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The Others' way around the Wall?


The Sleeper

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Interesting. Good catch. I guess Sam's broken horn wouldn't be needed in this case.

I have an idea though that the big magical wall is coming down. And probably caused by somebody doing something stupid, with the destruction of the wall as a result of unintended consequences. Maybe Queen Selyse (spelling?) or Mad Mel doing something crushingly stupid at the Nightfort, like burning a certain creepy weirwood door. :D

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12 minutes ago, Michael Mertyns said:

Why not both? (Assuming great enough numbers) An attack on multiple sides would only make it harder for the NW to defend.

Yeah I guess so.  I don't think the issue is whether or not it's easy for the Wights to cross - they could just swarm the gorge without having to worry about broken bones etc. in the same way they don't have to worry about drowning in the Bay of Seals.

The White Walkers however may need the Wall to come down in order to move further south?

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1 hour ago, BricksAndSparrows said:

I'd say that quote is a pretty good indicator. It certainly feels like GRRM's brand of foreshadowing.

But I still have my doubts about the Others' intentions and whether crossing the Wall or bringing it down is really what they're planning.

Have you noticed any indicators of this or just a gut feeling? Interesting thought....

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15 minutes ago, gregg22 said:

Have you noticed any indicators of this or just a gut feeling? Interesting thought....

Well, we just don't know their motives or intentions. It's just everyone's assumption that they want to cross the wall, because that's what legends say they did.. But what is it they want south of the Wall? That gives me pause. Also, the general theme for these novels is "expect the unexpected," so...

Anyway, I'm not saying that they aren't meaning to cross, but I haven't found anything to suggest that is absolutely their intention.

Now, as far as gut feelings go... I have a feeling they want to drive all the humans out of the North. The children of the Forrest did not benefit from living side by side with men, so I could see why the Others want them out.

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I've had the impression that the 'dead things in the water' Cotter Pyke sees and reports in his letter are not actually attacking him but moving south. It'll be very interesting to see what happens with the Umbers, whose lands would get hit by a potential invasion via water) and the Mormonts, located on the other side of the Wall.

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I had thought this for a while. When Mormont mentions in AGoT that there had been sightings of White walkers along the bay of seals and Tyrion's knee-jerk thought was about merlings in the sea off Lannisport.

My thought is, what would stop them from just crossing the under the water (unless they cant get wet)? or freezing the bay to walk across the bay and around the wall (unless their ability to cause cold conditions does not go that far, limited magic)?

With the "dead things in the water" letter, It seems obvious that there is a lot more going on than what we "know" and can only speculate as to what the WW might be up to.

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44 minutes ago, CJDTrismegistus said:

I like the idea that the Others could just use the "Winds of Winter" to freeze the Bay of Seals and just bypass the Wall. A bit like Hadrian's Wall, you've got this huge outlay of resources to build something that's ultimately useless!

I'll be extremely disappointed, and I believe most of the readers as well, if the Wall doesn't come crushing down. I don't care if its because of White Walkers invasion or to stop the White Walker invasion in the end, but I want to see that Wall down!

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3 minutes ago, Masha said:

I'll be extremely disappointed, and I believe most of the readers as well, if the Wall doesn't come crushing down. I don't care if its because of White Walkers invasion or to stop the White Walker invasion in the end, but I want to see that Wall down!

Right at the end of the story, Jon Snow chopping away at it with Longclaw, swearing profusely about what a lot of good it was! :D

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5 hours ago, BricksAndSparrows said:

Well, we just don't know their motives or intentions. It's just everyone's assumption that they want to cross the wall, because that's what legends say they did.. But what is it they want south of the Wall? That gives me pause. Also, the general theme for these novels is "expect the unexpected," so...

Anyway, I'm not saying that they aren't meaning to cross, but I haven't found anything to suggest that is absolutely their intention.

Now, as far as gut feelings go... I have a feeling they want to drive all the humans out of the North. The children of the Forrest did not benefit from living side by side with men, so I could see why the Others want them out.

Perhaps the Gods Eye more specifically the Isle of Faces. That place hold a lot of interest for me as a reader. Some people think that's where the rituals for the Hammer of the Gods was preformed. Also the Andals were never able to conquer the island and the "Green Men".

I can only speculate but I would think if the others are in fact intelligent with goals, hopes, and dreams. This place would be of interest to them. Maybe enough to go to war. 

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1 hour ago, Muggle said:

Perhaps the Gods Eye more specifically the Isle of Faces. That place hold a lot of interest for me as a reader. Some people think that's where the rituals for the Hammer of the Gods was preformed. Also the Andals were never able to conquer the island and the "Green Men".

I can only speculate but I would think if the others are in fact intelligent with goals, hopes, and dreams. This place would be of interest to them. Maybe enough to go to war. 

I like the idea that they're goal isn't to wipe out man kind, but they're actually just after the Isle of Faces. However, it just so happens that the Isle of Faces sits in the middle of the land of Men, who they know they'll need to defeat in order to get there. Essentially, they're story would be quite heroic if seen from their point of view: Retake this extremely holy place that sits occupied by these pagan enemies who fought you to a stand-still centuries ago. It kind of makes me imagine the Holy Crusaders riding to take back Jerusalem from the Saracens, but with an almost Celtic flavor rather than Medieval Christian European. That really makes them almost human as far as motivations and characteristics.

It's a fascinating concept that the Others are driven intently by their religion, and that they themselves might be having the same kind of internal quasi-political struggles concerning what direction to take their people. Maybe there's a small minority among them that support the notion of attempting to make terms with the Humans, but they're too few to make a difference in any councils.

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18 hours ago, Muggle said:

Perhaps the Gods Eye more specifically the Isle of Faces. That place hold a lot of interest for me as a reader. Some people think that's where the rituals for the Hammer of the Gods was preformed. Also the Andals were never able to conquer the island and the "Green Men".

I can only speculate but I would think if the others are in fact intelligent with goals, hopes, and dreams. This place would be of interest to them. Maybe enough to go to war. 

That's an excellent point. I could absolutely see that. The isle is clearly important/a place of power. Based on what we have learned so far, we can't say anything for certain, but that sounds like the best/most likely motivation I have heard so far.

There is a lot to support that they just "hate life and warmth," and there may be a drop of truth to it, but the explanation sounds more like Old Nan summarizing.

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