Jdawg Laurence Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 5 hours ago, Red Tiger said: Why even make this thread? It feels like you dont even believe the stuff you wrote. They didnt outright say the name because they probably thought "hey, our audience cant possibly be so stupid as to not realize what's going on". Because just because you don't believe something to be true, does not mean you cannot consider it. Good job to OP on bringing up some valid points to think about here. Better to prove something true with evidence than to just believe due to hype! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarkofWinterfell Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 7 minutes ago, Future Null Infinity said: I'm a jon's fan but I have a scientific mind, your argument was very logical, I'm just a show viewer and based on show, they didn't say explicitly who the father, many hints and multiple possible father, it was just ?+L=J, next year we will find the ? It was very clear from the way the shots were done that the baby was Jon. (How they zoomed in on the baby's eyes and then cut to a shot of Jon and then slowly zoomed out.) But there is enough evidence present for there to be speculation until next season about Jon's true parentage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Stuart Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 Of course it is Jon as the infant who is the child of Rhaegar and Lyanna. Lyanna crapping herself that robert would kill the kid reveals the kid is targaryen and probably a legitimate heir and the child is clearly Lyanna's. I always thought the colour of ghost was a giveaway too, the rest of the wolves are black or brown indicating stark or tully parentage but Jon has the white wolf which is pretty close to the blonde/white hair of the targs. If jon does end up riding a dragon I wouldn't be surprised if it is viserion for much the same reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolverine Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 5 hours ago, Banner Without Brothers said: The baby is not bald click the youtube link I posted. Although the kid is so blonde I could see how you could make that mistake. Thanks for addressing the hair issue. It's the main point of contention. Not Confirmed That hair is mostly brown. The light on the tips makes a little blonde. My sons were born with dark hair and right now it is almost totally blonde. All 4 of my brothers had blonde hair when they were young and now it is dark for 3 of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Lyanna Mormont Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 3 hours ago, Chib said: I am here just to laugh at people denying Jon's heritage. Lmao You and me both! Lol! 2 hours ago, ummester said: I was so hoping Lyanna's baby had bright blue eyes and horns - unfortunately it was just Jon. Still, I'm not giving up on the true saviour of Westeros, the Night King. Lol! 2 hours ago, Future Null Infinity said: they wanted to create a cliffhanger by not revealing everything about Jon this season Yes. I think that for book readers Jon's parentage is pretty obvious. But for only show fans, there's a small cliffhanger of who the dad is. Everytime the camera showed Bran he was reading Lyanna's lips so I'm guessing this info will come from him on the show. 8 minutes ago, Jayc said: Good luck spending the next year trying to justify that the baby wasnt Jon. Or his dad was Hodor or Benjen or the Night King R+L=J has been known since book 1. The bigger question is it going to matter? Or will Jon find out? The TV show just announced GRRM's biggest book secret. We got a chance to see Lyanna. I still would love to see the Tourney of Harrenhall. Yeah, I unfortunately see that happening... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayc Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 12 minutes ago, the Greenleif Stark said: And how is that line a clue Arthur is Jon's pappy? Its not. I don't think anyone other then Rheager is Jon's father. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the Greenleif Stark Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 2 minutes ago, Jayc said: Its not. I don't think anyone other then Rheager is Jon's father. Sorry, thought you were saying something else, i see now what you were saying, glad we're on the same page Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SheepStealer Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 It was confirmed! Lyanna whispered to Ned that "Robert would kill him if he found out. Please protect him. Promise me ,Ned!" 100℅ R+L=J is confirmed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the Greenleif Stark Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 16 minutes ago, Lord Lyman said: Yes there are. Jon called the Greatest Swordsman in the realm, Dawn being laid at the foot of the bed. It's extremely farfetched, but given the theories made up one-liners throughout the series, I should be allowed to come up with an alternate theory based on the thinnest of evidence. "Extremely farfetched" does not make those things clues. And also the quote was "the way the people in the North talk about you you're the greatest swordsman who ever walked" and what was Ned supposed to do with the sword? He carried it all the way up the tower after killing Arthur with it, just throw it down on the floor? These are not clues or even hints Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hangover of the Morning Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 6 hours ago, Red Tiger said: Why even make this thread? It feels like you dont even believe the stuff you wrote. They didnt outright say the name because they probably thought "hey, our audience cant possibly be so stupid as to not realize what's going on". This. They couldn't have made it any plainer if they said the baby's name was Jon as it could still be interpreted as "a Jon" and not necessarily "Jon Snow". They literally showed us who the baby was as an adult. There's really no leeway. As of the identity of the father, they gave plenty of clues for the regular show watcher to correctly guess that it was Rhaegar. Besides it's not as if they won't revisit again later on and make it abundantly clear for the super casual viewers that didn't get it. The shocking revelation that Jon is not Ned's son is sufficient for now. Rhaegar's, however, really the only option for Jon's father. He's the one who kidnapped Lyanna as repeated by Robert, Bran and Sansa and Lyanna remained in Rhaegar's custody until her death as evident from Arthur's words. Any other alternative would be a "pulling the rug under our feet" moment that came completely out of the blue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Black Adder of Dorne Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 OP is an idiot who wants everything literally spelled out for them. You could see R+L=J from space by watching the episode. Was the transition from the baby to Jon and the discussion of Robert wanting to kill the child if he found out not enough? Usually I am critical of the show for failing to be subtle or nuanced and just shoving the conclusion in our faces, and the few times like this that they don't go ahead and do that, those that are thick as bricks come out of the woodwork to complain. The same thing happened with Dany burning down the Dothraki hall earlier in the season; back then, too, there were loud complaints from those who were not blessed with an imagination and need everything spelled out for them in the finest detail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Lyman Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 16 minutes ago, the Greenleif Stark said: "Extremely farfetched" does not make those things clues. And also the quote was "the way the people in the North talk about you you're the greatest swordsman who ever walked" and what was Ned supposed to do with the sword? He carried it all the way up the tower after killing Arthur with it, just throw it down on the floor? These are not clues or even hints I did say it was the evidence was extremely thin. (ie. just except the theory as crackpot. I should be allowed one on this site.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elroy Mankins Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 44 minutes ago, Lord Lyman said: Yes there are. Jon called the Greatest Swordsman in the realm, Dawn being laid at the foot of the bed. It's extremely farfetched, but given the theories made up one-liners throughout the series, I should be allowed to come up with an alternate theory based on the thinnest of evidence. Was it Dawn though? It looked like Ice to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damon_Tor Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 6 hours ago, ShadowKitteh said: The baby was BALD Varys is the father: CONFIRMED. Not a eunich: CONFIRMED. Merman: CONFIRMED. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prince Jon Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 I watched last night's episode with someone who has not read the books and does not go to message boards like this one. Yet, she loves GOT and has watched from the beginning. From just a show watcher's perspective, she did not get the full significance of ToJ revelation at all. Let's face it, GoT is confusing and hits you with a lot of information. It is hard to keep track of everything if you are not obsessed with it-- much less a character (R) who has never even been shown. We have to remember that D/D have to tell the story to them too. Any ambiguity in R+L=J that the OP spots is probably due to D/D having to tell their version of the story to the casual viewer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tianzi Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 I say it's as confirmed as it gets. Lyanna whispered to Ned's ear out of Bran's earshot, then she dies and Ned obviously won't talk about it to anyone else for Bran to hear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 1 hour ago, Jedi Renee said: Hmm seemed pretty obvious but could be a fake out They did the same with Varys and Dany. 1 hour ago, Eric Baratheon said: Dragons seem to NOT want to attack him and? The Targs are not dragonproof. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Stuart Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 Nevermind the hair, the baby's eyes are brown which generally indicates brown or at least dark hair and looks to be the same eye colour as Jon's eyes in the next scene. For all we know the blood of of the first men may be more dominant than the blonde/white features of the Valaryians. I would have to check my World of Ice and Fire targaryen bloodlines but has a Targaryen ever married with someone from blood of the first men before so we can use it as a point of reference on hair and eye colour? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roboginger Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 There was a reason we only partially heard the conversation I think it will be 100% confirmed at some point, can't have a claim to the throne unless you know who both parents are.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illinifan Posted June 27, 2016 Share Posted June 27, 2016 6 hours ago, Baelor_the_Blessed said: So, does that TOJ scene pretty much dispel the speculation that Meera is Jon Snow's twin sister? Yes. Thank God. 6 hours ago, Red Tiger said: Why even make this thread? It feels like you dont even believe the stuff you wrote. They didnt outright say the name because they probably thought "hey, our audience cant possibly be so stupid as to not realize what's going on". The baby's face transitioned to Jon. The only other thing they could have done to make it obvious is put it is blinding lights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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