Why I was thoroughly disappointed in season 6

[LatrineDiggerBrian]

tl;dr: big fan of the first 5 seasons who hasn’t read the books was severely let down by the writing in season 6.

Little background on me: I'm a non book reader who has been obsessed with the show since I first started watching between seasons 2 and 3. I have a lot of respect for D & D for what they've  been able to accomplish with Game of Thrones - the show is truly is an outlier of outliers. Everything from the writing to the casting to the acting to the directing to the costumes to the production design to the musical score to the fights to the VFX are not just perfect, but other worldly. In each season of Game of Thrones, I see things that I’ve never seen before in any other movie or TV series.

With all that said, I can't help but be majorly disappointed by season 6. I think the thing that bothered me the most was the severe lack of creativity in the writing (especially the plotting). Below I’ll give some examples of what troubled me.

The Ending to the House of Black and White Storyline

This one was a real punch to the gut for me. Unlike a lot of people, I absolutely loved every second of Arya’s storyline in Braavos. I loved the mystery and intrigue of the House of Black and White and the Faceless Men. I loved the steady evolution of Arya’s training as she learned to play the game of faces and how to fight. 

Still, I couldn’t have been more depressed by how this one ended. It seemed like such a simple conclusion to such a fascinating storyline. A very Hollywood ending complete with Arya’s cheesy “I’m Arya Stark” before storming out of the House of Black and White. Plus we never really truly learned what the Faceless Men were about or what their code was. I was definitely expecting some more twists and turns and a bit more of a complicated resolution. Instead, I found myself saying, “that’s it?”.

The Predictable North Storyline

Look, ever since the end of season 5, I’ve accepted the fact that season 6 would most likely be the march towards Ramsey’s death with the Stark’s doing some winning. I don’t have a problem with that. It’s the lack of suspense in how it happened that I have a problem with. It was completely predictable and dull with no twists and turns. Late in the season, me and a friend agreed that if the conclusion to the big battle just ended up being Rickon dying, the Stark’s getting bailed out by the Knight’s of the Vale, and Sansa killing Ramsey, that we’d be disappointed. And that of course, is exactly what ended up happening. Plus, the whole Ramsey making Rickon run out to meet Jon was so lame. Again, more Hollywood style story telling as opposed to the previous seasons.

Mereen

Though I did like some of the scenes in Mereen, i.e. the freeing of the dragons and Kinvara, I felt as a whole D & D did a poor job of filling the time while Dany was away with anything interesting or meaningful. Tyrion negotiating with the masters was completely pointless filler in the end. Even regarding the aforementioned scenes of the dragons and Kinvara, what ultimate purpose did they have? Sure, maybe we needed to see Tyrion interact with the dragons if he’s going to ride one of them later, but why did he risk his life to free them if he wasn’t going to try and use them eventually? And Kinvara seemed like a big character introduction, but I can’t see any reason why Dany would bring her to Westeros. So it kind of all just added up to nothing. The masters Mereen invasion was completely anti-climactic. Plus the Varys / Tyrion dialogue seemed a bit off. Don’t even get me started on the two Tyrion and Greyworm / Missandei “drinking games” scenes.

Early Season King’s Landing

The early part of the King’s Landing story line was just miserable. It was one boring and horrible speech from the High Sparrow after another. It’s hard to believe they couldn’t have found something more interesting to do during this time period. Maybe they were handcuffed by what goes on in the books? But wow, every time the High Sparrow was on screen it was just one dull religious cliche after another. He never really said anything interesting when he spoke. His whole story to Maergary was so what you would expect and boring. And yes, I understand the purpose was to build up to Maergary and Tommen eventually pledging to the Faith. People try to explain to me that it was a slow burn, but I always argue that it has to be interesting to be a slow burn. This was more like a slow bore.

Jon’s Resurrection

Not sure if they were just following the books with this, but I couldn’t help but find the resurrection of Jon anti-climactic. Again, one of the reasons I fell in love with the show was the unpredictability and never being able to guess what was going to happen. After Jon was murdered in season 5, I thought of every single way that it wouldn’t be Mel that brought him back since that was the most obvious choice. Turns out I was overcomplicating things.

The End to the Siege of Riverrun

I don’t know how this goes down in the books, but the whole thing with Edmure commanding his men to drop their arms and surrender was really hard for me to believe. Specifically, it was hard for me to believe the men wouldn’t have been loyal to their legendary battle commander in that situation and believe him when he tells them it's a ruse. Also, it was hard for me to believe they’d just hand themselves over to the Frey’s after what they did at the Red Wedding. It was silly.

Stuff Needs to Happen Just Cause

One of the disturbing trends I noticed from early on in the season was more of a willingness from D & D to really force the issue in order to get the story where it needs to go. Some examples: 

• Davos giving Mel a pep talk to revive Jon. It’s been established that Davos absolutely hates Mel, he distrusts her magic (having advised Stannis to not take the throne with it) and is still suspicious that she might have killed Shireen. Add to this, what does he care about reviving Jon so much? And how does he even know she has the power to do so?
• Jaime heading north to The Twin’s instead of back to King’s Landing. He needs to get back to Cersei for an extremely important event (whether he knows it’s a trial by combat or not), but instead wastes time transporting Edmure (which he could have a couple of his men do) just so we can have a scene that sets the stage for Arya killing Walder Frey.
• The whole Sansa and Jon feud. It never added up for me, and seemed to be forced in there just to increase the drama in that storyline.
• The Sand Snakes showing up in King’s Landing to knock off Trystane.
• Arya baking the Frey’s into pies. Because we need to follow up on Bran’s foreshadowing from season 3 and give a nod to the book readers. The whole thing was so implausible, it was just hard for me to not roll my eyes.
• Dany and Tyrion waiting around and wasting time talking while Mereen is being bombarded and then negotiating with the masters just because time needs to be filled. All she had to do was hop on Drogon and roast a ship or two, so it was silly.

Abrupt Dismissals / Deaths of Characters

There were a couple of instances in the season where I felt like the dismissal or death of a minor character was done very poorly. I understand that as we head into the final 13 episodes, the story needs to be consolidated and the focus needs to be on the main characters, but I just felt like they rushed or forced some of these moments and could have done better.

Case and point: Osha and Rickon. The Osha death scene was just horrible, one of my least favorite things of the season. It was predictable and felt like we were just going through the motions. I find it hard to believe that they couldn’t have done a better job of incorporating Osha and Rickon into the story for a little when they wasted so much other time on other filler scenes. 

Ramsey’s murder of Roose Bolton was done with zero creativity. He basically just walks up to him and stabs him. It’s hard to believe that Ramsey wouldn’t pay the price for that as I’m sure Roose was very well respected in his house. It just seemed rushed and lazy. D & D are better than that.

Daario staying behind in Mereen also seemed forced and didn’t make sense to me. I have a feeling they’re doing it so he can randomly show up and save Dany when she’s in trouble next season.

Conclusion

I didn't actually hate every second of season 6. In truth, there were a lot of things I liked and even loved about season 6. I think for me, the show is a victim of its own success and the bar has been set so high that I couldn’t help but be disappointed. I just felt like D & D are capable of so much more, but maybe asking them to come up with a dynamic plot on top of all the other stuff they do each year was just too much.

So did I hate season 6 as a whole? No. Do I hate that it didn’t come close to living up to hype of the other seasons? Yes. Do I hate that the story telling has become more conventional and linear as compared to the previous seasons? Yes. Do I hate that the show is pandering to its mass audience a bit more? Yes. Do I hate that season 6 wasn’t as dark as the previous seasons? Yes. Will I be watching seasons 7 and 8? Yes, but I'm not anticipating the story telling of the show will ever reach the heights of seasons 1-5.

[Ser Quork]

Well thought-out post.

I'm a book reader first so I saw these issues as being part & parcel of deviating from the heart of the written storylines (rather than mere streamlining), but a few show-only viewer-friends of mine have pointed out much the same as you have, so I don't think you're alone.

For me, perhaps the show-runners' inexperience is also telling.  It can be hard to resist giving one's audience what (one thinks) they want.  They see the fan reaction videos and breathless commentary of how shocking or 'bad-ass' something is and think this is the thing that should be delivered first and foremost rather than a stronger, more coherent narrative to underpin events which would mean resisting fan service.  It's hard to resist the demands of a very vocal fanbase, especially one that has made millions for all concerned - but resistance would have led to a better quality narrative, in my view.

On the whole, it seems the majority of fans have enjoyed the season and have not concerned themselves with the issues, even if they have acknowledged them.  People's individual mileage may vary, as we know.   But, yes, I'm disappointed in these issues too. 

[Bainberg]

I would say that is the point of being a bookreader. Those that are willing to put in the time get rewarded. The lazy, get the tv show

[Lockjaw of House Boltagon]

2 hours ago, Bainberg said:

I would say that is the point of being a bookreader. Those that are willing to put in the time get rewarded. The lazy, get the tv show

WTF is this comment? If the reward for book readers is AFFC and ADWD then I'd stick with the tv show tbh. 

OP, I couldn't agree more, I had pretty much the same problems with this season, just too many anticlimactic resolutions, storylines that went nowhere, characters acting OOC or spending half the season doing nothing, plotholes, etc, even if I ultimately enjoyed it as a whole.

[Bainberg]

5 minutes ago, Lyin' Ned said:

WTF is this comment? If the reward for book readers is AFFC and ADWD then I'd stick with the tv show tbh. 

OP, I couldn't agree more, I had pretty much the same problems with this season, just too many anticlimactic resolutions, storylines that went nowhere, characters acting OOC or spending half the season doing nothing, plotholes, etc, even if I ultimately enjoyed it as a whole.

Then stick with the show. Name one show or movie that compares to the books? Exactly.

this whining is absurd. Dude we get it...the show sucks, the car in front of you is driving too slow, Your fries are cold, the band could have played 2 more songs, it's too hot, etc. sorry, I deal with children enough at home, hate to have to see it on here too

As far as the op, couldn't disagree more. Love the show and love the books. How about you attempt to be thankful you get to experience the greatest story ever told. It could be worse, you could be stuck in 1910 with Tom Sawyer to read

op

 

[Lockjaw of House Boltagon]

4 minutes ago, Bainberg said:

Then stick with the show. Name one show or movie that compares to the books? Exactly.

this whining is absurd. Dude we get it...the show sucks, the car in front of you is driving too slow, Your fries are cold, the band could have played 2 more songs, it's too hot, etc. sorry, I deal with children enough at home, hate to have to see it on here too

I literally have no idea what you're saying. 

*Backs out of thread slowly*

[Bainberg]

1 minute ago, Lyin' Ned said:

I literally have no idea what you're saying. 

*Backs out of thread slowly*

Probably a smart move

[lancerman]

25 minutes ago, Bainberg said:

Then stick with the show. Name one show or movie that compares to the books? Exactly.

this whining is absurd. Dude we get it...the show sucks, the car in front of you is driving too slow, Your fries are cold, the band could have played 2 more songs, it's too hot, etc. sorry, I deal with children enough at home, hate to have to see it on here too

As far as the op, couldn't disagree more. Love the show and love the books. How about you attempt to be thankful you get to experience the greatest story ever told. It could be worse, you could be stuck in 1910 with Tom Sawyer to read

op

 

The Godfather. Jaws. Goldfinger.

[Primalsplit]

You begin to understand.

[Bainberg]

34 minutes ago, lancerman said:

The Godfather. Jaws. Goldfinger.

Can't say I've read or watched any to be able to respond. But essentially you named 3 out of untold millions of stories or books. 3 rather simple direct straightforward stories. Interesting

[lancerman]

12 minutes ago, Bainberg said:

Can't say I've read or watched any to be able to respond. But essentially you named 3 out of untold millions of stories or books. 3 rather simple direct straightforward stories. Interesting

You said name one. I named three without even thinking about it.

Now you want to try to change the criteria after the fact and act like I failed because, rather than take your statement at face value, I didn't read your mind and go through the millions of book series that were adapted.

I didn't just rattle off three book to movie adaptations by the way. I took three well received books where the consensus is that the films outclassed them and have a greater legacy. But there's an abundance more. Also not for nothing, but I picked three of the most well known films ever so maybe you not knowing them speaks to what you know of book to screen adaptations.

[TheKitttenGuard]

LTRB

 I really enjoyed the season very much and agree with many of your overall points in terms of too much being in service of plot. 

I do think that the show-runners wanted to get people in place for the end game and sacrifice a lot of subtlety to achieve that aim.  It may of well be too much to get there and the show lost a suspension of belief.  It can be a very difficult for one to regain and they may of been too careless in that.

The predictability is a tough one in that the show is starting to get to the end point.  Did you really want a story where Ramsey Bolton will be victorious?  I read some commentators that you expect the worst from the show so having the good guys win was unpredictable.  In the end they handle what is predictable overall well for me.  I had a moment of uncertainty of what I thought will happen during the body crush scene occurred in BOTB and that is what I needed. 

 

It is very nice to read a criticism post that what to discuss the show independently from the books. 

[LatrineDiggerBrian]

48 minutes ago, TheKitttenGuard said:

LTRB

 I really enjoyed the season very much and agree with many of your overall points in terms of too much being in service of plot. 

I do think that the show-runners wanted to get people in place for the end game and sacrifice a lot of subtlety to achieve that aim.  It may of well be too much to get there and the show lost a suspension of belief.  It can be a very difficult for one to regain and they may of been too careless in that.

The predictability is a tough one in that the show is starting to get to the end point.  Did you really want a story where Ramsey Bolton will be victorious?  I read some commentators that you expect the worst from the show so having the good guys win was unpredictable.  In the end they handle what is predictable overall well for me.  I had a moment of uncertainty of what I thought will happen during the body crush scene occurred in BOTB and that is what I needed. 

 

It is very nice to read a criticism post that what to discuss the show independently from the books. 

When I say unpredictability or lack of suspense, it doesn't mean that the Starks don't have to win or Arya doesn't have to make it back to Westeros, but how we get there can be more challenging.

Let me give you an example of something I came up with in 5 minutes for the Battle of Bastards. The point of me telling you it is not to say how great it is because I came up with it very quickly, but it's just to show you what I mean.

You could have a scene in episode 8 where Baelish is suspiciously able to cross Moat Cailin after it has been deserted. Then have the battle go as it did in the show, then when you get to the point where the Stark army is about to get crushed when they're surrounded, when the Knight's of the Vale show up the horses charge but fall into hidden trenches dug by the Bolton's before the battle (it's a trap). Bolton man throw torches into the pits. We get a shot of Jon passing out. He wakes up in Winterfell strapped upside down to a flay board, along with all of the other major Stark players: Davos, Tormund, Mel, Baelish, etc. Ramsey walks in with a teary eyed Sansa on his arm. Then you can have the Stark's get out of it somehow because Sansa somehow gets the best of Ramsey, or Osha jumps in to save them after escaping (would have to build this up in previous episodes) and the Bolton men just let them kill Ramsey because they truly hate him (could have more emphasis on him carelessly sacrificing his own men during the battle). That is suspense.

Again, maybe people think that's ludicrous, but the point isn't to say how great it is, it's just to show you how they could've made the plotting better. 

And I'd appreciate it if people who have read the book don't hijack this thread, there are already a ton of other threads for that. Again, I haven't read the books, so my thoughts are independent of what goes on in the books.

[LatrineDiggerBrian]

3 hours ago, Bainberg said:

Then stick with the show. Name one show or movie that compares to the books? Exactly.

this whining is absurd. Dude we get it...the show sucks, the car in front of you is driving too slow, Your fries are cold, the band could have played 2 more songs, it's too hot, etc. sorry, I deal with children enough at home, hate to have to see it on here too

As far as the op, couldn't disagree more. Love the show and love the books. How about you attempt to be thankful you get to experience the greatest story ever told. It could be worse, you could be stuck in 1910 with Tom Sawyer to read

op

 

If you think I'm not thankful, then I don't think you even bothered to read my post. 

[grufolo]

15 hours ago, LatrineDiggerBrian said:

If you think I'm not thankful, then I don't think you even bothered to read my post. 

You clearly have had not enough experience with the hatred spewers here. By the way, i agree with almost all your points (except the last one). I think the meeting with the Masters was brilliant, a way to punish their betrayal and avoid their escape, while letting the word spread that you don't fuck with the dragon queen. I thought that worked very well.

Besides, my thoughts are that DnD have tried too hard to stick to future book storylines and have decided to go along a safe by-the-book route, even if that translates poorly to the show. Which is a pity. On the other hand, they should have been braver and cut completely (or trasform more deeply) some storylines that became so poor they were a joke (like Dorne). Their error was to keep too much of the books, which are so massive and full of characters that need a further simplification step than what done this far.

[Rex999]

On 7/1/2016 at 4:22 PM, LatrineDiggerBrian said:

big fan of the first 5 seasons who hasn’t read the books was severely let down by the writing in season 6

This is where is where you completely lost me

 

I don't see how anybody who loved season 5 can sit their with a straight face and complain about the writing of season 6.

 If season 6 had come after a great season than maybe i could understand your disappointment 

but it didn't come after a great season 

it came after the terrible season 5 and that set my exceptions going into this season

 

Season 6 isn't perfect but it was a for better season than last year and way more enjoyable to watch

Season 6 left me excited about season 7

Season 5 let me wondering if the show had gone completely off the rails 

P.S The writing in season 6 may not be the best but compared to what I saw last year it is a masterpiece lol

 

 

 

[Morky_Pep]

See so many people consider any criticism or problem with the writing as being a "book purist". Nah, you don't need to read the books to see all the problems with this season. This post is proof of that. Good job. You expect the quality of writing that the show used to give in the early season and you are disappointed that it has diminished so greatly. Welcome to the club!

[Lord Freypie]

Yes, I have a few unsullied friends who really found the last 2 seasons bad (and this one the worst), actually as many as I know book readers who still like and defend the show.

 

[LatrineDiggerBrian]

10 hours ago, Rex999 said:

This is where is where you completely lost me

 

I don't see how anybody who loved season 5 can sit their with a straight face and complain about the writing of season 6.

 If season 6 had come after a great season than maybe i could understand your disappointment 

but it didn't come after a great season 

it came after the terrible season 5 and that set my exceptions going into this season

 

Season 6 isn't perfect but it was a for better season than last year and way more enjoyable to watch

Season 6 left me excited about season 7

Season 5 let me wondering if the show had gone completely off the rails 

P.S The writing in season 6 may not be the best but compared to what I saw last year it is a masterpiece lol

 

 

 

Season 5 was great in my opinion. For me it's in the same stratosphere as all the previous seasons, though it's probably my least favorite of the first 5. 

Have you read the books? If you have, that might taint your opinion a little. I didn't mind Dorne, I feel like the complaining was overblown and simply due to the fact that it was unrecognizable compared to the books. Again, I have no attachment to the books because I haven't read them. 

[Ser Gareth]

On ‎02‎/‎07‎/‎2016 at 3:10 PM, Bainberg said:

Then stick with the show. Name one show or movie that compares to the books? Exactly.

this whining is absurd. Dude we get it...the show sucks, the car in front of you is driving too slow, Your fries are cold, the band could have played 2 more songs, it's too hot, etc. sorry, I deal with children enough at home, hate to have to see it on here too

As far as the op, couldn't disagree more. Love the show and love the books. How about you attempt to be thankful you get to experience the greatest story ever told. It could be worse, you could be stuck in 1910 with Tom Sawyer to read

op

 

Jaws, Forrest Gump, The Godfather, Fight Club, Misery, The Green Mile and perhaps the most controversial of the lot, Jack Reacher (Jack Reacher fans went nuts at the casting of Tom Cruise but I thought he added a charisma that the book version simply doesn't have).  The movies IMO were better than the books.

Edit* - Interview with a Vampire