Ygrain Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 1 hour ago, PirateVergo said: Jon has been alive ever since GRRM confirmed he'd learn more about his mother at some point, if he dies here it's impossible for him to learn more therefore he must be alive. This. The Varamyr prologue foreshadows warging as means of preserving one's consciousness. How and when it returns into his human body, who heals/stores the body and the like remains to be found out. One way or the other, Jon will be back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yin & Yang Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 5 hours ago, Dorian Martell said: I also am for the wounded and healed over dead resurrected I'm a fan of the "has to die to release him from his vows" school of thought. Do you think Jon won't leave the Night's Watch? Or perhaps the Night's Watch will be destroyed after his death and therefore his vows will be irrelevant? I guess my question is - how do you get around this plot point without Jon dying? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leticia Stark Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 3 hours ago, PirateVergo said: Jon has been alive ever since GRRM confirmed he'd learn more about his mother at some point, if he dies here it's impossible for him to learn more therefore he must be alive. Yeah, another reason for him to be alive. I don't think anyone really think he'll die for good, but of course his haters are still hopeful lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillon Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 10 hours ago, Maxxine said: Even Robb arguably warged into Grey Wind when he died. Damn it, now I'm depressed remembering this. Poor Robb didn't even get the chance to live on as Grey Wind. He could have joined Nymeria's pack... “Death is so terribly final, while life is full of possibilities.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aryagonnakill#2 Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 10 hours ago, The Fattest Leech said: Ok, I was doing a little cruising and came across this information with picture, not for proof of anything one way or another, just for more personal information. I was shocked! This is beyond anything I had read before and the picture is freaky... but I know you little devils will all look anyway... https://writersforensicsblog.wordpress.com/2010/02/20/stab-wounds-don’t-always-kill/ 2nd part of the 4th sentence is basically what I wrote about earlier. Thing is that's where the dagger went. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fattest Leech Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 5 minutes ago, aryagonnakill#2 said: 2nd part of the 4th sentence is basically what I wrote about earlier. Thing is that's where the dagger went. Yeah. I keep playing it over and over in my head and trying to feel where it would go (my husband won't let me practice on him ). If Jon is dead-dead, I can understand and accept that no problem. But for some strange reason I think it didn't quite work out like that for some strange reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blckp Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 he has thick plot armor, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leticia Stark Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 7 minutes ago, blckp said: he has thick plot armor, Yes, like all the other four main characters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aryagonnakill#2 Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 There is also Luwins comment about killing the boy so the man can live, and the AAR prophecy about being reborn, so if Jon is the new AA he would seemingly have to die, and like another said it gives him an out with the NW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorian Martell Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 7 hours ago, Yin & Yang said: I'm a fan of the "has to die to release him from his vows" school of thought. Do you think Jon won't leave the Night's Watch? Or perhaps the Night's Watch will be destroyed after his death and therefore his vows will be irrelevant? I guess my question is - how do you get around this plot point without Jon dying? I don't think he will leave the watch. I think rickon will be lord of winterfell. The KITN bit works for the show, but not for the books imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fattest Leech Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 3 minutes ago, Dorian Martell said: I don't think he will leave the watch. I think rickon will be lord of winterfell. The KITN bit works for the show, but not for the books imo. Just a thought, and these are just general points: If Jon comes back (however) and fights to defeat the WW's and saves the realms of men (not just those south of the wall), doesn't that mean the NW has fulfilled thier vows and can disband, therefore, Jon won't have to "leave" or "abandon" his vows. Maybe Jon settles in Queenscrowne, or someplace warm like Dorne (or is that too close to Summerhall?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrakenSlayer Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 Is it not possible that Jon never dies but is presumed dead because he wargs into Ghost and kinda shuts off till his attackers move away? (these attackers ought to be scared, they murdered the Lord Commander, cant be stabbing him for half an hour). Jon then decides to watch what his 'brothers' do so that he is never betrayed again by his men? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tastes like Frey Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 Jon staying dead is honestly more crackpot than him being resurrected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 I do believe that he is dead but I don't believe that he will stay dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorian Martell Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 4 hours ago, The Fattest Leech said: Just a thought, and these are just general points: If Jon comes back (however) and fights to defeat the WW's and saves the realms of men (not just those south of the wall), doesn't that mean the NW has fulfilled thier vows and can disband, therefore, Jon won't have to "leave" or "abandon" his vows. Maybe Jon settles in Queenscrowne, or someplace warm like Dorne (or is that too close to Summerhall?) My guess is that the others invasion is cyclical. Humans hadn't been around westeros long enough to experience them. The watch needs to endure for another 8K for the next one (maybe?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fattest Leech Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 1 hour ago, Dorian Martell said: My guess is that the others invasion is cyclical. Humans hadn't been around westeros long enough to experience them. The watch needs to endure for another 8K for the next one (maybe?) Very interesting. I'm dying to know more but will not take the thread off topic. Damn it! I hate cliffhangers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brightflame princess Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 On 7/2/2016 at 5:17 PM, jontargaryan said: Is dead? There's no way he can survive those many stabs. Heck ONE knife stab killed Robb. Jon was stabbed 7-8 times. Its almost impossible for Jon Snow to survive. So why are posters talking about Jon here like he survives and is integral to the end game? I accept his resurrection as cannon because HE CANT DIE WITHOUT LEARNING WHO HIS MOTHER IS! I would seriously be so disappointed if that happened.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Masha Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 On 7/2/2016 at 9:45 PM, Maxxine said: We've seen at least two resurrections and the Varamyr prologue to show us it's not a cop out. It's been set up. Even Robb arguably warged into Grey Wind when he died. Also Robb sustained more than one knife wound. He was also shot multiple times with arrows. I had recently started seeing this theory that Robb might have warged into Grey Wind when he is died, but how did that theory come about? Direwolf thrashing around and attacking people around them as Robb died, perhaps because he sensed Robb was in danger or dead, not necessary warged into? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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