Snowisnobastard

R+L=J confirmation? Who/how?

124 posts in this topic

4 hours ago, Aryakills said:

Bran for some reason won't finish the vision or won't be able to see everything (I.e.Ned is blocking a full view of Lyanna.)

The full reveal and confirmation gets pushed to season 7.

If Bran comes out of the vision, looks at Meera, and says "you're going home" or "we have to find your father"...I'm ok with waiting another year. 

This isn't the Walking Dead here.

Hey, wait a minute.....

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4 hours ago, robasp2 said:

With the writing quality, here is what I think will happen.

Jon will tak a shovel and start digging a grave.

Clunk, his showrl touches metal.... A box.

He pries it open. Inside, a letter.

"To whoever dug this grave and is reading. By now I Ned Stark will be dead. I hope Jon is not dead. Just tell him he was not my son, but Lyannas and Rhaegars. I had to lie to my wife and children. I am so sorry. Please treat him well.... Here is an impression of my ass to validate this letter. Love Eddard, your dear Ned *ass imprint*"

Stark song playing in background and as usual Jons shocked open mouthed look.

Haha :D

Love it!

I hope Kit can pull it off. It will take some seriously good acting to make it believable.

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14 hours ago, nymeria_2321 said:

I've mentioned this before and never really got a good answer but shouldn't Jamie know about R+L?  I mean he was a kings guard during the time when there was a war started over this whole R+L thing. There doesn't seem to be many kings guards, ~3 to 6 or 7 at a given time. It seems odd that one of them would not have known where 3 others were (including the one of the best fighter-Dayne) during a time of peril for the king/prince. Assuming R+L=J R and L would have had to have been together for awhile or at least had a romance that lasted at least ~ 9 months even if they were not together that whole time, so wouldn't have Jamie at least known that L wasn't actually kidnapped and being raped and such, that she was a willing participant and that she/they were spending time at the TOJ or a lovers hideaway.

Someone else said its because he was too new to the KG and not important enough but he was clearly important enough to be guarding the king while KL was being invaded. I'm not saying Jamie would know for sure about Jon being R&L's baby (or that I think he'd be the one to reveal it) but he's not stupid and must have known some of these things and you'd think could put things together (thus having at least a hunch re Jon). 

There was a full 7 Kingsguard at the time.  But no, Jaime wouldn't have known - while he knighted by Dayne, he wasn't in the clique; when he was put on the Kingsguard it was at the Tourney of Harrenhal where all this with Lyanna started and caused a stir - he was sent immediately home after he got his KG cloak to guard the queen, so he even missed that.  All it seems anyone knew was that Rhaegar "kidnapped" her with the aide of Dayne and Whent some time after the tourney - his closest friends.  Aerys sent Hightower to find them, he never returned -- Rhaegar did though.  Rhaegar came and assumed command of their army, and left with 3 of the 4 other Kingsguard to go to the Trident.  Jaime was ordered to stay back because Aerys both didn't trust him yet and thought of him as a ransom to keep Tywin on his side.

The 3 that went to the Trident with Rhaegar were Barristan Selmy - the only one that lived (and was later pardoned by Robert) - Lewyn Martell and Jon Darry.  Barristan may know, or assume, more as he's a member of the Rhaegar superfan group - but I don't recall him ever leading on to that in his discussions.

Edited by BulletTooth_Tony

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Why not just have Rhaegar be the Night's King? Then we can have a cheesy "I am your father" line.

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We see the rest of the TOJ flashback and there is enough there to strongly imply that Jon is Lyanna's kid.  Jon finds out from LF who is trying to restart his scheme after Sansa and Jon out play him.

Figuring out R+L=J isn't that difficult.  Ned shows up with a baby and his sister's bones and no one had seen him touch a woman who was not Cat.  The only reason why no one figured it out is because they did not think Ned would lie and because they were wrapped up in their own lives and schemes.  Jon apparently manages to throw a monkey wrench into LF's scheme so he has finally come to LF's attention.

Edited by illinifan

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I think they will show it somehow in a finished TOJ flashback with Bran.  I don't think the show has done much at all with the crypts to have any big reveal there.

I posted this in another thread, but even if Bran sees it in his vision, and even if Howland Reed confirms it, what does that mean?  Would anyone (especially Southerners or Dany) believe some random kid who has visions or a Stark loyalist that Jon is really a Targ and possible heir to the Iron Throne ahead of Dany?   So from the show's standpoint not sure how that information would really matter to most people (outside of Jon and knowing who he really is).  He doesn't look like a Targ, he burned his hand saving the Lord Commander, so how do you prove he's a targ, outside of some really well timed letter or object which at this point would seem laughable to come across randomly.  

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13 hours ago, Aryakills said:

If Bran comes out of the vision, looks at Meera, and says "you're going home" or "we have to find your father"...I'm ok with waiting another year. 

I could live with that

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3 hours ago, Rory Snow said:

I could live with that

I couldn't 
I can't take it anymore

Well I'll probably just follow closely and when the episode with the complete revelation comes I'll watch it

Edited by Nami

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7 hours ago, BulletTooth_Tony said:

There was a full 7 Kingsguard at the time.  But no, Jaime wouldn't have known - while he knighted by Dayne, he wasn't in the clique; when he was put on the Kingsguard it was at the Tourney of Harrenhal where all this with Lyanna started and caused a stir - he was sent immediately home after he got his KG cloak to guard the queen, so he even missed that.  All it seems anyone knew was that Rhaegar "kidnapped" her with the aide of Dayne and Whent some time after the tourney - his closest friends.  Aerys sent Hightower to find them, he never returned -- Rhaegar did though.  Rhaegar came and assumed command of their army, and left with 3 of the 4 other Kingsguard to go to the Trident.  Jaime was ordered to stay back because Aerys both didn't trust him yet and thought of him as a ransom to keep Tywin on his side.

The 3 that went to the Trident with Rhaegar were Barristan Selmy - the only one that lived (and was later pardoned by Robert) - Lewyn Martell and Jon Darry.  Barristan may know, or assume, more as he's a member of the Rhaegar superfan group - but I don't recall him ever leading on to that in his discussions.

Ah ok well that makes sense I suppose, though I still say its more likely he knows something than Littlefinger who has no reason (that I can think of) to know anything about it. 

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With the obvious name-dropping of the crypts in the last episode, I think Jon will find something down there that will hint at it... but the actual reveal will be the remainder of the TOJ flashback via Bran.

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23 hours ago, DJE said:

I think it will be Bran who confirms it, Jon probably won't find out about it this season, Bran will tell him when they cross paths again.

I'm thinking this is the way it happens as well.  

We know Bran will finish the flashback.  Only a matter of time before that happens.  

And I've a hard time believing the answer is sitting in the crypts somewhere.  There for anyone to discover whenever they deem fit.  

Bran will tell Jon when they meet again, sometime in season 7. 

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7 hours ago, Lord Lannister said:

Why not just have Rhaegar be the Night's King? Then we can have a cheesy "I am your father" line.

I think there was some interview with Alfie Allen (he knows Jon's parents apparently), and he said Jon's parents will be kind of like Darth Vader+Luke Skywalker-ish. I need to find that.

 

 

(EDIT) I found the link: http://www.vulture.com/2012/06/game-of-thrones-theon-alfie-allen-interview.html

 

Quote

What did you ask him about in return?
You know, I asked him about who Jon Snow's real parents were, and he told me. I can't say who, but I can tell you that it involves a bit of a Luke Skywalker situation.

 

Edited by TheGreenBell

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1 hour ago, HellasLEAF said:

I'm thinking this is the way it happens as well.  

We know Bran will finish the flashback.  Only a matter of time before that happens.  

And I've a hard time believing the answer is sitting in the crypts somewhere.  There for anyone to discover whenever they deem fit.  

Bran will tell Jon when they meet again, sometime in season 7. 

When's the last time you dug up the resting place of your family member?

Who would even look IN a crypt. Pretty much the best place to hide something..... except from the Mance!

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1 hour ago, TheGreenBell said:

I think there was some interview with Alfie Allen (he knows Jon's parents apparently), and he said Jon's parents will be kind of like Darth Vader+Luke Skywalker-ish. I need to find that.

 

 

(EDIT) I found the link: http://www.vulture.com/2012/06/game-of-thrones-theon-alfie-allen-interview.html

 

 

Twins? 

(Excuse me while I do my happy dance)

 

If true then it have to come from Howland Reed.

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3 hours ago, TheGreenBell said:

I think there was some interview with Alfie Allen (he knows Jon's parents apparently), and he said Jon's parents will be kind of like Darth Vader+Luke Skywalker-ish. I need to find that.

 

 

(EDIT) I found the link: http://www.vulture.com/2012/06/game-of-thrones-theon-alfie-allen-interview.html

 

 

You could have posted the whole quote of the interview. There:

Quote

What did you ask him about in return?
You know, I asked him about who Jon Snow's real parents were, and he told me. I can't say who, but I can tell you that it involves a bit of a Luke Skywalker situation. It will all come to fruition eventually. The whole thing with all the fight over proper succession is partly inspired by the War of the Roses in the late 1400s, and back then, to ensure pedigree, the monarchies were kind of inbred. It's definitely fucked up, but it definitely happened back then, so that's why there's incest with the Targaryen line. It's toned down, though.

I wonder what mentioning the Targaryen incest background could have to do with Jon's parentage...

Also, you're putting too much credit on Littlefinger actually knowing about that. My guess would be he just always believed Jon to be a bastard, as it would legitimize his viewing of Ned as unworthy for Cat. But someone else who could very likely know is Varys. I don't remember if the show left that scene where Ned confess something to him when he's imprisoned in King's Landing, before the execution?

In the end, though, I guess we'll have to wait and see. My bet would be that they tease the reveal as a last cliffhanger for this season (Ned entering the ToJ, finding he's sister, a baby cry in the background - BAM - end of episode), but leave the big news for next year.

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On June 21, 2016 at 5:36 PM, Aegonzo The Great said:

3. Howland Reed shows up (this one is more of a stretch).

To kill Littlefinger, right? : - )

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15 hours ago, jrod said:

I think they will show it somehow in a finished TOJ flashback with Bran.  I don't think the show has done much at all with the crypts to have any big reveal there.

I posted this in another thread, but even if Bran sees it in his vision, and even if Howland Reed confirms it, what does that mean?  Would anyone (especially Southerners or Dany) believe some random kid who has visions or a Stark loyalist that Jon is really a Targ and possible heir to the Iron Throne ahead of Dany?   So from the show's standpoint not sure how that information would really matter to most people (outside of Jon and knowing who he really is).  He doesn't look like a Targ, he burned his hand saving the Lord Commander, so how do you prove he's a targ, outside of some really well timed letter or object which at this point would seem laughable to come across randomly.  

It will play some big role in the last seasons or they wouldn't go through the trouble of making it so mysterious.  LF may use it to cause further chaos especially if Cersei goes full on mad queen.  Dany may also demand that the Starks and the North bend a knee and Jon's heritage may come into play with that.  

Spoiler

Apparently there are spoilers out there about a scene between LF and Jon with Ghost.  I suspect that this will be right after the ToJ reveal through Bran's flashbacks.

I also think that something in the crypts is likely given that they reminded us about them in the Battle of the Bastards.

Edited by illinifan

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I agree with many others that it will be a multi-level reveal: part flashback (via Bran), part hard evidence (via Littlefinger or maybe Sam), part prophesy (via Mel), and probably part magic (like Jon being immune to fire).

For the hard evidence, agree that there will be a clue in the crypt.  They are all at Winterfell now and surely they will need some time to respect their fallen family as they have finally reclaimed their home.  A visit to the crypts is a must.

Perhaps the white raven that we see heading towards Winterfell in the episode preview has something to do with it.  

Spoiler

Wouldn't it be amazing if it were Bran finally flying as he was promised? :o

 

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I think we find out with a ToJ flashback.

The real question is whether knowing is going to change the story. I say it doesn't until maybe the very end.

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I think Ned will find Lyanna, she will say promise me Ned and the shot will be of a handsome ,solemn baby with luscious black curls.

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