gregg22 Posted June 10, 2016 Share Posted June 10, 2016 On 6/8/2016 at 0:58 PM, Ser Hyle said: It looks like you said Jon moping around and lamenting is a character shift. Well considerably more "mopey' then! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gregg22 Posted June 10, 2016 Share Posted June 10, 2016 Actually, the only thing he ever said about it was that Jorah at least the sense to leave it behind when he fled. Other mentions of the sword are conspicuously absent. Jorah never mentions it once. We have detailed histories of the other Valerian steel swords, but not this one. I just don't believe Mormont here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Lash Posted June 10, 2016 Share Posted June 10, 2016 Valyrian steel. Duh. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Princess of Dragonflies Posted June 10, 2016 Share Posted June 10, 2016 On 6/6/2016 at 2:21 PM, Direwight said: Well, mentioning that Jeor gave him the sword because he's so worthy of it would have come across as boasting. ...which is why the angle should instead have been that Jeor gave him the sword for saving him from a walking corpse trying to murder him, because that's how big a deal good old Jeor thought walking corpses are so you should too. This! On 6/6/2016 at 2:28 PM, Ferocious Veldt Roarer said: Does Lyanna, or any other Mormont, even care? There's something odd about Longclaw. Normally, a house that has a cool sword can't shut the fuck about it. At least it'll get mentioned several times. Say, Heartsbane: Samwell tells Jon about it, Cat knows its name, so does Brienne, it gets one mention in TWOIAF. The Longclaw? Nobody cares. Sure, the name appears fifty-odd times, but all of it is Jon and Samwell. Not Ser Jorah, not any of the she-bears, not a single Mormont mentions their alleged ancestral sword. Weird! I don't believe it was the Mormont sword to begin with. On 6/6/2016 at 4:50 PM, Rob Storm said: I have a question to those who believe Jon should return it: Shouldn't Brienne give Oathkeeper back to Sansa or Jon? Jon got his as a gift from a man allowed to pass it on to whom he pleased. The Starks lost their VS sword to Lannister treachery and Brienne got it from a Lannister. Reforging it is even more of an insult too but I know everyone will just say Oathkeeper is different than Ice...i disagree I'm with you on this one. On 6/7/2016 at 6:01 PM, Glass guy said: Longclaw is now the Stark family sword. It seems unlikely that they'll get Ice back. Not sure who'll get it after Jon, though. Rickon? Sansa's eventual child? I think once Brienne gets a new sword, she'll return Oathkeeper. Hell, she might even get the other one from Jaime when they meet up. Guess who else is in the Riverlands and learned a thing or two from the very man who reforged them, Gendry...Crap...I think I'm mixing up the books and shows On 6/7/2016 at 6:53 PM, gregg22 said: .... However, the sword situation just adds to my belief that Longclaw was never a Mormont ancestral sword, and is more likely a sword tied to Jon's true ancestry. .... This exactly! On 6/7/2016 at 5:58 AM, Zenthious said: I'm can't recall if this happened in the show, but specifically from the book: LC Mormont took the bear hilt off of that sword and had it changed to a direwolf head. Jorah was his son and should have inherited it, but I think Jon grew to be more of a son to him during his stent as Stewart to the LC. I think in his mind his house was in decline, and so it was also a pay it forward moment. It kind of mirrors the blackfyre rebellion, in a way. The sword in that scenario was a mark of kingship/leadership. So, in the minds of those who supported the black dragon, handing down the sword was same as handing down the crown. It's mentioned in the show that he had it changed to a wolf. On 6/7/2016 at 7:43 AM, StarksNTargs said: .... Also, crazy theory... what if that sword was never really a Mormont heirloom in the first place? What if it was brought to the Wall by Maester Aemon and given to Jeor once he became Lord Commander? Meaning, the sword may actually be Blackfyre ....heirloom of House Targaryen. I wouldn't call this crazy because I absolutely believe that the sword could be Blackfyre left there by Bloodraven when he and Maester Aemon took the black. That sword caused a lot of dragon drama, it'd be safer to take it with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darksky Posted June 10, 2016 Share Posted June 10, 2016 Why should he? It was a thank you gift from Jeor, he earned it. It's his. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darksky Posted June 10, 2016 Share Posted June 10, 2016 On 8.06.2016 at 2:34 AM, Smoke317 said: I'm sure the show will go another route but I still hold out hope for Dawn to play a big role in the books and I hope Jon is the one wielding it. Along with Euron's Valyrian Steel Armor... Lol. Don't forget Valyrian steel shield and a unicorn or pegasus to ride/fly into battle with. Martin loves his plot gifts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meera of Tarth Posted June 10, 2016 Share Posted June 10, 2016 DB post sorry . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meera of Tarth Posted June 10, 2016 Share Posted June 10, 2016 just edited and lost everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meera of Tarth Posted June 10, 2016 Share Posted June 10, 2016 On 6/6/2016 at 6:56 PM, Malchyor said: You want your house back, but won't give up a sword to get it? WTF? Without Davos, Jon would have failed. And at no point was that sword spoken of. I get that it's invaluable, especially having seen what it can do against the coming threat of The White Walkers. But...really? One emergency at a time! Because it was a Present. It's Jon who has to decide who will be the next to have it. And giving it away would be a "plothole" since he wouldn't be protected against the WWs that might appear soon. Bran knows they will reappear soon. ANd Bran is near Castle Black. ANd according to Davos Quote the Dead are coming. so Winds of Winter ep 10 might refer to them. Jon has to wield a Valyrian sword. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darksky Posted June 10, 2016 Share Posted June 10, 2016 Never understood this fanatical fascination with Dawn or any other 'special' sword. At the end of the day, they're just tools albeit made from more solid stuff than your average ones. The strength of the sword is and should be the wielder. I doubt that if a noob picked up Dawn he'd be able to do any damage with it. 'Special' swords don't give their wielder automatic +99 ATK/SPD/DEF/ACC/Stamina and +3000 HP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoke317 Posted June 10, 2016 Share Posted June 10, 2016 8 minutes ago, Darksky said: Never understood this fanatical fascination with Dawn or any other 'special' sword. At the end of the day, they're just tools albeit made from more solid stuff than your average ones. The strength of the sword is and should be the wielder. I doubt that if a noob picked up Dawn he'd be able to do any damage with it. 'Special' swords don't give their wielder automatic +99 ATK/SPD/DEF/ACC/Stamina and +3000 HP. Well the books have played up special swords... Valyrian Steele: ice now Oathkeeper and widows wail, Heartsbane, Longclaw, Blackfyre, dark sister. Special swords: dawn and Lightbringer. Being that Jon seems like a hero that will fight the Others/white walkers I'd like for him to use one. I know he has Longclaw but something about "Dawn" being used in the war for the dawn or the long night seems poetic. Dawn signifies the rising of the sun which ends the night. Thus dawn seems like the perfect candidate for Lightbringer... And the show has shown that these special swords (the Valyrian ones at least) are more than tools because the walkers swords shatter regular Steele. Actually the books show this too. I get that they need to be used by great warriors. But that's exactly what I want. Not Sam wielding Heartsbane. But give me Jon(Dawn), Hound(Heartsbane), Brienne(Oathkeeper), Jorah(Longclaw), and maybe Arya(Widows Wail) fighting the Walkers and I'd love to see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meera of Tarth Posted June 10, 2016 Share Posted June 10, 2016 10 minutes ago, Smoke317 said: Well the books have played up special swords... Valyrian Steele: ice now Oathkeeper and widows wail, Heartsbane, Longclaw, Blackfyre, dark sister. Special swords: dawn and Lightbringer. Being that Jon seems like a hero that will fight the Others/white walkers I'd like for him to use one. I know he has Longclaw but something about "Dawn" being used in the war for the dawn or the long night seems poetic. Dawn signifies the rising of the sun which ends the night. Thus dawn seems like the perfect candidate for Lightbringer... And the show has shown that these special swords (the Valyrian ones at least) are more than tools because the walkers swords shatter regular Steele. Actually the books show this too. I get that they need to be used by great warriors. But that's exactly what I want. Not Sam wielding Heartsbane. But give me Jon(Dawn), Hound(Heartsbane), Brienne(Oathkeeper), Jorah(Longclaw), and maybe Arya(Widows Wail) fighting the Walkers and I'd love to see it. I agree. I think JOn's final sword might be Dawn, being it LightBringer. If Jorah survives, he should wield Longclaw. That would fit a lot. I really want Jorah to survive (fingers crossed). And they put a lot of emphasis in the Valyrian Swords, and there a few of them, and also that there are some good (few) warriors all over the world. //excuse my spelling, writing on tablet// Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darksky Posted June 10, 2016 Share Posted June 10, 2016 This special emphasis on swords in the books is like a geek convention. Dawn to be The Sword used in the Battle for the Dawn....Bravo George so creative, subtle and unconventional. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoke317 Posted June 10, 2016 Share Posted June 10, 2016 1 minute ago, Darksky said: This special emphasis on swords in the books is like a geek convention. Dawn to be The Sword used in the Battle for the Dawn....Bravo George so creative, subtle and unconventional. Lol. Pale milk glass blade. Carved from the heart of a fallen star. You know if you could wield a sword, you'd want a badass blade like that too... Lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mormont Posted June 11, 2016 Share Posted June 11, 2016 [mod] This is the show forum, so let's get back to talking about the show instead of the books, please. [/mod] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfin Posted June 11, 2016 Share Posted June 11, 2016 On June 7, 2016 at 11:03 AM, Perrin Stark said: There is no made up story. Jon saved Mormont's life. In appreciation he gave the sword with a changed hilt to Jon. Often times the simplest answer is the correct answer. Mormont gave the sword to Jon because GRRM needed Jon to have that sword so he could kill WWs....or do you guys wanna blame that also on D&D? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JazzyButterfly Posted June 11, 2016 Share Posted June 11, 2016 Long Claw was given to Jon by Joer Mormont because that is who he wanted to have it. It belongs to Jon not House Mormont. If Joer Mormont wanted House Mormont to have the sword he would have given it to them. Jon has no obligation to give up that sword. Secondly, he needs that sword to fight the walkers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slaysman Posted September 7, 2016 Share Posted September 7, 2016 On 6/6/2016 at 1:59 PM, DirewolfDave said: You'd have given it back? Really? Mormont gave it to him very directly. His only stipulation (can't remember if it was book or show) was that he give it to Jorah should he ever end up at the wall taking the black. If Jorah survives the series. (Doubtful in the books...EXTREMELY doubtful in the show) I expect Jon to give it to him once the WW have been dealt with. This was neither in the books or the show. There was no stipulation given when Jeor gave Jon Longclaw. He did ask that someone get word to Jorah to join the Night's Watch to erase the shame he caused the family name. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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