The Marquis de Leech Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 1 hour ago, Ordos said: Yeah. Like Donald Duck. The guy's name is Trump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Chatywin et al. Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 17 hours ago, Altherion said: The problem is that if the only reason they've changed their opinion is because they need votes, there's nothing stopping them from changing it right back the moment they no longer need votes. I'm reasonably confident that Clinton will back TTP and TTIP again very soon after she is elected, probably with the excuse that she has made some changes to them and now they're good again. I mean, that didn't take long........... http://www.politico.com/story/2016/07/terry-mcauliffe-hillary-clinton-tpp-trade-226253 Quote Virginia Gov. Terry McAuliffe, longtime best friend to the Clintons, said Tuesday that he believes Hillary Clinton will support the TPP trade deal if elected president, with some tweaks. “I worry that if we don’t do TPP, at some point China’s going to break the rules -- but Hillary understands this,” he said in an interview after his speech on the main stage at the Democratic National Convention. “Once the election’s over, and we sit down on trade, people understand a couple things we want to fix on it but going forward we got to build a global economy.” Story Continued Below Pressed on whether Clinton would turn around and support the trade deal she opposed during the heat of the primary fight against Bernie Sanders, McAuliffe said: “Yes. Listen, she was in support of it. There were specific things in it she wants fixed.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Altherion Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 7 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said: I mean........... http://www.politico.com/story/2016/07/terry-mcauliffe-hillary-clinton-tpp-trade-226253 Ha! Too much honesty there, Terry. But seriously, I have a really hard time believing TPP somehow goes away -- there are too many powers which have already agreed on it and made plans accordingly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MerenthaClone Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 17 hours ago, Altherion said: The problem is that if the only reason they've changed their opinion is because they need votes, there's nothing stopping them from changing it right back the moment they no longer need votes. I'm reasonably confident that Clinton will back TTP and TTIP again very soon after she is elected, probably with the excuse that she has made some changes to them and now they're good again. How many times do you need to be linked the study that shows that elected officials usually try pretty damn hard to enact their campaign promises before you get over your entrenched distrust of Hillary Clinton? Yeah, she might go back on it, but since she's convinced Kaine to switch his official position, I think she's signaling pretty hard that she's willing to push for stuff her constituency clearly wants that she has promised to push for, regardless of her beliefs. (Her full-throated support of TPP when she was SoS may also have been this, btw). This is a good thing. But you've got her in a catch -22:. If she goes with her constituency, she's duplicitous and if she doesn't, she's ignoring the will of her base. Pick one. I don't care why she opposes eg restricting access to abortion as long as she does. She could believe the aborted fetusus strengthen Satan's power and will bring about the end times, but as long as she supports freedom of access (and doesn't push for mandatory abortions or w/e) who gives a shit. Fuck's sake, people are questioning her dedication to public health reform in light of her almost torpedoing Bill's first term due to her push for universal healthcare. The blind hatred is insane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 7 minutes ago, Altherion said: Ha! Too much honesty there, Terry. But seriously, I have a really hard time believing TPP somehow goes away -- there are too many powers which have already agreed on it and made plans accordingly. He walked the statement back later, and the Clinton campaign said he was wrong too. I don't know what Clinton really thinks about TPP, but its clear that politically she simply can't ever support it. Its not just about this election, if she wins, its also about the midterms and her reelection bid. And if she did win reelection as well, she'd find herself in the same position Obama is in now, where the congressional leadership won't support it out of concern for the next nominee. If TPP isn't approved this lame duck session, its not ever getting approved. Which is a shame, because its a really important deal, but the opposition in both parties is too vocal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fragile Bird Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 OMG. Bill O'Reilly on Fox News had to go fact check Michelle Obama's statement about slaves building the White House. His response? They were well-fed slaves.... http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/onpolitics/2016/07/27/bill-oreilly-michelle-obama-white-house-slaves-speech/87604632/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Chatywin et al. Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 41 minutes ago, Fez said: He walked the statement back later, and the Clinton campaign said he was wrong too. I don't know what Clinton really thinks about TPP, but its clear that politically she simply can't ever support it. Its not just about this election, if she wins, its also about the midterms and her reelection bid. And if she did win reelection as well, she'd find herself in the same position Obama is in now, where the congressional leadership won't support it out of concern for the next nominee. Come on Fez, you know how this dance works. Politician says something a little too honest. Politician gets flack from his fellow politicians. Politician walks back previous statement. Politician now has a new, sanitized answer. As for what Clinton really thinks, I mean, one of her best friends and closest political allies literally just told you..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 1 minute ago, Tywin et al. said: Come on Fez, you know how this dance works. Politician says something a little too honest. Politician gets flack from his fellow politicians. Politician walks back previous statement. Politician now has a new, sanitized answer. As for what Clinton really thinks, I mean, one of her best friends and closest political allies literally just told you..... Sure. And this maybe means Clinton has privately said she likes TPP, I don't know. But it doesn't matter. Its absolutely clear that politically its suicide for her to support it. And with congressional leadership like Pelosi now coming out against TPP as well, the party can't walk back from this. Politicians hold private thoughts all the time they never act on. There's still a bunch of Democrats in Congress who privately don't like abortion, but they publicly support it through a combination of knowing that's where the party is and believing that they shouldn't subject other people's bodies to their views. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ormond Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 2 hours ago, Ordos said: Yeah. Like Donald Duck. I believe this is a grievous insult to the Disney character -- as well as to Daisy, Huey, Dewey, Louie, Scrooge, April, May, June, and all their other friends and relatives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Pepper Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 29 minutes ago, Fragile Bird said: OMG. Bill O'Reilly on Fox News had to go fact check Michelle Obama's statement about slaves building the White House. His response? They were well-fed slaves.... http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/onpolitics/2016/07/27/bill-oreilly-michelle-obama-white-house-slaves-speech/87604632/ My girlfriend was telling me that immediately after FLOTUS's speech, there was an uptick of people on social media angry that she mentioned slavery in the speech. As though pointing out progress is somehow bad. It doesn't even seem surprising that Fox News would go this route of trying to discredit the horrors of slavery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheKitttenGuard Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 5 minutes ago, Ormond said: I believe this is a grievous insult to the Disney character -- as well as to Daisy, Huey, Dewey, Louie, Scrooge, April, May, June, and all their other friends and relatives. Yes the comparison of Trump to any cartoon character is a defamation of the cartoon character. 26 minutes ago, Fragile Bird said: OMG. Bill O'Reilly on Fox News had to go fact check Michelle Obama's statement about slaves building the White House. His response? They were well-fed slaves.... http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/onpolitics/2016/07/27/bill-oreilly-michelle-obama-white-house-slaves-speech/87604632/ The political foundation that this view is based is why for my many misgivings and deep concerns with Clinton I will be voting for her in Pa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IheartIheartTesla Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 I thought the Clinton speech was servicable, not a barn-burner like the one he gave in 2012 (that gave me goosebumps). It seemed more like a fireside chat as we ran through the 45 years the couple has been together. It probably did well enough for those who are already in the Dem camp, and didn't do much to move the needle for people still waffling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MerenthaClone Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 15 minutes ago, IheartIheartTesla said: I thought the Clinton speech was servicable, not a barn-burner like the one he gave in 2012 (that gave me goosebumps). It seemed more like a fireside chat as we ran through the 45 years the couple has been together. It probably did well enough for those who are already in the Dem camp, and didn't do much to move the needle for people still waffling. I thought it was awesome how he gave something in the vein of the traditional FLOTUS speech instead of his usual style. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mexal Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 19 minutes ago, IheartIheartTesla said: I thought the Clinton speech was servicable, not a barn-burner like the one he gave in 2012 (that gave me goosebumps). It seemed more like a fireside chat as we ran through the 45 years the couple has been together. It probably did well enough for those who are already in the Dem camp, and didn't do much to move the needle for people still waffling. I don't know. Think it was meant to humanize her to the people who think she's out for herself only and doesn't actually want to help people. For the people already in the Dem camp, they're more interested in the issues than the person I'd think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S John Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 14 minutes ago, Mexal said: I don't know. Think it was meant to humanize her to the people who think she's out for herself only and doesn't actually want to help people. For the people already in the Dem camp, they're more interested in the issues than the person I'd think. He also detailed several of her accomplishments. Something I have repeatedly seen conservatives accusing her of having none of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goddess Dictator Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 random thoughts b/c I'm terrible at coherent ones. 1. michelle obama's speech slayed. seriously. very nice job. I got actual goosebumps, and life has turned me into an immovable block of stone so go michelle! 2. I need more information on the TPP. I'm trying to educate myself. Can I get some links to some neutral descriptions of it? all i seem to be able to find are biased interpretations. hell a link to the actual content itself would be great. I am working 50 hour weeks and have a damn zoo at home (one fiance, five cats, three dogs, two goldfish) and between the two i just have so little time to make sure i am informed, so I am reaching out for help from my trusted peeps here. 3. I read the board all the time. I just rarely have time to post (see number 2.) and it makes me happy to see you guys still posting and arguing and discussing things. 4. I am soooo sorry to hear about your son's cancer kalbear. If you ever need to vent or talk or if there's ever anything I can do just let me know. 5. *waves at xray and fez and jax and everyone else* on a non political note does anyone know if mya stone is ok? i cant' get a hold of her. 6. back on politics: I think this particular election (which is insane at this point) partisanship just needs to be left out of it. simply put, our options are a proven, life long public servant, with some shady-ish things in her past (which to be honest the shadiness is almost a requirement for any successful politician or effective politician), or a textbook narcissist, who, by definition, can only look out for himself. The fact that he couldn't let go of Cruz the day after Cruz's speech at the RNC even though bringing it back up and talking shit about Cruz was the worst thing he could have done for his campaign speaks volumes. This is not even a narcissist who has the cunning necessary to be a good politician. This is a person who is so thin skinned he couldn't let the Cruz speech go. Any vote for anyone other than Hillary contributes to the chances we end up with that person holding the keys. To me it's a no brainer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 So trump just did two things that would usually be death. The first is that he criticized Tim kaines time as governor of new jersey. That's a fair criticism as kaine didn't do much for new Jersey. Counterpoint would be that Kaine was governor of Virginia. The second is that trump hoped that the Russians did have Clinton's emails. Hoping that foreign intelligence departments influence your election is a special kind of stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mexal Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 3 minutes ago, Kalbear said: So trump just did two things that would usually be death. The first is that he criticized Tim kaines time as governor of new jersey. That's a fair criticism as kaine didn't do much for new Jersey. Counterpoint would be that Kaine was governor of Virginia. The second is that trump hoped that the Russians did have Clinton's emails. Hoping that foreign intelligence departments influence your election is a special kind of stupid. And in the end, none of these points will matter. He'll likely get a bump from it. He also told Katy Tur to "be quiet" when she asked about Russia and the emails. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 37 minutes ago, Kalbear said: The second is that trump hoped that the Russians did have Clinton's emails. Hoping that foreign intelligence departments influence your election is a special kind of stupid. This is just beyond fucked. The whole press conference was insane. And all Ryan and McConnell will do is put out meaningless statements saying "We disagree, but we still support Trump." I saw that Ryan already did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
all swedes are racist Posted July 27, 2016 Share Posted July 27, 2016 41 minutes ago, Kalbear said: So trump just did two things that would usually be death. The first is that he criticized Tim kaines time as governor of new jersey. That's a fair criticism as kaine didn't do much for New Jersey. Counterpoint would be that Kaine was governor of Virginia. The second is that trump hoped that the Russians did have Clinton's emails. Hoping that foreign intelligence departments influence your election is a special kind of stupid. Presumably why he didn't pick him for VP... Picturing Christie watching that all like... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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