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Dany's army strength now?


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Also, they smallfolk around the major holds, would be busy digging pits.  I would dig pits on all major approaches to bottle neck any advancing army. If you can bottle neck the approaching hoard, you severely limit their main advantages of speed and maneuverability.  Archers would have a nice population density to fire at, along with the ballistae, catapults and trebuchets.

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22 minutes ago, The Lash said:

Also, they smallfolk around the major holds, would be busy digging pits.  I would dig pits on all major approaches to bottle neck any advancing army. If you can bottle neck the approaching hoard, you severely limit their main advantages of speed and maneuverability.  Archers would have a nice population density to fire at, along with the ballistae, catapults and trebuchets.

You also shoot yourself in the leg as well. The Dothraki will pillage and raid every small town and city while the larger force would always fail to attack reach them since they are mostly compromised of infantry and heavy cavalry.

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26 minutes ago, xjlxking said:

You also shoot yourself in the leg as well. The Dothraki will pillage and raid every small town and city while the larger force would always fail to attack reach them since they are mostly compromised of infantry and heavy cavalry.

I am not denying there would be a lot of maneuvering.  There would be.  But eventually, a good commander, through guile, knowledge of the area and people, will find a time and place that will give him the tactical edge.  And a really good commander will have the advantage but make it appear as if it is an even playing field or the enemy has it.

Yeah, Let the hoard be the hoard and do the rape and pillage thing.  That's gonna get the people on Dany's side.  Dany wont allow it anyway as verified by Yara.

Dany will at least have to ship supplies from Essos in the beginning.  That is fine she has ships.  But long supply lines are problematic.  A lot of stuff can go wrong.  The major cities in Westeros usually have walls, very not good for the Dothraki, Are they going to ride their horses through the gates if the bring them down?  Not really a smart idea.  The first few dozen will be killed and close it off again with the dead horses.

There is no way she can feed her army off of raiding small towns and villages.  

I would also attack the herds of horses at their encampments.  If you can even kill a few hundred horses over x amount of attacks.  That would do a lot to slow the main body down.  Since they all fight on horseback, I am betting once you get them on the ground they are not really effective as a fighting unit.  Open field battle on the ground is way different than running around killing a terrified civilian population of a city.  Not even close to the same.

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23 hours ago, The Lash said:

The Dothraki are fierce.  The Dothraki are numerous.  But the Dothraki are not the best calvary unit by far.  A lot of people mistakenly make the assumption that they are heavy calvary.  They are not.  20K of true heavy calvary and 30k of trained pikeman would wade through them like butter. They don't have any Valyrian steel to speak of, so that huge expanse of people and horses will only serve to swell the ranks of the WW.  

 

Just like the armies of the Mongolian horde I suppose?

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19 hours ago, The Lash said:

Now on to the dragons.  Ballistae.  Some placed with the armies and at all key locations in Westeros.  Every major hold will have as many as possible that does not hamper routine.  They will be placed at the highest possible point on every section of wall. Every craftman in Westeros stops what they are doing and start making these.  The Dragons can be hurt. They bleed.  Regular steel is more than adequate. Then you have truly devious people like Randyll Tarly think tank on it.  I would also booby trap every place in every major hold that could house dragons. Some key people with orders to set off the booby trap at a time when they were there if a hold is taken would be left behind.  Dany is not going to let her dragons roam in Westeros.  They could be killed, and they would simply be unreliable.

I would also poison the feed animals.  With a few different poisons, with the hopes of at least makimg them ill to degrade performance.  The levels in the individual animals would not be lethal to the animals themselves, but i would hope like hell over x amount of feedings it might impact the dragons. (This strategy could be adapted to the Dothraki horse)

Information reguarding the dragons would be handsomely rewarded.  I think it would be extremely difficult to recruit spies within her army.  She does command loyalty without the actual command.  But she cannot slaughter all the small folk of her conquests in Westeros.  She also needs a support staff that will be comprised of Westerosi.  There, some results could be attained.  Plus dragons are pretty noticeable.  If your information lead to the death of a dragon, automatic lord status and huge tracts of land.

True, and in fact at least one Targaryen dragon, Meraxes, was killed in exactly this way during the attempt by Aegon I attempt to conquer Dorne.

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9 hours ago, Donaldys I Trumpagar said:

True, and in fact at least one Targaryen dragon, Meraxes, was killed in exactly this way during the attempt by Aegon I attempt to conquer Dorne.

Meraxes died because the Scorpion hit him in the eye. Any other place on their body won't result in an immediately fatal injury. And I assume you know what happens if you piss off a dragon. If those weapons miss their shots, you can be sure that the dragons will take out the Ballistas and Scorpions. Their next plume of fire will be in that direction. 

Another thing is that Westeros hasn't dealt with dragons for centuries. They're not prepared to handle one in combat. Even when dragons were there, their use in battle usually turned the scales in the favour of their riders. Example: The Field of Fire. During that battle, Aegon and his sisters used all three dragons on the battle field. And they massacred the Reach (and Rock) army.

 

I'm not saying it's not possible to kill a dragon, it is. But it's not exactly easy.  

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9 hours ago, The Lash said:

The Mongol horde was well organized, their basic military structure was based off of multiples of ten.  I have yet to see in the show of any real evidence of structure in the Dothraki.

It feels as though the Dothraki are the exact same (power structure and organization) as the Wildlings but with horses. 

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Who cares how many Dothraki Dany has. When they see magic they piss their pants. The dead will crawl upon them and those who won't flee will soon be turned. Dany is nothing without her dragons. It is known.

About history:

- About 4/10 of Mongol army consisted of supreme heavy lancers. Dothraki horde - does not.

- They also had advanced technology: siege machines and gunpowder. Dothraki have none.

- Mongols used a lot of psychological warfare like "human shields" for example. Like hell I see Dany doing that.

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As long as Dany can control those dragons, not much else matters, in my opinion.

If she's willing to be ruthless, I really don't see anyone having an answer for those dragons in

battle, not even the Night King and his forces.  In fact, right now it's looking like they are going

to get mauled.

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On 6/23/2016 at 1:27 PM, Cron said:

As long as Dany can control those dragons, not much else matters, in my opinion.

If she's willing to be ruthless, I really don't see anyone having an answer for those dragons in

battle, not even the Night King and his forces.  In fact, right now it's looking like they are going

to get mauled.

Why ? Dynerias entire army is usless against the undead and can barely even delay them. All she has is her 3 dragons. The white walkers may have an icedragon and even if they don't they probaly have something to use agaist dragons

 

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Realistically, the Dothraki shouldn't stand a chance against Westeros, but that doesn't matter. This isn't realistic. She sweep Westeros easily and knights will be slain in the thousands, fulfilling the stereotype of 'superior oriental warriors'. Knights in westeros, whether in the books or in the show, aren't as capable as their real life counterparts, just as the Dothraki aren't as capable as the Mongols or Turks, so comparing them is useless.

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On 6/21/2016 at 6:37 AM, tormond said:

Only the army of the dead is match to her.

This is the only army she will ever go up against, and the Dead are going to have to deploy some WMDs , and that will be interesting.

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Spoiler

According the some leaks, Varys will be in Dorne to negotiate an alliance between the Dany, the Sands, and Olenna. If this is true, this means Dany will be virtually unopposed when she lands considering that-

•The North/Vale will be occupied with northern troubles

•Armies don't rout in the show, as such, between the Blackwater an First Winterfell, the entire military force of the Stormlands has been wiped, and most of its nobility probably dead with it

•The Riverlands is full of infighting 

Her only real opposition will be the Lannisters, who aren't a legitimate threat, and Euron, who falls in the same boat. Seems the point of Aegon was to provide her with conflict before she battles the WW. She'll have it easy now.

 

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On 6/23/2016 at 9:05 AM, TwiceBorn said:

 

About history:

- About 4/10 of Mongol army consisted of supreme heavy lancers. Dothraki horde - does not.

- They also had advanced technology: siege machines and gunpowder. Dothraki have none.

- Mongols used a lot of psychological warfare like "human shields" for example. Like hell I see Dany doing that.

Do you have a source or your first point?  I  have seen it stated that 6/10 were light calvary and the remaining were other things (like lancers and heavier cavalry).  But not that the remaining were "supreme heavy lancers".  Also, I believe that Dany has a whole army that can fight together.  So the Dothraki could act as her light infantry.

 

The Mongolians learned their seige tactics from their opponents.  They started with none either.  Again, they are fighting with a conglomerate army, they don't need to do it all.

 

Your third point, she has dragons.  Which is scarier:  unarmed human shields, or fire breathing flying monsters?

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  • 1 month later...

Do not forget the losses that her military will take in the voyage. Sea travel even today is treacherous. What are the odds that every ship she has will arrive at the rendezvous points? How many will die due to disease and infections? Or the fights that will inevitably break out between shipmates? How many ships will sink due to storms? All of this can add up to catastrophic losses. I would say that she will lose approximately 25 percent of her fighting force before she reaches Westeros, and that is being generous.

I do predict early success for Dany, but those should turn to losses as she gets out of Dorne and the Reach. The dothraki everyone is so keen on believing are the greatest threat to Westeros are no real threat. Take Randyll Tarly, a great military leader and tactician. He would use the land. Then again it also comes down to how moronic the writers want to make the Westerosi look in order to show that Dany is a great military leader.

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  • 2 months later...

The "military might" of the Dothraki has been discussed to death on the book forum. The Mongolians are a terrible comparison because of several things: 

 

1) They had an incredibly well organized army with a series of ranks as well as incredible discipline. They were able to perform maneuvers that would leave their opponents dumbfounded, and execute incredible plans because of this. The mongols also had an extremely strict line of succession on the battlefield that allowed them to rapidly reassert control in the unfortunate case of a commander's death. 

2) They had heavy armor and weapons, creating a modern army that often outclassed its enemies on the field. 

3) Their forces, while depicted as "hordes of cavalry", were actually a combined arms approach consisting of infantry, contingents of ranged weapons, siege weapons, light cavalry, and heavy cavalry. 

4) The Mongolians were perfectly happy and capable of amazing diplomatic acumen. They also often used subjugated peoples in their military to complement their fighting styles. These soldiers were often re-equipped with superior weapons, while any weaponry they possessed that was deemed superior to its Mongolian equivalent was rapidly replicated and incorporated into the Mongolian military. 

 

If Daenerys's Dothraki hordes are able to do anything in Westeros, it will NOT be because they are a serious military threat. It will be because The Plot Demands It!

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