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Round of 16 (Day 3) Spain/Italy, England/Iceland


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By the way, England fans, don't worry because your search for a new manager is over: your hero is riding to the rescue.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/36647597

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I went to see the Football Association four or five years ago and said I want the England job. They looked at me and said: 'No, you haven't got the experience'.
"I said you have hired experienced managers, spent a fortune on them and I could not have done any worse.
"I would speak to the FA now, definitely. I'd offer my experience, tournament experience.

Alan Shearer, folks: managerial record, played 8, won 1, drew 2, lost 5. But, y'know, he has tournament experience!

(To be fair, he's since said that he prefers the Southgate-Hoddle 'dream team'.)

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Kane, Sterling, Alli were poor all tournament but Roy did not have the balls to drop them. At the very least, Kane and Sterling should have been dropped. Lallana, for all the criticism he gets, performed much better than either of them yet found himself on the bench. And, of course, an out of form and not fully match fit Jack Wilshere was brought on which just puts an exclamation point on the managers incompetance. Hodgson resigning shortly after the game was the best decision he made all tournament.

Should England be looking at a foreign appointment? Off the top of my head, I can't think of an English manager with the track record and tactical nous to take this team forward.

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I was thinking about managers who are on the market at the moment and I couldn't think of any that could get the England job.

It's pretty unlikely there aren't any so it was probably a brainfart on my part.

Still, do you guys see anyone as a likely replacement for Hodgson?

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Kane yesterday was the only person England had on the pitch who was doing anything, but only because he had a couple of marginal long range misses and struck a good on target volley. Everyone else was just pathetic. I wasn't even banking on Sterling to actually score from close range when he was brought down for the penalty. Rooney was practically non-existent as per usual, and again demonstrated his total mediocrity in international tournaments at corner kicks. No one else was any better. I'm Scottish, and I'm not gloating when I say it's better England got this showing up now by a competent and industrious, if not exceptional, Iceland team who fully deserve to go far in this tournament than the absolute drubbing that was on the cards if England were facing the present France squad. Hodgson has simply never found an adaptable system for facilitating a bunch of well overpaid players who are not gelling together as a coherent team.

Also, congratulations to Italy on an excellent win over the Spanish. It was an electrifying match.

 

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Kane? He was one of England's worst performers throughout the tournament (which is saying a whole lot), and should have been dropped in favour of Sturridge after the first game. Judging by his too-brief appearance last night, you could argue that Rashford should have got more game time as well.

The system did no one any favours, but the one player I saw who tried to do something was Sturridge. He sent the through ball to Sterling for the penalty, and created one or two other (half-)chances. He also assisted Vardy's goal against Wales and scored the match winner. Hodgson is a clueless prick for not playing him centrally.

Rooney is not a midfielder (although he did a rather admirable job, considering), and Henderson and Clyne were benched after arguably creating more chances between the two of them than the rest of the team did. I can understand picking Walker after his strong showing against Russia, but bringing a half-fit Wilshere on instead of Hendo or Lallana (or DRINKWATER!!) reeked of personal favouritism.

In addition to being tactically naive, Hodgson also seems unable to adapt or change the gameplan (other than just making more or less random subs), and also seems to be completely unwilling or unable to see his own shortcomings and try to address them.

Good riddance (and long overdue) for England. I do think they need to overhaul their whole philosophy, from how they nurture talent, how they train players technically and tactically, and how they train players mentally, to deal with media, fans, pressure, expectations etc. They might want to look at the positively toxic sports media in the UK as well. They're so quick to canonise and glorify players at the slightest hint of greatness, and even quicker to demonise and tear them down when they don't win whatever tournament they're playing in. The way they've treated Beckham and Rooney (to name two) throughout the years has been incredibly detrimental to those players' ability and mindset to help England in big games, in my opinion. 

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5 hours ago, Les Diables Rouges said:

Kane, Sterling, Alli were poor all tournament but Roy did not have the balls to drop them. At the very least, Kane and Sterling should have been dropped. Lallana, for all the criticism he gets, performed much better than either of them yet found himself on the bench. And, of course, an out of form and not fully match fit Jack Wilshere was brought on which just puts an exclamation point on the managers incompetance. Hodgson resigning shortly after the game was the best decision he made all tournament.

Should England be looking at a foreign appointment? Off the top of my head, I can't think of an English manager with the track record and tactical nous to take this team forward.

Admittedly, good club managers do not necessarily make good NT managers, or vice versa. The skill sets are quite different, ultimately. Jürgen Klinsmann is a decent NT manager, but he utterly failed as a club manager every time he tried. Joachim Löw's club management record isn't great, either - he won the Bundesliga with Stuttgart once but could never get a team to play consistently for more than a season. So, given that club management doesn't really count as job experience for a NT coach, why not give Shearer a try? It's not like his highly decorated predecessors have been all that successful.

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1 hour ago, theguyfromtheVale said:

Admittedly, good club managers do not necessarily make good NT managers, or vice versa. The skill sets are quite different, ultimately. Jürgen Klinsmann is a decent NT manager, but he utterly failed as a club manager every time he tried. Joachim Löw's club management record isn't great, either - he won the Bundesliga with Stuttgart once but could never get a team to play consistently for more than a season. So, given that club management doesn't really count as job experience for a NT coach, why not give Shearer a try? It's not like his highly decorated predecessors have been all that successful.

Klinsmann had exactly one job at club level, and he wasn't given the kind of money to spend on players either his predecessor or successor got.

Löw won the cup, not the league, while at Stuttgart and finished fourth while reaching the final of the Cup Winners Cup the next season. Pretty good all things considered, but he was replaced by Winfried Schäfer nevertheless, a bigger name with more experience at the time.

 

I'm not saying either of them are up there with the greatest, but both had shown certain qualities before. Löw actually spent some time teaching coaching classes for the DFB and Klinsmann clearly was pretty good at PR.

 

I have no idea what Shearer brings to the table, it doesn't look like coaching experience, which Löw had quite a bit of, even if it wasn't at the highest level, and people generally also don't seem to see him as a guy who can find the right people to delegate key tasks to while he provides cover against the tabloids etc.

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2 hours ago, Mmerek Hamšzulíe said:

Kane? He was one of England's worst performers throughout the tournament (which is saying a whole lot), and should have been dropped in favour of Sturridge after the first game. Judging by his too-brief appearance last night, you could argue that Rashford should have got more game time as well.

The system did no one any favours, but the one player I saw who tried to do something was Sturridge. He sent the through ball to Sterling for the penalty, and created one or two other (half-)chances. He also assisted Vardy's goal against Wales and scored the match winner. Hodgson is a clueless prick for not playing him centrally.

Rooney is not a midfielder (although he did a rather admirable job, considering), and Henderson and Clyne were benched after arguably creating more chances between the two of them than the rest of the team did. I can understand picking Walker after his strong showing against Russia, but bringing a half-fit Wilshere on instead of Hendo or Lallana (or DRINKWATER!!) reeked of personal favouritism.

In addition to being tactically naive, Hodgson also seems unable to adapt or change the gameplan (other than just making more or less random subs), and also seems to be completely unwilling or unable to see his own shortcomings and try to address them.

Good riddance (and long overdue) for England. I do think they need to overhaul their whole philosophy, from how they nurture talent, how they train players technically and tactically, and how they train players mentally, to deal with media, fans, pressure, expectations etc. They might want to look at the positively toxic sports media in the UK as well. They're so quick to canonise and glorify players at the slightest hint of greatness, and even quicker to demonise and tear them down when they don't win whatever tournament they're playing in. The way they've treated Beckham and Rooney (to name two) throughout the years has been incredibly detrimental to those players' ability and mindset to help England in big games, in my opinion. 

I think after Euro 2004 where Germany had an extremly poor showing they decided to invest a lot in youth training and we can see the results now. They have completly changed the way they play and the clubs are a lot more likely to put trust into unproven players( Kimmich from Bayern and Weigl from Dortmund were completly unknown a year ago and now they are in the Euro squad. Both are very important players for their clubs)

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1 hour ago, theguyfromtheVale said:

Admittedly, good club managers do not necessarily make good NT managers, or vice versa. The skill sets are quite different, ultimately. Jürgen Klinsmann is a decent NT manager, but he utterly failed as a club manager every time he tried. Joachim Löw's club management record isn't great, either - he won the Bundesliga with Stuttgart once but could never get a team to play consistently for more than a season. So, given that club management doesn't really count as job experience for a NT coach, why not give Shearer a try? It's not like his highly decorated predecessors have been all that successful.

What? Löw won the Bundesliga?!? He won the German Cup once with Stuttgart in 97. But that's about it.

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34 minutes ago, Bjornbert said:

I think after Euro 2004 where Germany had an extremly poor showing they decided to invest a lot in youth training and we can see the results now. They have completly changed the way they play and the clubs are a lot more likely to put trust into unproven players( Kimmich from Bayern and Weigl from Dortmund were completly unknown a year ago and now they are in the Euro squad. Both are very important players for their clubs)

The truely poor showing had been at the Euro 2000, followed by a terrible display in Japan / Korea with a lot of undeserved results going to our ( Germany's) favor.  The display of 2004 wasn't as bad as the result sugests, only the draw against Lettland was embarrissing, the budding Lahm has been a joy to watch. It also was the first tournament of Schweinsteiger. The youth program surely helps to sustain the the output of quality players, but I think it's influence is a bit exaggerated.

The German situation in 2004 was quite similar to the situation England is in now. Quite a few promising young talents, but no concept or team spirit. Take heart

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The 2004 showing was at least very much perceived to be in the grand tradition of 2000 and 2002. In a way it helped people reconsider what the second place finish in 2002 had kind of masked, since it was still Völler in charge and yet the team seemed to be performing no better than under Ribbeck.

When Klinsmann took over and declared he was there to win the World Cup two years later people weren't sure he was serious. Only a few months before the opening game in 2006, tabloids suggested that Beckenbauer (a man at the time already very much out of touch with the state of football) should be hired to "assist" Klinsmann. It basically took until Lahm's opening goal against Costa Rica for people to realise that Klinsmann had in fact managed to build a rather promising team.

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Jamie Carragher pulled no punches in this article for Daily Mail.

13 hours ago, BigFatCoward said:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/36652412

wales don't have to defend this.  it was fucking class, i'm english and i was practically cheering for iceland. 

The way England performed, I'm not sure there are many neutral fans who didn't react the same way to that final whistle.

Iceland are the underdog team of this tournament and have played well enough to become a neutral fans' favourite.

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It's funny. Carragher didn't see these alleged problems after the Wales game. Nobody else did, either. And weirdly, Wales have done well despite their players being brought through exactly the same system Carragher is suggesting made the England players 'soft'.

It's almost as if he's talking rubbish.

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