by Walder Frey-he is the liege lord and isolating Riverrun is fine. Why would that take priority over other problems? Boltons marrying a Stark? Noone seems concerned by this in KL, it is never mentioned, Sansa is wanted for regicide, right? She is already married to Tyrion, right? Nope no mention, no action taken Loras and Margery held by the High Sparrow-It takes CERSEI to get them to take the OBVIOUS action-use the Tyrells to force their release! But hey, it seems to be resolved by the end of the episode, right? So the crown does what? They send Jamie to the Riverlands? WHAAAAA? Noone is visibly outraged by Dorne's actions Noone is mentioning retribution Noone is making plans or discussing options Myrcella's death is swept under a rug The killing of the head of Dorne-what was (in show) an effective ally of the crown is ignored. And again, the throne is in serious jeopardy right now. Tommen is the only Lannister child left. Myrcella was the Lannister's ace in the hole. If Tommen dies, the Tyrells take the throne threw Margery. The Lannisters SHOULD be freaking out. But as evident from the show Kevan is an idiot. He had to be told what to do with the High Sparrow. Cersei is now passive, not freaking about Myrcella, not threatening anyone or anything to get vengeance. Jamie is meekly doing what he is told, Kevan is an idiot not realizing that he is placing the Lannister legacy in terrible jeopardy-by closely aligning with the Tyrells. Noone is doing what the show established they SHOULD be doing! I agree that the show has screwed up a lot of the characters but Tywin was one of the if not the smartest & shrewdest person on the show. No way he'd send troops to Dorne to be slaughtered. Plus he knew it was all retribution for his own actions. They were just coming out of a bloody war. They did not have the manpower to launch a prolonged offensive into Dorne. Now he may have tried to contact other Dornish houses and devised a double cross ensuring them control in the end... That's a Tywin move. Not a headlong assault into a country that has NEVER been conquered. Not even with Dragons... And also Tywin was not gonna let Tyrion take the black. He was gonna let him be executed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SerMixalot Posted June 5, 2016 Share Posted June 5, 2016 Reacting to dorne killing myrcella does not necessarily mean invading dorne though that would be likely it does mean reacting to it kevan immediately using force to release marg and loras would have allowed him to use the Tyrell army to attack dorne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SerMixalot Posted June 5, 2016 Share Posted June 5, 2016 6 hours ago, Smoke317 said: I agree that the show has screwed up a lot of the characters but Tywin was one of the if not the smartest & shrewdest person on the show. No way he'd send troops to Dorne to be slaughtered. Plus he knew it was all retribution for his own actions. They were just coming out of a bloody war. They did not have the manpower to launch a prolonged offensive into Dorne. Now he may have tried to contact other Dornish houses and devised a double cross ensuring them control in the end... That's a Tywin move. Not a headlong assault into a country that has NEVER been conquered. Not even with Dragons... And also Tywin was not gonna let Tyrion take the black. He was gonna let him be executed. No that was the deal in the show tyrion lives takes the black and Jamie become tywin heir Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddy1 Posted June 5, 2016 Share Posted June 5, 2016 It's hilarious seeing people here trying to rationalise D&D's abysmal writing. The lack of reaction to Myrcella's death is one of the many massive plot holes in this mess of a show. Dorne may be difficult to conquer, but Cersie or Kevan could at least have sent a few assassins to kill Ellaria. Jamie and Bronn have shown how easy this could be achieved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoke317 Posted June 5, 2016 Share Posted June 5, 2016 3 hours ago, SerMixalot said: No that was the deal in the show tyrion lives takes the black and Jamie become tywin heir Yeah you're right. Tywin definitely would have let Tyrion take the black to get Jamie out of the Kingsguard and back at Casterly Rock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SerMixalot Posted June 5, 2016 Share Posted June 5, 2016 5 hours ago, Eddy1 said: It's hilarious seeing people here trying to rationalise D&D's abysmal writing. The lack of reaction to Myrcella's death is one of the many massive plot holes in this mess of a show. Dorne may be difficult to conquer, but Cersie or Kevan could at least have sent a few assassins to kill Ellaria. Jamie and Bronn have shown how easy this could be achieved. Faceless men Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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