Davos and Tormund's talk

[facelessaryas]

On June 20, 2016 at 3:24 PM, RhaeBee said:

I think Davos is the kind of guy who always needs someone to follow. His life was Stannis and now he has nothing. His son died long ago. He needs to do something with his life and following a young leader who shows signs of potential (a little, sometimes) seems like the best he's got. 

As for Mel, I'm a bit fed up with returns this season. We had some many returns, literally and metaphorically, It totally lost its cachet. I think she is over and I think she should be over. The story will soon end and plotlines and characters need to be wrapped up too. 

I think Davos will ask Jon for permission to burn her. Then maybe as she's burning, everyone will see she's old as hell, and Jon and Davos will freak out. That'd be cool. 

[princess_snow]

23 hours ago, princess_snow said:

I agree.

I didn't see it as Mel smirking after the battle, more like relieved. I felt like her look was exactly how I was feeling. Maybe she was happy one of her visions had proven true ? 

 

45 minutes ago, TickTak7 said:

She saw Winterfell in the flames. 

She that Azor Ahai in the flames, fighting at Winterfell. 

She thought Azor Ahai was Stannis, who went to Winterfell, and failed. 

She know witnessed Jon Snow fighting, and winning at Winterfell. 

It was a smirk of relief, most likely - don't forget, Mel has been questioning her faith, visions, and purpose ever since Stannis died. 

Now  that she's brought Jon back, and he's won at Winterfell, she's relieved that her faith is still with her and that she's finally correctly interpreted. 

This is exactly what I was saying. However I didnt see it as a smirk - I dont think she is being snide, given her state of mind ( as you mentioned )  - its relief one of her visions were correct. 

[RhaenysBee]

15 hours ago, facelessaryas said:

I think Davos will ask Jon for permission to burn her. Then maybe as she's burning, everyone will see she's old as hell, and Jon and Davos will freak out. That'd be cool. 

I dont think Davos would want to burn her and I dont think Jon would grant permission. Jon shot Mance because he didn't like the burn alive method. And Davos has been speaking up against it for 5 seasons. Davos and Jon are supposed to be just and honorable people. But then... Who knows...? 

[Boudica]

On 6/20/2016 at 6:54 PM, Quyen Thuy Tran said:

1) Davos and Tormund's talk before the battle about their kings (Stannis and Mance) seems to be quite foretelling to me. 

- They both are disillusioned by what happened to their kings. 

- Tormund said: "But Jon Snow is no king." 

-----> does this mean Jon will never be king? He will be the hero, I guess. But people follow him not because he is or will ever be a king? 

2) Jon and Mel's talk seems to be quite telling to me as well. Mel said "maybe he bought you back just for you to die again."

-----> does this mean Jon will be come the hero who leads people in the final battle then die?

any opinion about these talks?

I think it might actually be the opposite, or an ironic statement. Like when Robert tells Ned that there might be Kings hiding underneath the snow. Jon will soon become a King. 

 

On 6/20/2016 at 7:48 PM, RhaeBee said:

Mel and Jon: 

reminder that Mel is really over. Established that the red God brings people back and not her (so nobody will want her to bring back wun Wun or Rickon), reminder that Jon is a mess and he doesn't like being back. About the quote, I think I means that Mel isn't sure of anything anymore, and ties in with Jon going to battle hoping he will die ( I personally thought he had that written all over his face and actions). 

I think some of Jon's fire might have been returned during the battle. He did not want to live, but when he is buried underneath the bodies, he decides that he wants to live. 

Melisandre has a similar moment. When she sees herself walking along the battlements of Winterfell while the Bolton banners are falling down, she sees that her vision has come true, exactly as she predicted. She regains some of her confidence. 

Davos will place Jon in a difficult position, with regards to Melisandre. But at the end of the day it was Stannis who give the order, Stannis was in command, the final decision for the burning of Shireen was always with Stannis.  Davos has to learn to accept that fact. 

[John Suburbs]

Did anyone else think that in that final Mel shot, she looked an awful lot like Cersei?

 

 

[Ser Hyle]

On 6/20/2016 at 1:38 PM, John Suburbs said:

My take on that was Davos saying "Maybe it was a mistake believing in kings," to which Tormund replies, "Jon Snow is no king", and Davos says, "No, he's not."

So from that, I gather that they both came to a mutual understanding that Jon is more than a king and that they should follow him. He has come back from the dead, after all. The last time that happened in the real world, it started a religion.

Holy shit, it really did? Like really?

[ghostwolf84]

Jon snow is not a king he is the prince that was promised 

[plastic throne]

All Melisandre has to do is stop taking those damn pills or whatever the fuck she's taking to look so yummy and no one can trace her, ever

As for Jon, I don't see him as a king type, he always striked me (both book and show) as a complete loner type. If he won't die in the finals, sacrificing himself, I see him more like wandering the woods with Ghost with occasional trip to some village or something. I'd be surprised if he even takes a wife, Val for example.

[John Suburbs]

23 hours ago, Ser Hyle said:

Holy shit, it really did? Like really?

That's what people say. I didn't witness it myself, of course.

[JonnySnow88]

I believe this conversation was a contrast on choosing to follow and die for a person, and being compelled to by pre-existing paradigms.