chasing the dragons

Who will resist Dany in Westeros?

111 posts in this topic

Everyone but the Martells. Cersei and Margaery won't welcome another wannabe queen. Sansa wants to rule and LF will support her. Then again, if cersei does burn KL, it won't matter

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I think we saw that Throne Room covered in snow for a reason. What would be the sense of including that detail if it was not going to happen?

I'm not sure how it will all go down but there is no way that HBO passes up an opportunity to prove that they are in fact feminists despite all the countless nude and raped redheads they show by uniting Yara, Dany, the Sand Snakes, and Sansa at some point. Maybe something like a Triumvirate of the Queens. Sansa in the North, Margery in KL, Yara of the Islands, Sand Snakes of Dorne, Dany in Essos. I jest but who knows, these are the same writers that gave us "you wanted a good girl but you need a bad pussy." I'm all for a Queen but I really hope it doesn't take it to that extreme. When the show wants to excuse excessive rape and nudity then it cries "it's realism" and when it wants to excuse unrealistic moments and bad writing, it cries "it's fantasy."

I'm putting my money on the High Sparrow finishing the Tyrells and the Lannister's imploding (and exploding) long before Dany makes it to Westeros. Where does the show ultimately leave Arya? Littlefinger? What good is Bran's power if not to stop either the White Walkers or Dany or both?

 

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Let's take a look at Dany's forces for a moment. Foreign slave soldiers, Dothraki barbarians and the Ironborn. The first two will remind everyone she's an outsider, the latter two have legendary reputations for raping, pillaging and murdering. How popular do you think any of this is going to be in Westeros? No matter how divided the Seven Kingdoms are, she would be an immediate outsider.

If she manages to conquer Westeros, it will be from fear. Fear of her dragons, fear of a field of fire, fear of her armies destroying what precious little they have left after the War of the Five Kings. But on the other hand, Drogon isn't Balerion the dread. The dragons seem to in the balance between fearsome killing machines and still being very killable themselves.

Dorne may be open to the possibility of joining with Dany for the sake of vengeance against the Lannisters. The Lannister-Tyrell alliance is invested completely in the current regime for the Westerlands or the Reach to ever consider bending the knee. Lest we forget that Tommen is in theory a Baratheon, so the stormlords that survived being loyal to Renly and Stannis aren't likely do shift again. The Riverlands are once against subjugated by the Lannister-Frey alliance. The North is likely going to be striving for political independence again and likely going to be staying close to home this time in preparation for the Long Night.

That leaves the Vale as the largest wildcard. They all but declared themselves rebels to the crown by helping the Starks overthrow the Boltons. So while they are in direct opposition to the Iron Throne now, even if they have troubles closer to home, they're motivations remain a mystery. Beyond Sansa and Sweetrobin being cousins there's not much of a connection so I can't see the Vale being invested in Northern independence. Littlefinger is calling the shots so, it's possible he could see jumping on a Targaryen bandwagon as the winning play.

Dany's going to have to be careful with whom she attacks and how she goes about it. A hard push could cause her enemies to submit... or unite them against her all the more firmly.

 

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The only armies remaining are Dorne (entire, unused army, with Dany), the Reach (against), the Westerlands (against) and the Vale (too far north to matter).

The WesterL and the Reach have fought hard and bled in the war of the finve kings. And the former is stil llargely in the Riverlands while the latter partly in KL (ta-dah!)

If Dany lands in Dorne she'll have all the time in the world to plan an irresistible invasion (and she has Tyrion AND Varys). Plus the Dornish are somewhat used to Essosi mass migrations... :)

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We're talking about the show here - it doesn't do complicated plots or depth, and it's running out of episodes. For simplicity's sake I think the focus needs to be on the threat beyond the Wall; Cercei effectively wiping out the Lannisters and Tyrells next week will cease all resistance. The Game of Thrones is over, Dany will have brought over a huge army with no one to fight south of the Wall. 

 

So whilst all will bend the knee, I stand by my long-held theory that her huge army of barbarians who live to pillage and rape (it'll be really naff if Yara's Iron Born really do just give up their way of life just like that, but I don't see the Dothraki doing that and taking up farming) will turn out to be every bit as much of a threat to the human race in Westeros as the White Walkers.

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16 hours ago, Lord Lannister said:

Let's take a look at Dany's forces for a moment. Foreign slave soldiers, Dothraki barbarians and the Ironborn. The first two will remind everyone she's an outsider, the latter two have legendary reputations for raping, pillaging and murdering. How popular do you think any of this is going to be in Westeros? No matter how divided the Seven Kingdoms are, she would be an immediate outsider.

If she manages to conquer Westeros, it will be from fear. Fear of her dragons, fear of a field of fire, fear of her armies destroying what precious little they have left after the War of the Five Kings. But on the other hand, Drogon isn't Balerion the dread. The dragons seem to in the balance between fearsome killing machines and still being very killable themselves.

Dorne may be open to the possibility of joining with Dany for the sake of vengeance against the Lannisters. The Lannister-Tyrell alliance is invested completely in the current regime for the Westerlands or the Reach to ever consider bending the knee. Lest we forget that Tommen is in theory a Baratheon, so the stormlords that survived being loyal to Renly and Stannis aren't likely do shift again. The Riverlands are once against subjugated by the Lannister-Frey alliance. The North is likely going to be striving for political independence again and likely going to be staying close to home this time in preparation for the Long Night.

That leaves the Vale as the largest wildcard. They all but declared themselves rebels to the crown by helping the Starks overthrow the Boltons. So while they are in direct opposition to the Iron Throne now, even if they have troubles closer to home, they're motivations remain a mystery. Beyond Sansa and Sweetrobin being cousins there's not much of a connection so I can't see the Vale being invested in Northern independence. Littlefinger is calling the shots so, it's possible he could see jumping on a Targaryen bandwagon as the winning play.

Dany's going to have to be careful with whom she attacks and how she goes about it. A hard push could cause her enemies to submit... or unite them against her all the more firmly.

 

do you think common peoples cares about who sits on iron throne? (well they misses targ era though and mentions how things were different under dragons -peace and prosperity which targs brought ) or great lords of westeros all moralist?  if so then why honorable Robb stark allied with boltons whose tradition is flay people alive? and mormonts Jon snow with wildlings (cannibals ,murders,rapists) , do you think tyrells would sink with lannisters? lol

she can crubstomp united westeros even before westeros was destroyed by war of 5 kings, both Jorah and Robert baratheon said khal drogo khalsaar alone can defeat whole westeros , she united all chis army and dotharki army + has sellsword and dragons

in military brawl she is invincible only way she can lose is scheming/poisoning or assassination

Edited by blckp

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I can see the north aligning with her, or at least being open to meet for negotiations. Especially in the show where she has Tyrion to counsel her who Jon has made friends with in season 1. Although he did scoff at the WW threat when they asked for men while he was hand of the King, Dany would probably be more open to believing in them after all the magic she's seen. 

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I don't think Dany will face much opposition from the houses south of the neck. But when she reaches the North it won't only be the WW as the enemy but it would be mainly fighting the cold and harsh condition of winter. Its similar to Napoleon marching on Russia during the winter, the army was perfectly capable of defeating the other army but it couldn't beat the cold.

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22 minutes ago, blckp said:

do you think common peoples cares about who sits on iron throne? (well they misses targ era though and mentions how things were different under dragons -peace and prosperity which targs brought ) or great lords of westeros all moralist?  if so then why honorable Robb stark allied with boltons whose tradition is flay people alive? and mormonts Jon snow with wildlings (cannibals ,murders,rapists) , do you think tyrells would sink with lannisters? lol

she can crubstomp united westeros even before westeros was destroyed by war of 5 kings, both Jorah and Robert baratheon said khal drogo khalsaar alone can defeat whole westeros , she united all chis army and dotharki army + has sellsword and dragons

in military brawl she is invincible only way she can lose is scheming/poisoning or assassination

I'm honestly not even sure what point you're trying to make as all over the place you are with your commentary.

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16 hours ago, Lord Lannister said:

I'm honestly not even sure what point you're trying to make as all over the place you are with your commentary.

you said westeros would unite against her cause she has army of dotharki, im pointing out thats not the case, westeros high lord was never high moralists who cared about common people or whateever shit, even Robb or Tywin sent his people to raid and pillage rape , they just dont care whether she leading dotharki or unsullied, be it lords or common people

 

have to be careful to whom she attacks? lol  she is in position to do whatever she wants and she has power to do it (the only barrier is she herself and her morale view or whatever that shit )

Edited by blckp

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For those who will fight her and support her in my eyes.

The way I see it is....

Lannisters - ( Not sure who's the head of the House in the show, whether its Jamie,Cersei, or Kevan so just gonna go with Jamie since he's in control of the army. ) The head of the house betrayed her father, killed him, and has his secret bastard as the sitting King on the Iron Throne. I think its fair to say out of all the houses, they stand the most to lose, and will fight her to the death.

Tyrells - The head of the house daughter is the current Queen of the 7K married to the Lannister bastard King Tommen Waters, so I see them fighting Dany to keep their daughter as Queen. The only way they side with Dany is if Margery or Tommen bites the dust, Olenna won't fight with Dany then.

Martells/Dorne -  Are gone( lol ). But seriously, Its pretty obvious the Sandsnakes are gonna fight on the opposite side of the Lannisters, so nothing need more to be said.

Tullys/Riverlands/Freys - Edmures a hostage and Little FInger technaly the Paramount here, but it looks like the Freys are running things. The Freys are tied up with the Lannister so will more then likely fight her.

Arryn/Baelish - Is in LF pocket, so its really hard to tell, but since we know LF is an ambitious ****er he might fight. But its really hard to tell, so I guess it depends if he survives to hear about here invading.

Stark - Is to concerned with the WWs, and will more then likely hoping she comes north to help lol.

Stromlands - I doubt we get anything more from them, but I'm hoping we get Gendry back in the near future and he unites them somehow, but thats wishful thinking.

Greyjoy - Pretty obvious, nothing more need be said

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Dany can do whatever she wants because because D&D love her and empower her so much that no matter what does (rape, pillage) they will still try to sugarcoat her as a saviour, I have visions of her burning places and then the survivors who's family and friends just got burn, come out and start kneeling to her as the saviour. 

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I'd find it funny and reasonable (though not probable) if Dany were to come to Westeros, see that everything is desolate and realise that Essos is a far nicer place to rule. Why bother ruling seven broken kingdoms when she can go back to Essos, work to abolish slavery and have a Danyist revolution of the proletariat.

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the 62 mormonts, we didn't see them in the battle, they lived

Edited by Future Null Infinity

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Here's what I think could happen.

This next episode while Loras and Margery is standing trial, Wildfire kills everyone in the Septon, leaving Cersei in power of Kings Landing. 

When Cersei learns of Jon and Sansa in Winterfell again, she will start gathering a larger Army.

Dany lands in Westeros somewhere closer to the north, maybe the Iron islands.  Learns of the battle with the WW at some point, teams up with Winterfell.

Cersei learns of Dany and after the battle with the WWs is over she realizes that she's whats standing in Danys way.  After suffering a huge lost of people and possibly some dragons to the WWs, it becomes Dany and the Starks  against everyone else who hasn't pledged to her.  I think Cersei could get a large number of supporters, due to the fact that other families fear Dany because of the way the Mad King ruled.

 

Hugely hypothetical but we will learn a lot more after this coming episode.

Side note, I think the secret Cersei was talking about was either the wildfire, Sansa and Jon Snow, or Tyrion with Dany.  Last weeks episode made it kind of clear though.

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As I said elsehwere I think she will battle with Euron and a clash with Jon seems reasonable given he has more legitmacy however I suspect there will be some sort of true there in order to battle the white walkers.

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It depends on how much more script immunity Danny will be granted.

If "easy" mode is a thing of Essos and not a thing of Danny, then the invasion will bring even enemies in Westeros to make alliances. I can see the power of all southern realms except Dorne rallying to oppose her, especially after she burns her first town.

Ultimately I believe Danny will be brought down by a backstab from a disillusioned ally.

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18 hours ago, Xarkar said:

Remember season 2,E10 house of the undying?


She walks into the throne room to find the Iron throne vacant, covered in snow, with no roof.

 

If Cersei blows up KL, and Winter has arrived... then the vision was right.

 

She will get to KL too late, and the throne wont matter.

Good point, I forgot about the HOTU vision!!!This would confer with GRRM saying the end is bittersweet

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I have to be honest and say I hope the sweet is Dany's death, she's incredibly annoying and if she does end up ruling at the finale I am going to feel hugely disappointed.

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5 hours ago, Sir Matthis Light said:

For those who will fight her and support her in my eyes.

The way I see it is....

...

Stark - Is to concerned with the WWs, and will more then likely hoping she comes north to help lol.

...

Not sure being raped, pillaged and ruled by a bunch of Dothrakis are any better than being killed by WWs. The Stark will take care the WWs themselves then defend North against Dothraki invasion.

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