LulaMae Barnes

[Spoilers] Criticize Without Repercussion - one last time ;o)

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While this episode was more enjoyable than the rest of the season it still leaves a lot to be desired.  It seems that they have dropped the complexity out of every character and what we're left with are the hollow shells complete with one or two personality traits. For example...

Cercei: how many times did they beat over the head with the whole "Cercei is a psychopath who's only redeeming quality is her dedication to her children?" This season she has lost her only two remaining children and shrugged it off with an amount of indifference most people reserve for their pet goldfish.  The way everything plays out in the show we get the impression that she "burned the city to the ground" for herself not for her son.  The high sparrow is always in the great sept with the bulk of the faith militant, she could've blown that thing up at any time without killing her daughter in law, who the show actually has established is adored by her son, and still eliminated that threat.  Her actions put her desire for revenge above her love for her last remaining child which is a complete 180 from what we are constantly being told.  I know people will say that she knew he was doomed because of the prophecy but if that is the case it would be more believable for her to follow Tommen out that window than smugly take her seat on the iron throne.  But having an antagonist with any traits other than pure evil doesn't seem to be in the cards for this show any more.  I miss Tywin.

Jon: seems pretty unpredictable when this guy does or does not remember the whole zombie army problem.  No mention of it when talking with Glover a few episodes back, even after that was the only thing that got them the Mormonts, but now he uses it to his advantage.  Also I hope they don't plan on letting him command troops in the war to come, he's proven himself wildly inept in that regard.  We get more unnecessary dragons flying over the ships shots but we can't get a glimpse of Ghost? So annoying.

Arya: liked the scene but why not have her wear Black Walders face when she kills Lord Walder.  Much more believable that those two would ever be alone together and we wouldn't have to wonder where that other face came from.  Did she steal it?  Did she kill someone to get it?  Would've been cool to see Walder think he had just been murdered by his son and then have her take the face off.  Minor gripe.

Varys:  WTF?! In Dorne one second and then on Dany's ship the next.  The expedited travel in this show has been getting bad but this just seemed like a middle finger from the producers.  "Oh you think we care about time lines? Watch this shit."

Sansa: probably the most complex character on the show now as she seems to have multiple personality disorder.  Me, Myself, and Sandra.

Dany: does she really need to be so cold about dumping Daario?  Why can't she be a strong determined person and also have emotions?  Part of what makes her book character better is that while she is a force to be reckoned with she also experiences the same emotions as the rest of us... self doubt, loneliness, desire.  Now we just get Robo-Khaleesi and her unstoppable horde. 

Zombie Mountain: no complaints, stay golden pony boy.  At this point I hope the white walkers take over the seven kingdoms and he becomes Lord Commander of the Night Kingsguard. 

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12 minutes ago, rayarts said:

Maybe I am most frustrated about so many people JUST ENJOYING THIS CRAP and giving those who see the mistakes a hard time. Good for you, if you do not need logical writing and stuff actually happening onscreen (I drop my favourite Game Offscreen Thrones once again), but pleeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaase leave us, who actually look for some logic in all this mess, be. 

And guys, have you seen the reaction videos on youtube? E.g. at Burlington Bar? I was sickened  people cheering when hundreds go up in the explosion (most innocent), because what? Didn't Carol bring the Faith Militant onto herself??? And they ffs cheered, when Tommen jumped? WHUT??? Because a naive, poor boy jumping from a window after his whole world is destroyed is so freaking entertaining??? Or because you hate the Lannisters? Wait, didn't you just cheer FOR Cersei? And then when the Septa was tortured, they cheered again!! WTF?! This was a sickening scene (costing us precious screnetime, no less) - again, remember, how Cersei brought that upon herself??? And now what??? In the reactions of folks I can actually see, how humans can be so stupid as to follow ridiculous and evil leaders in real life... THEY TOTALLY LOST THEIR MARBLES. 

I haven't seen these reaction vids. That's crazy.

It's not a story any more, it's an entertainment product. Nothing really matters. Everything has lost its sense of moral complexity.

They should have pushed the complexity of the Sparrow movement better, the fact that they rose out of the ashes of the Wot5K and the disillusionment of the smallfolk. Sure, have them have a dark side (as they do in the books when the torturing becomes known) but also establish their reasons better.

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23 minutes ago, Bear42 said:

While this episode was more enjoyable than the rest of the season it still leaves a lot to be desired.  It seems that they have dropped the complexity out of every character and what we're left with are the hollow shells complete with one or two personality traits. For example...

Cercei: how many times did they beat over the head with the whole "Cercei is a psychopath who's only redeeming quality is her dedication to her children?" This season she has lost her only two remaining children and shrugged it off with an amount of indifference most people reserve for their pet goldfish.  The way everything plays out in the show we get the impression that she "burned the city to the ground" for herself not for her son.  The high sparrow is always in the great sept with the bulk of the faith militant, she could've blown that thing up at any time without killing her daughter in law, who the show actually has established is adored by her son, and still eliminated that threat.  Her actions put her desire for revenge above her love for her last remaining child which is a complete 180 from what we are constantly being told.  I know people will say that she knew he was doomed because of the prophecy but if that is the case it would be more believable for her to follow Tommen out that window than smugly take her seat on the iron throne.  But having an antagonist with any traits other than pure evil doesn't seem to be in the cards for this show any more.  I miss Tywin.

I know this is not a debate thread, but in defense of the show I think it makes sense Cersei's love for her children does not extend to their partners, especially in a wife versus mother type of relationship where the wife is openly manipulating the mother's son. Cersei has every reason to dislike Margaery. To sympathise, imagine having your 13 year old son being married to a 28 year old woman who controls him. If you're male, multiply this feeling with x1,5 or x2 most likely.

 

Quote

Varys:  WTF?! In Dorne one second and then on Dany's ship the next.  The expedited travel in this show has been getting bad but this just seemed like a middle finger from the producers.  "Oh you think we care about time lines? Watch this shit."

What's especially funny about this is, Varys has gone all the way to Westeros, to back in Essos in order to... get back on Westeros. He could have just chilled in the Water Gardens with Cyvasse instead (or doing something worthwhile). In a time where every voyage is some kind of a risk, this makes no sense. Varys is not even needed during the journey. He could have waited for Dany to arrive.

Edited by Primalsplit

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18 minutes ago, Bear42 said:

Sansa: probably the most complex character on the show now as she seems to have multiple personality disorder.  Me, Myself, and Sandra.

Haha that's good!  :lol:

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All I can say after this season is: Gods help you, Thrones, now you are truly lost.

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On 6/27/2016 at 6:01 AM, LulaMae Barnes said:

- In S05E07 Littlefinger promised to help Olenna, told her he has knowledge Cersei is completely unaware of and said he would give Olenna a gift... "...the same kind I gave Cersei: a handsome young man..:"

This subject was never addressed again - we still don't know how Baelish helped/or wanted to help Olenna and who or what that handsome young man is. I thought  "Olyvar" - so he could take back his testimony against Loras (by the way - where was Olyvar ever since then?) or maybe Lancel (as he shagged the queen and helped her getting rid of Robert). Others suggested Rickon,Gendry or even Jon Snow - none of which would have made any sense too me....but that doesn't matter anymore anyway.

 

Don't know if anyone else answered you, but I thought he meant Lancel. Someone to confess Cersei's crimes to the High Sparrow so she'd get locked up. But I guess that doesn't really make much sense either. Really, why do we expect anything to anymore.

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1 hour ago, Primalsplit said:

What's especially funny about this is, Varys has gone all the way to Westeros, to back in Essos in order to... get back on Westeros. He could have just chilled in the Water Gardens with Cyvasse instead (or doing something worthwhile). In a time where every voyage is some kind of a risk, this makes no sense. Varys is not even needed during the journey. He could have waited for Dany to arrive.

As bad as Dany has been about dragging her feet when it comes to the trip to Westeros, he probably thought he better go back and make sure she actually comes this time. Of course he might have also wanted to get back so he could inform Dany of what a pack of treacherous bitches she was about to become allied with, so she could wear some extra armor on her back.

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1 hour ago, Primalsplit said:

I know this is not a debate thread, but in defense of the show I think it makes sense Cersei's love for her children does not extend to their partners, especially in a wife versus mother type of relationship where the wife is openly manipulating the mother's son. Cersei has every reason to dislike Margaery. To sympathise, imagine having your 13 year old son being married to a 28 year old woman who controls him. If you're male, multiply this feeling with x1,5 or x2 most likely.

 

What's especially funny about this is, Varys has gone all the way to Westeros, to back in Essos in order to... get back on Westeros. He could have just chilled in the Water Gardens with Cyvasse instead (or doing something worthwhile). In a time where every voyage is some kind of a risk, this makes no sense. Varys is not even needed during the journey. He could have waited for Dany to arrive.

It's Jon and the wildlings North of the wall all over again. They needed a dramatic shot with all of Team Dany in a boat posing for the camera. So Varys has to be there though it's so stupid. I laughed at that scene especially Yara who looked like she was directly smiling at the audience. 

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The saddest thing is.  

They killed Doran too take over and war with the Lannisters.

Yet spent what.. a year doing Jack shit and then stole Doran plot anyway?

Like come the fuck on.

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Also when you have to recap your first episode to remind people for a scene in your last episode you're doing something wrong.

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39 minutes ago, Lord Syv Aldlark said:

Also when you have to recap your first episode to remind people for a scene in your last episode you're doing something wrong.

most people are like in a coma while watching this thing and only react when something badass,shocking or dragons show up
I'm still not sure if it's the writers fault or really just the people watching it

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On 6/26/2016 at 11:07 PM, aliasocfan said:

This.Show. I swear. How can I even start? 

For the 2nd time, Lena Headey actually played book!Cersei. She does a good job, but it comes out of nowhere. She's never been that murderous on the show. Is she going to do Dorne next? She did promise to burn their city to the ground. 

Do you guys think Qyburn paid those creepy murderous children with candy? 

During Loras' confession when he talked about now getting married or having children, I thought they would use this line  "When the sun has set, no candle can replace it" Silly me, it almost makes sense in that context. 

Now that Loras and Marg are dead, I wonder if Finn Jones and Natalie Dormer will have any interesting interviews. Both have been critical of the show. 

Walder Frey acting like The Lannisters send their regards is some kind of well known phrase? Like what? Roose only said that because Jamie asked him to. Freaking stupid. Silly Arya, she never learned to say M'Lord. tsk tsk. WHY THE HELL DID THEY JUST THROW IN FREY PIES?! THAT DOES NOT MAKE BOOK FANS HAPPY. ok I'm good. 

The citadel doesn't know about the Old Bear, but Olenna knows about Mace, Marg and Loras. ok. What's a timeline? 

The most shocking thing about this season is Obara got asked her name and didn't go through the whole spiel. 

VARYS GOT THE FIRE AND BLOOD LINE ARE YOU KIDDING ME?!!!!? 

Why didn't Jon and Sansa talk about Rickon? Their sibling was just murdered? Do neither of them care? 

I can't even get into how screwed Sansa was. She's next in line. That's absolutely no reason her bastard ~brother would become King of the North. The show just affirmed all of Cat's fears of him. 

the first thing i thought of was showVarys is a Targ. since there is speculation he is a Blackfire, and the show hasn't mentioned them, i thought if this.

 

ShowVarys is Rhaegar!!!! or something else shitty, to make him one of the 3 heads.

 

god i have never wanted to be more wrong.

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On 6/26/2016 at 11:14 PM, Lord Syv Aldlark said:

Soooo Dany in ten minutes said that she was leaving Daario to let Mereen decide their new leaders(( as in vote))

 

To going to take over and continue that monarchy in Westeros?

 

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHAHHAAHAHAHAHAH

i thought she should have left a couple of  the Dosh Kaleen to rule in each of the cities in Dragon's Bay, with a few of the huge horde to help keep the peace. they went on about how they are respected and not much else, and you know...............girls on top!

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On 6/28/2016 at 8:17 PM, ShadowLiberal said:

The only 2 people left on her list (Cersei and Ser Gregor) are people who Arya will NEVER be able to kill herself even with a ton of plot hole miracles like at the Twins. Cersei is WAY too heavily protected for Arya to ever kill, and it would be a horrible ending for Cersei to die by her hands. And little girl Arya is NEVER killing Ser Gregor, period.

Don't underestimate D&D's ability to introduce plot elements that make absolutely no logical or practical sense. I guarantee they'll have Arya killing Cersei before the end. And probably several other characters that aren't even on her list. How exactly will that go down? Probably something like this...

Arya will use her Cloak of Invisibility that she looted off a guard in the Twins and a +5 Dagger of Bitchy Queen Killing that she obtained in the stables of the Red Keep from a level 2 rat. But before she kills Cersei, she'll make sure Cersei knows that it was actually her that killed Tommen, Myrcella, and Joffrey. Cue flashback sequences (from Bran's perspective) that show how Arya time traveled, teleported around, changed her face in each instance, and made it back to where she was before she left. EASY!

Edited by Caerl Targaryen

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Found this video about the movie Troy, which, as I expect a lot of people here know, was written by David Benioff. Fun to watch since I haven't read the Iliad nor watched the movie in forever.

It's the part at 27:42 that made me smirk: "Character arcs and motivations are just being thrown out of the window to quickly wrap up the movie". Sounds familiar, doesn't it?

I was actually amazed at how much of what he said in the review could be applied to the newer seasons of GoT. It's almost scary.

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On 6/27/2016 at 3:54 AM, I am a Dragon said:

I think Stannis is going to die but at a much later point in a very different way. He won't be involved in Shireen's burning (I reckon Mel is going to do it to bring Jon back)

I doubt Aegon is meaningless. There's going to be a major conflict between him and Dany at the very least.

in the books, could the be a Dance II, and it's Dany and Aegon who burn KL like the throne room we saw in tHoB&W?

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5 hours ago, sarah.jenice said:

All I can say after this season is: Gods help you, Thrones, now you are truly lost.

Unfortunately, I think it's truly "Lost," and will end as disappointingly as that series, that started with such promise and ended with such incoherence. A real shame. To quote Benioff:  "I think you’ve gotta start wondering: What the hell is this plot?"  

 

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Just now, TepidHands said:

Unfortunately, I think it's truly "Lost," and will end as disappointingly as that series, that started with such promise and ended with such incoherence. A real shame. To quote Benioff:  "I think you’ve gotta start wondering: What the hell is this plot?"  

 

I don't know. Lost was a complete mess by the end but I think it made more sense than what GoT is doing these days. The characters were certainly more consistently written at least (until the last few seasons). That said, the plot never made much sense except maybe in seasons 1 and 4 (emphasis on maybe). By season 5 it was clear that the showrunners really had no idea what they were doing and then everything just blew up in season 6. If GoT is doing that at this stage, I can't even imagine how incoherent and terrible it'll be two seasons from now...

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2 hours ago, ser naes yennet said:

the first thing i thought of was showVarys is a Targ. since there is speculation he is a Blackfire, and the show hasn't mentioned them, i thought if this.

 

ShowVarys is Rhaegar!!!! or something else shitty, to make him one of the 3 heads.

 

god i have never wanted to be more wrong.

So Varys could be Rhaegar?Mmmmh, don't let D&D read that - they might use this in their little show. Anyway, I'd like this! Because it would also mean V+L=J ;o)

Jon totally looks like him,right  !?!?!:rofl:

I now want a tearful father-son-reunion...and Varys saying: "Rhaegar junior - I am your father!"

Edited by LulaMae Barnes

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20 hours ago, HellasLEAF said:

Are you saying the people and the lords that are closest to the wall (northerner's) had not heard rumors or stories of a growing threat that lies north of the wall?   

I find that impossible to believe.  When Jon warns them the war is not over and there is a threat that will not wait and brings the storm.  To what are they all muttering in agreement too??  You can clearly see this is a pivotal moment.  

 

 

There is zero evidence given in the show that anyone other than the Night's Watch had heard any rumors about anything. If we had seen evidence of such rumors I might be inclined to agree with you. But when we have consistently seen how stubborn characters in this show are, than we are just expected to believe that everyone suddenly believes in bogeyman and magic (for instance what do common folk know about Jon's resurrection. If we knew that the Lords of the north (or even SANSA) knew that this had happened i'd be more inclined to agree with you). As it is the show provides zero evidence that anyone other than Night's Watch and wildlings know anything about anything that has been happening north of the wall.

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