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Wee question on Dragonbinder


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So I'm this far with my understanding.

Euron is at sea with Silence. 

Pyat Pree has set out on a Galleas from Qarth with three other Warlocks. 

Euron comes across Pyat, intercepts the Galleas and kills one of the Warlocks and has them captive since. 

He has been downing their cask of shade of the evening since. 

He also scooped their horn Dragonbinder while he took the ship, which is alleged to be from Valyria. 

So we know they had the horn, alleged it was from Valyria although I haven't saw that proved. But at least we know that Euron took it by force and never found it in Valyria himself.

Anything more to this tale? Have I missed anything confirming the origin of this horn?.

 

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Euron claims he got the horn in Valyria himself.

Quote

That horn you heard I found amongst the smoking ruins that were Valyria, where no man has dared to walk but me.

Of course, he could be just saying that. As far as can tell it is not connected to the warlocks.

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7 minutes ago, Michael Mertyns said:

Euron claims he got the horn in Valyria himself.

Of course, he could be just saying that. As far as can tell it is not connected to the warlocks.

Euron took the horn from the Warlocks when he took their ship which confirms he never found it in Valyria himself, but where did the Warlocks get it from.

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10 minutes ago, Macgregor of the North said:

Euron took the horn from the Warlocks when he took their ship which confirms he never found it in Valyria himself, but where did the Warlocks get it from.

Where is this confirmed? I don't remember it, I also remembered that Dragonbinder was allegedly found by Euron himself in Valyria.

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1 minute ago, Macgregor of the North said:

Euron took the horn from the Warlocks when he took their ship which confirms he never found it in Valyria himself, but where did the Warlocks get it from.

Is there a quote for this? Just want to be sure.

Given how everybody treats Valyria these days, perhaps it was removed before the Doom. If it really binds dragons to a person's will, it seems unlikely that its previous owner would just leave it around. We know that the Targaryens moved to Dragonstone before the Doom hit. There were also archons from Valyria for the territories in the Freehold. Perhaps such a Valyrian brought a dragon horn with him at some point. When the Doom hit, the territories of the Freehold reasserted their independence. Someone would then have claimed the horn, at which point it could be sold and/or stolen until it eventually came into possession of Euron.

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14 minutes ago, Red Man Racey said:

Where is this confirmed? I don't remember it, I also remembered that Dragonbinder was allegedly found by Euron himself in Valyria.

The official WOIAF app. 

The horns alleged origin is Valyria but did the Warlocks get it there? 

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10 minutes ago, Michael Mertyns said:

Is there a quote for this? Just want to be sure.

Given how everybody treats Valyria these days, perhaps it was removed before the Doom. If it really binds dragons to a person's will, it seems unlikely that its previous owner would just leave it around. We know that the Targaryens moved to Dragonstone before the Doom hit. There were also archons from Valyria for the territories in the Freehold. Perhaps such a Valyrian brought a dragon horn with him at some point. When the Doom hit, the territories of the Freehold reasserted their independence. Someone would then have claimed the horn, at which point it could be sold and/or stolen until it eventually came into possession of Euron.

It's confirmed in the Qarth section of the WOIAF app. 

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59 minutes ago, Michael Mertyns said:

Unless there's something else in the app, then AFAIK we're left only with speculation

The app itself is something that is a bit of a gem finder when your reading it, the info just jumps out at you, but on the horn, the info above is all we have. I was wondering if anybody on here had read anything further. 

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2 hours ago, Red Man Racey said:

Where is this confirmed? I don't remember it, I also remembered that Dragonbinder was allegedly found by Euron himself in Valyria.

There are a few sources of info out there for the updated Euron/Winds chapter, but I figured this would be a good start. In the new Euron chapter you will learn more about how and where Euron has the things he does. Sorry if this is repeat into for you.

 

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1 hour ago, The Fattest Leech said:

There are a few sources of info out there for the updated Euron/Winds chapter, but I figured this would be a good start. In the new Euron chapter you will learn more about how and where Euron has the things he does. Sorry if this is repeat into for you.

 

Thanks for popping that link up here TFL, I have read the foresaken a good few times now already but it still doesn't shed any light on if the horn actually got picked up in old Valyria by the Warlocks. I'm unsure how it comes into their hands. 

I don't think they had it in Qarth when Dany was there, so they must have left Qarth in their ship and picked it up somewhere before meeting Euron.

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Once that tidbit about Dragonbinder from the App came out we had a little discussion about whether Euron did actually understand what it was for or whether he was truly himself when he was sending Vic to Slaver's Bay (the new chapter sort of suggests he was).

However, the question what the horn is for and what Pyat Pree originally wanted to use it for still remains.

Did he and his people intend to use it to steal Dany's dragons or did he intend to use it to kill them? We don't know yet. But we sort of know their general attitude towards Daenerys so the thing most likely was intended as some sort of weapon. Does Euron know that? And if so, could he unmake or high-check that spell for his own needs?

Really difficult to answer.

We don't even know whether it is truly Valyrian in origin. But if it is the old Qartheen Undying could have captured into during some ancient war with Valyria or during a Valyrian civil war where they supported the victorious dragonlord faction and captured this valuable item from the ship or the colony city of some of the losers.

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6 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

Once that tidbit about Dragonbinder from the App came out we had a little discussion about whether Euron did actually understand what it was for or whether he was truly himself when he was sending Vic to Slaver's Bay (the new chapter sort of suggests he was).

However, the question what the horn is for and what Pyat Pree originally wanted to use it for still remains.

Did he and his people intend to use it to steal Dany's dragons or did he intend to use it to kill them? We don't know yet. But we sort of know their general attitude towards Daenerys so the thing most likely was intended as some sort of weapon. Does Euron know that? And if so, could he unmake or high-check that spell for his own needs?

Really difficult to answer.

We don't even know whether it is truly Valyrian in origin. But if it is the old Qartheen Undying could have captured into during some ancient war with Valyria or during a Valyrian civil war where they supported the victorious dragonlord faction and captured this valuable item from the ship or the colony city of some of the losers.

After reading the foresaken many times I'm quite sure Euron is himself there at least and while he is out of control with his thirst for power, he isn't under the warlocks control I don't think.

What I want to know is if the undying had it all those years then they surely learned about it and therefore why didn't they use it in Qarth when Dany went there?.

And if they set out on their ship to seek it in a revenge plot against Dany, then where did they get it? And who from?.

On the horn itself, I'm quite confident myself it's Valyrian in origin. The VS on its design, the glyphs, the mention of blood for fire, and fire for blood. It certainly has a Valyrian feel to it for sure. We would have to find out where it came from but that info has escaped me, unless it's hidden in the app.

Also, doesn't Dany say dragons were controlled with horns, but who did she hear that from? Viserys? Who told him? Should we believe that? Dany rides Drogon without a horn or spell so who knows.

 

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4 hours ago, Macgregor of the North said:

After reading the foresaken many times I'm quite sure Euron is himself there at least and while he is out of control with his thirst for power, he isn't under the warlocks control I don't think.

Yeah, that seems to be confirmed.

4 hours ago, Macgregor of the North said:

What I want to know is if the undying had it all those years then they surely learned about it and therefore why didn't they use it in Qarth when Dany went there?

You have to keep in mind that the Undying weren't all that interested in the dragons. Remember, they wanted to suck Dany dry, presumably because of her special magical destiny/potential, and Drogon actually saved Dany and killed the Undying.

Pyat Pree may have found Dragonbinder in the ruins of of the House of the Undying. And neither he nor his buddies might actually be interested in the dragons but rather in killing/destroying Daenerys because what she did to the Undying.

4 hours ago, Macgregor of the North said:

And if they set out on their ship to seek it in a revenge plot against Dany, then where did they get it? And who from?.

They would have had it already.

4 hours ago, Macgregor of the North said:

On the horn itself, I'm quite confident myself it's Valyrian in origin. The VS on its design, the glyphs, the mention of blood for fire, and fire for blood. It certainly has a Valyrian feel to it for sure. We would have to find out where it came from but that info has escaped me, unless it's hidden in the app.

Sure, a Valyrian origin is the best guess. But who knows what the Undying might have been able to create. Valyrian glyphs don't have to be written only by Valyrians. Everybody knowing them could make a replicate, right?

4 hours ago, Macgregor of the North said:

Also, doesn't Dany say dragons were controlled with horns, but who did she hear that from? Viserys? Who told him? Should we believe that? Dany rides Drogon without a horn or spell so who knows.

Dany remembers something like that, yes, but we don't know yet the context in which the dragonlords used those horns. The Targaryens in Westeros seemed to have none and could still become dragonriders for centuries. An idea that has been tossed around is that

- Dragonbinder might bind a dragon and its line to a human family line, effectively creating a new dragonlord line.

- Dragonbinder might be a tool to subdue a wild dragon.

- Dragonbinder might be weapon to destroy the bond between dragonrider and rider.

- Dragonbinder might be a weapon to steal a dragon from another rider.

How it works is another matter. Some people think you have to have dragonlord blood (I'm one of them) others suggest it might refer to blood sacrifices, or how Moqorro thinks it works. The idea that 'fire wights' have to sound the horn is also out there. We have to wait and see.

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21 hours ago, Macgregor of the North said:

The official WOIAF app. 

The horns alleged origin is Valyria but did the Warlocks get it there? 

actually a while back i asked ran where this info came from and he himselve could not remember this info at first, but when pointed to they entry he said that it was a piece of info that was labelled "subject to change" meaning it is for now semi-canon since GRRM apparently has not fully made up his mind on whether this is where Euron got the horn from.

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20 hours ago, direpupy said:

actually a while back i asked ran where this info came from and he himselve could not remember this info at first, but when pointed to they entry he said that it was a piece of info that was labelled "subject to change" meaning it is for now semi-canon since GRRM apparently has not fully made up his mind on whether this is where Euron got the horn from.

Do you mean that the horn coming from Valyria is semi canon and not decided on yet, or the info that is written in the app is semi canon and not decided on?

if I'm not mistaken doesn't Ran write info in the app? And if it appears there we should surely take it as Canon as it is the only official WOIAF app there is. 

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1 hour ago, Macgregor of the North said:

Do you mean that the horn coming from Valyria is semi canon and not decided on yet, or the info that is written in the app is semi canon and not decided on?

if I'm not mistaken doesn't Ran write info in the app? And if it appears there we should surely take it as Canon as it is the only official WOIAF app there is. 

The info in they app comes from notes made available to to Ellio (Ran) and Linda by GRRM, but like the disclaimer on they app says information on the app is subject to change by the author's disgression.

The way Ran explained it to me was that if its not in the books its semi-canon and you can not be sure that it is actually going to appear in the books.

Also the info on dragonbinder is only in the Qarth section and not in the Euron or Warlock section's  because they found this info among the notes on Qarth but did not find corroborating info among the notes on Euron and the Warlocks.

So for now it seems he got the horn from the warlocks, but its semi-canon info, something i just felt i should point out so you can take it into account in any theorizing you do on this subject.

By no means should this stop you from theorizing its just a peace of info i thought would be relevant.

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