A little stopover by the Bridge of Volantis.

[Arkash]

Okay, I'm probably in the minority but one of the highlight (among many) of this episode was the Theon / Yara scene for me ! 
Great acting, solid dialogue (coherent with the characters), great dynamics, fun and sad at the same time ! 

Well done for that ! I can see why some might see it as superfluous but I really think it was a very strong scene !

Discuss and debate it as you want but I thought it'd be good to have a thread for the sequence ! 

[RoamingRonin]

It felt it was a it superfluous until Yara told Theon they were going to Meereen. Character development is fine but the story has to progress in some measure. It seemed odd to have Yara practically bullying Theon into getting over his time with Ramsay but having her coddle him would have been completely out of character. The acting was great - Alfie Allen can say a lot with just his eyes - and I don't mind Yara being lesbian/bi at all. 

I believe Arya heard later in the episode the iron born were in Meereen so I'm looking forward to Yara, Theon and... Tyrion?

 

[nymeria_2321]

I wasn't really a fan of yara's speech to Theon. Like the guy is clearly trying, he escaped winterfell, came to her and is trying to help her. But the guy was tortured both physically and psychologically for months/years, you don't just get over that in the blink of an eye or because someone yells at you to get over it. 

[Jaqitch H'ghar]

49 minutes ago, nymeria_2321 said:

...because someone yells at you to get over it. 

But she also made him chugalug. Westeros' version of funneling can repair any psychological damage.

[Solstice]

55 minutes ago, nymeria_2321 said:

I wasn't really a fan of yara's speech to Theon. Like the guy is clearly trying, he escaped winterfell, came to her and is trying to help her. But the guy was tortured both physically and psychologically for months/years, you don't just get over that in the blink of an eye or because someone yells at you to get over it. 

True, but I think Yara has a point. It is Westeros/Essos and it is war, what else can you than go on or kill yourself? I dont think a person will ever be able to recover after a Ramsey treatment, not with tons of psychologist and meds from RL, and sure as hell not in Westeros without all these things.

 

Actually I thought it was kind of nice giving him the choice to kill himself without the whole coward/disgrace/etc. speech.

[Good Guy Garlan]

I thought it was in character for Yara to be like, "Get over it." Really, the Ironborn of all people wouldn't really care about mental issues, they'd just prescribe you a hearty dose of Man Up. I could also imagine even Book!Asha experimenting with women, so why not Yara? 

The dialogue was...not good, though. "Nothing in the Iron Islands has an ass like that" is the new "bad pussy."

 

[SeanF]

6 minutes ago, Good Guy Garlan said:

I thought it was in character for Yara to be like, "Get over it." Really, the Ironborn of all people wouldn't really care about mental issues, they'd just prescribe you a hearty dose of Man Up. I could also imagine even Book!Asha experimenting with women, so why not Yara? 

The dialogue was...not good, though. "Nothing in the Iron Islands has an ass like that" is the new "bad pussy."

 

That's Shakespearean compared to "I'm going to fuck the tits off that!"

[Graeham]

If she'd said 'arse' rather than 'ass' it would have been better, I think. I dislike it when someone is clearly speaking in a heavy British accent but then says 'ass' rather than 'arse'. I guess it's because I'm British myself, though.

In fact, didn't some of the earlier seasons use the word 'arse'? I may be imagining it but I sweat Robert Baratheon said  it...

[Red Tiger]

15 minutes ago, Good Guy Garlan said:

I thought it was in character for Yara to be like, "Get over it." Really, the Ironborn of all people wouldn't really care about mental issues, they'd just prescribe you a hearty dose of Man Up. I could also imagine even Book!Asha experimenting with women, so why not Yara? 

The dialogue was...not good, though. "Nothing in the Iron Islands has an ass like that" is the new "bad pussy."

 

No....No....Just...fucking....NO

[RoamingRonin]

17 minutes ago, Good Guy Garlan said:

I thought it was in character for Yara to be like, "Get over it." Really, the Ironborn of all people wouldn't really care about mental issues, they'd just prescribe you a hearty dose of Man Up. I could also imagine even Book!Asha experimenting with women, so why not Yara? 

The dialogue was...not good, though. "Nothing in the Iron Islands has an ass like that" is the new "bad pussy."

You go too far, ser.

[jbent87]

1 hour ago, nymeria_2321 said:

I wasn't really a fan of yara's speech to Theon. Like the guy is clearly trying, he escaped winterfell, came to her and is trying to help her. But the guy was tortured both physically and psychologically for months/years, you don't just get over that in the blink of an eye or because someone yells at you to get over it. 

Yeah, I hated that scene and I have really liked Yara's character. "Oh you're dealing with some mental stuff that I don't know anything about? Chug this beer and you'll be okay, or kill yourself." Uh, okay. At least we had boobs though. 

[Good Guy Garlan]

You're right, nothing will ever top "bad pussy." I mean, that's an Emmy winning line. 

17 minutes ago, SeanF said:

That's Shakespearean compared to "I'm going to fuck the tits off that!"

I was gonna mention that one too. Yara is such a frat bro. 

 

[Nerevanin]

I didn't like it much tbh and for several reasons. First, they were in a brothel-like something which added nothing to the story or whatever, it was just that there could include as many tits as they wished. At first I thought that there were there on the purpose that Yara would act as a man in order to hide her true identity from Euron's informators. No, just tits. Then, Yara and the whore was just pointless, made for no other reasons than tits and two women kissing. Ultimately, Yara was talking to Theon about how he needed to become himself and stand for himself etc, while making him drink the ale in the same manner you would say to a dog to "sit". So... a no-no from me.

[Hodor's Aunt]

1 hour ago, nymeria_2321 said:

I wasn't really a fan of yara's speech to Theon. Like the guy is clearly trying, he escaped winterfell, came to her and is trying to help her. But the guy was tortured both physically and psychologically for months/years, you don't just get over that in the blink of an eye or because someone yells at you to get over it. 

Well, she is a fockin pirate. And not a fockin psychologist. It would be completly bullshit if she would not try to "heal" him the hard way. If it does work or not is a different question. There are RL examples for everything. He could recover, kill himself or went full psycho.

[SeanF]

8 minutes ago, jbent87 said:

Yeah, I hated that scene and I have really liked Yara's character. "Oh you're dealing with some mental stuff that I don't know anything about? Chug this beer and you'll be okay, or kill yourself." Uh, okay. At least we had boobs though. 

Actually, I think it would be pretty much in character for the Ironborn to say (in effect) "Pull yourself together" to one of their number who'd been brutally tortured for years.  They aren't the most sensitive of people.

It's the other bits of the dialogue that are awful.  No one speaks like that outside of porn films.

 

[Bayard]

5 minutes ago, SeanF said:

Actually, I think it would be pretty much in character for the Ironborn to say (in effect) "Pull yourself together" to one of their number who'd been brutally tortured for years.  They aren't the most sensitive of people.

It's the other bits of the dialogue that are awful.  No one speaks like that outside of porn films.

 

Alright, but Asha/Yara is not exactly the stereotypical Ironborn, come on, she's very smart. She wanted to grab land for farming, for the timber...

[Hodor's Aunt]

2 hours ago, RoamingRonin said:

It felt it was a it superfluous until Yara told Theon they were going to Meereen. Character development is fine but the story has to progress in some measure. It seemed odd to have Yara practically bullying Theon into getting over his time with Ramsay but having her coddle him would have been completely out of character. The acting was great - Alfie Allen can say a lot with just his eyes - and I don't mind Yara being lesbian/bi at all.

I don't think Yara is lesbian or even bi at all. She is pretending to be a man for her people. Throwing axes, drinking ale and making dirty jokes. She is posing as a man. What else does a real hard ironborn man do when there is nothing to kill or plunder? Fuck some whores. And so she does in that scene.

When the old Egytians had a ruling female pharao at times they would put on a beard on their statues. That has nothing to do with the modern concept of crossdressing or gender change or anything like that. It just shows that a women acts like a man.

[Hodor's Aunt]

1 minute ago, Bayard said:

Alright, but Asha/Yara is not exactly the stereotypical Ironborn, come on, she's very smart. She wanted to grab land for farming, for the timber...

That doesn't make her a modern life psychologist. Only a hundred years ago after the first world war people who had suffered traumata as soldiers during that war where "treated" with electro-shocking or beaten. And that was by the best medicians who practized by that time. Now we go 1000 more years back to the age of the vikings and end up with Yara. She could be Ironborn Einstein and still would not a have any clue how to treat Theon.

[Forlong the Fat]

23 minutes ago, Nerevanin said:

I didn't like it much tbh and for several reasons. First, they were in a brothel-like something which added nothing to the story or whatever, it was just that there could include as many tits as they wished. At first I thought that there were there on the purpose that Yara would act as a man in order to hide her true identity from Euron's informators. No, just tits. Then, Yara and the whore was just pointless, made for no other reasons than tits and two women kissing. Ultimately, Yara was talking to Theon about how he needed to become himself and stand for himself etc, while making him drink the ale in the same manner you would say to a dog to "sit". So... a no-no from me.

They were in a bar/brothel because a bar/brothel is the first and perhaps only place these people would go in Volantis. These are Ironborn. They're not going to the library or a temple. Beside which, naked women look nice. Why not show them?

Yara and the whore was there to show where she and Theon are as characters, but most especially Theon. His emasculation is clearly bothering him. 

As for Yara's methods, they likely would not be approved as a validated PTSD treatment by most psychiatrists. But she is leader of a band of reavers, not a psychiatrist, so it seemed pretty consistent to me. 

[Red Tiger]

33 minutes ago, Hodor's Aunt said:

I don't think Yara is lesbian or even bi at all. She is pretending to be a man for her people. Throwing axes, drinking ale and making dirty jokes. She is posing as a man. What else does a real hard ironborn man do when there is nothing to kill or plunder? Fuck some whores. And so she does in that scene.

Yeah...im calling bullshit on this. Asha fucked other dudes in the books while being captain of her own ship, they followed her anyway and she came close to ruling the Iron Islands, until Euron showed up.