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How else can the Targaryen name continue on if not through Jon?


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28 minutes ago, brightflame princess said:

A lot of people call all those people you mentioned awful.. especially the US. It's kind of funny that you said that.. Americans can't seem to get past their slave past. And ancient Egypt. They are definitely considered a bit evil for some of the things they did.

History doesn't lie. If you dig deep enough you uncover some unsavory facts.

and remember, the winners write the history. 

I'm just.saying I could see George ending the targ line. I think one of.his main points in the books is everybody is expendable, all men must die. The targ name doesn't matter as much as every body thinks. It would fit with his style of writing if the targs were gone by the end of the series. Ancient history.

I didn't mean nobody call slavers and slavery awful, but nobody today think about Greeks and Romans awful because they ancestors were slavers 2000 years ago. Yes, in USA today exist lot of racial tension, but fact is that USA play crucial role in abolishment of international slave trade.

House Targaryen can be extinct, as any house in the story. My point was that you can't judge Daenerys because her ancestors were slavers.

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51 minutes ago, xjlxking said:

Dany already said she won't have kids and probably won't marry again

Dany believes she can't have children in the books, but many have suggested she may have been pregnant and miscarried at the end of ADWD. I think part of her book-story is her naive acceptance and misinterpretation of prophecies. The whole infertility thing seems to be irrelevant in the show regardless, unless somebody can link a clip of a scene where it's talked about. Yet still, the show can invent some reason or means by which she can become fertile again even if she is barren at present, that's what the show does.

As far as her marrying again - she just said in the season finale that she'll be entertaining the idea when she returns to Westeros. That's the whole reason Tyrion got her to dump Daario. I don't think this is just bait to lure houses into following her because there are so few suitors in the show. In the books there are more, but either way that's no guarantee she won't ultimately choose to - or be forced to - marry again.

 

I'm personally curious to see if we end up getting a "Wars of the Roses" style endgame marriage that would end both the lines of Stark and Targaryen though. Henry VII derived his claim from the Lancasters and he married a York, but he chose the name Tudor for his dynasty and combined the sigils of both Lancaster and York as a symbol of unity. If GRRM really is going for a Wars of the Roses ending, Dany and/or Jon might simply choose to end the Targaryen Dynasty.

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57 minutes ago, nothatso said:

Dany believes she can't have children in the books, but many have suggested she may have been pregnant and miscarried at the end of ADWD. I think part of her book-story is her naive acceptance and misinterpretation of prophecies. The whole infertility thing seems to be irrelevant in the show regardless, unless somebody can link a clip of a scene where it's talked about. Yet still, the show can invent some reason or means by which she can become fertile again even if she is barren at present, that's what the show does.

As far as her marrying again - she just said in the season finale that she'll be entertaining the idea when she returns to Westeros. That's the whole reason Tyrion got her to dump Daario. I don't think this is just bait to lure houses into following her because there are so few suitors in the show. In the books there are more, but either way that's no guarantee she won't ultimately choose to - or be forced to - marry again.

 

I'm personally curious to see if we end up getting a "Wars of the Roses" style endgame marriage that would end both the lines of Stark and Targaryen though. Henry VII derived his claim from the Lancasters and he married a York, but he chose the name Tudor for his dynasty and combined the sigils of both Lancaster and York as a symbol of unity. If GRRM really is going for a Wars of the Roses ending, Dany and/or Jon might simply choose to end the Targaryen Dynasty.

I recall her saying that she won't have children in the show

ill try and find the clip

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16 hours ago, Lady Sansa's Direwolf said:

The only problem legalizing Jon is it has to be done by the king of Westros, who happens to be Cersei at this moment. I doubt she'll be in favor of it.

As for children, if anyone manages to survive the White Walkers, I think a lot of houses are going to be extinct.

This is incorrect, it has to be done by the supreme authority of the land. For the North this supreme authority is Jon. The North no longer recognizes Cersei's authority.

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22 hours ago, Hodor's Dragon said:

Yes, I kind of took it as "a bunch of bizarre stuff that you are probably misinterpreting is going to happen and that's when you will have a live child."

I just took it as a woman who lost everything mocking her perceived tormentor when she was at her most vulnerable.

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4 hours ago, Red Tiger said:

This is incorrect, it has to be done by the supreme authority of the land. For the North this supreme authority is Jon. The North no longer recognizes Cersei's authority.

I have a feeling Jon isn't going to legitimize himself. If he does he will call himself Jon Stark. He still thinks he's Ned Stark's son. 

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11 minutes ago, King Jon Stark Targaryen said:

I have a feeling Jon isn't going to legitimize himself. If he does he will call himself Jon Stark. He still thinks he's Ned Stark's son. 

maybe he is lyanna's and rhaegar's* but ned raised him as his own kid, the ned was his father and jon feels like ned's son.

 

*i don't want him to be and after all this jahaerys deal and everything else i refuse to believe until i see it in GRRM's pages.

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13 hours ago, Cragen said:

 USA economy was based on slavery for years, yet nobody called them awful people because of that. 

Two mistakes.

No, not the American economy overall, but the antebellum economy of the American South specifically. 

And yes, plenty of folks most definitely called them awful people because of this. Who wouldn't? And they did, they did.

For unlike slaves in the Ancient World, those in the American South were often prohibited from marrying, owning property, learning to read, being educated, or earning, buying, or being granted their freedom.

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2 hours ago, CrypticWeirwood said:

Two mistakes.

No, not the American economy overall, but the antebellum economy of the American South specifically. 

And yes, plenty of folks most definitely called them awful people because of this. Who wouldn't? And they did, they did.

For unlike slaves in the Ancient World, those in the American South were often prohibited from marrying, owning property, learning to read, being educated, or earning, buying, or being granted their freedom.

I explain myself in next post

10 hours ago, Cragen said:

I didn't mean nobody call slavers and slavery awful, but nobody today think about Greeks and Romans awful because they ancestors were slavers 2000 years ago. Yes, in USA today exist lot of racial tension, but fact is that USA play crucial role in abolishment of international slave trade.

House Targaryen can be extinct, as any house in the story. My point was that you can't judge Daenerys because her ancestors were slavers.

 

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23 hours ago, Drago said:

I think next season Jon will find out exactly who he is and some proof to back it up.

Rhaegar was convinced that the dragon must have three heads, the only way to achieve this is to make sure all of his children a legitimate because He / She must be I a position of power to have any influence in the wars to come. He was also convinced the prince that was promised would descend from his line. I'm betting he left a royal decree and that he and Lyanna actually got married first. He probably knew the seven kingdoms would plunge into chaos when he took Lyanna for himself and he did it anyway. I'm also betting the Citadel knew about ever thing. from what I am aware the Maesters are supposed to be neutral. They could keep the secret if someone of importance asked them too, maybe Ned Stark. I'm also betting we will see their marriage next season through Bran. Jon sent Sam to become a Maester but I see this as just a plot point to get him there, once there he will have access to everything including all the birth records.

 

:agree: Seriously, this.

Jon doesn't need anyone to legitimize him. He's the heir to the Seven Kingdoms, and a legal Targaryen.

Kings Guard would never fight anyone to the death over a bastard.

I do think Jon will be her new Khal, and their baby will look as close to the baby from the show's House of the Undying.

 

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19 hours ago, Cragen said:

Maestrs are anti-dragon, anti-Targaryen, anti-magic and anti-prophecy, so if Citadela had some documents about Rheagar children, I don't see why would they have it, they would destroy it.

The impression I got from the show is that they are opposed to magic and dragons but not necessarily Targaryen's.

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23 hours ago, Asvpxkvng said:

Could this whole maester thing be true? Could the Cotadel really do this. Can someone find specific proof of this because this seems like a great way to move on with Sam's storyline merging back with Jons but it seems like you're reaching a little bit because I've never heard of this before but maybe I just didn't think of the Citadel in that capacity.

Just a personal theory I have come up with. When you watch a show like this for a while you tend to pick up the way they construct things.

I could be wrong but I'm betting I'm not. Why else send Sam? It takes years to become a Maester. Why not just ask the Citadel to send them a new Qualified Maester. I don't see why a Maester can not serve at Castle Black without taking the Oath. A qualified Maester would have a better idea of where to look for something to fight the WW then Sam Would at this stage.

Another point is that Sam seems to be the nosy type, he will look for things he is not meant to be looking for.

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8 minutes ago, Drago said:

The impression I got from the show is that they are opposed to magic and dragons but not necessarily Targaryen's.

Targaryens descend from Valyrians, race known for they magic and valyrian magic was strongest one. Dragons are representation of magic only way to destroy magic is to destroy dragons, safest way to be sure dragons will not come back is to destroy Targs. In Rogue Prince, Princess and Queen, epilogue of ADwTD is suggested that maesters and faith played major role in killing of dragons and downfall of house Targaryen.

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On 05/07/2016 at 5:24 AM, Lady Sansa's Direwolf said:

The only problem legalizing Jon is it has to be done by the king of Westros, who happens to be Cersei at this moment. I doubt she'll be in favor of it.

As for children, if anyone manages to survive the White Walkers, I think a lot of houses are going to be extinct.

Valar Morghulis...

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Spoiler

In the book Sam will be around glass candle, its huge dragonglass candle that didn`t burn for hundreds of years and now is burning. With this candle man can communicate cross long distances, can enter and send dreams to people. Sam is in biggest library in the world with wast knowledge at his disposal. He parallel Bran. Also Jaqen is around also, searching for something, so there is something very important there.

 

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Thank you all very much for your input. But for the record, I  am not say the Targaryen line will continue, or that it has to continue. All I am saying is that if it is to continue, the only way that seems to be possible is through Jon.

After all, I can see George R R Martin doing such a thing (ending the line once and for all). To me, this whole story just seems to be a long-winded and witty way to say that war sucks, you never quite know what is going on inside a person's mind (no matter how much you think you know them), and the whole idea of fighting and dying for a Lord or King who has absolutely no more of a right to rule over you than anyone else.

Anyway, going to some early morning fishing. Gotta run.

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On July 3, 2016 at 6:37 PM, Travis said:

The reason I ask is that by all accounts that we know of, Dany cannot produce any heirs. To me, it seems that the only way to make that work would be to legitimize Jon as a Targaryan and marry him to make him King of Westeros. When she dies in battle, he will then be free to remarry and continue the bloodline through another wife. What do you all think?

She can't have children yet, at least not until the requirements of her prophecy are fulfilled.  

She won't be barren forever.  

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22 hours ago, Cragen said:

Targaryens descend from Valyrians, race known for they magic and valyrian magic was strongest one. Dragons are representation of magic only way to destroy magic is to destroy dragons, safest way to be sure dragons will not come back is to destroy Targs. In Rogue Prince, Princess and Queen, epilogue of ADwTD is suggested that maesters and faith played major role in killing of dragons and downfall of house Targaryen.

Thanks for the history lesson but you need not state the obvious. The Targs downfall was not that they lost their dragons but rather they made some very bad choices and isn't it ironic now after all these years that the dragons might play a role in saving everyone after the Maesters tried to wipe them out.

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