Watch, Watched, Watching: The Workprint Prototype Version

[PetyrPunkinhead]

I forgot to mention that I had to kill some time yesterday, so I saw a movie I originally had no intention of seeing in the theater and turned out to really like it--SULLY. It's exactly what you think it is, but it turned out to be more emotional than I'd anticipated. It's all about how when people are at their best things can work out rather miraculously. So much focus is brought about on what, how, when, and why things can go wrong *cough*Benghazi*cough* that it was nice to see a film dedicated to the people in NYC who got something so utterly right. Definitely catch this one when it hits video.

 

2 minutes ago, First of My Name said:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

A reunion between Zuko and Iroh in the spirit world. But sadly that was not to be  

They mostly left the gangster aspect behind after season 1, but yeah, I thought it looked terrific too.

Yeah, there were a couple of ATLA reunions or flashbacks I was really hoping to get in the LOK series that never happened. :/ And true that gangster vibe left mostly with S1, but that was arguably the best of all the seasons.

[Veltigar]

44 minutes ago, First of My Name said:

I never noticed any wasted build-up though, what do you refer to by that?

Korra as a whole was more mature and darker than ATLA. Throughout season three, they were really building up from that. When Zaheer 

Spoiler

killed the earth queen, I was convinced LoK would finally live up to that full adult potential. In the end though, not one of the good guys was ever really in danger. They should have sacrificed someone (or several someone's) from Korra's entourage imo. It would have made her season four arc much more affecting, because we would have been able to put a face on her grief and PTSD. 

Another thing that disappointed me was Zaheer's transition from nuanced villain to someone who was just Evil-for-the-lols-of-it. One of the more interesting ideas at the heart of Korra was the fundamental imbalance of power between benders and non-benders. The figure of the Avatar, when you think of it, is really problematic because the power disparity is just so enormous.

I genuinely felt that it would have been a wiser move to treat Zaheer and Co's philosophical potential with more respect, because the showrunners should recognize that due to human nature, the "office" of Avatar would bring loads of problems with it, because avatars are human and as humans, we err in bigger ways than the ATLA and LoK tend to acknowledge.

 

44 minutes ago, First of My Name said:

Bolin was way more fun than Mako but never really developed beyond Sokka 2.0, so while I wouldn't give him all or most of Mako's screentime, I'd make significant changes to Mako's character, as he never really did anything for between season 1 and the very last episode..

Well, if you cut Mako out of the story, you could use the available screentime to develop Bolin's character beyond being a poor man's Sokka. If I had to adapt LoK, I would only keep Mako if I could sacrifice him later on. 

Spoiler

He would have been a good candidate to off in the final showdown between Team Avatar and Team Zaheer. 

 

44 minutes ago, First of My Name said:

(in fact, he was one of the last characters added the story before production started)

That doesn't really say anything though. The only thing that matters is the final product, doesn't matter when the idea of a character enters into an author's head. Patrick Rothfuss has written some wonderful things about the irrelevance of the moment of conception to the importance of a character or plot element for a story.

44 minutes ago, First of My Name said:

I loved how they explained the lore. The lion turtles, the aesthetic, Wan's story and even the evil flying kite drew me in completely. I don't mind at all that they went into detail on the Avatar's history.

Absolutely hated pretty much all of it. I loved most of the aesthetic of those episodes, especially compared to the rest of that second season which looked like shit, but the origin story itself was purile drivel. Especially those idiotic kites. They looked pathetic and they made the age old fantasy mistake of allowing all the conflict to revolve around the battle between great evil personified vs. great good personified.

ATLA was such an interesting world because it was all about human beings. The humanity of the characters and how even fundamentally good characters did not always make the right choices despite their immens powers was always what made ATLA so special. By (partly) reducing the conflict to kite vs. kite combat, they lost some of what made this world so special. 

Not to mention that a lot of it didn't make sense. The way the world was constructed in the early past and the fact that the lion turtles could hand down powers were just stupid ideas. If you'd only have to fool some lion turtles to get all the avatar's powers, then some human being would have succeeded in doing that before and after Wan. 

It was much better when the lion turtles were a slightly alien element, like in ATLA. What they were and the way they fitted into the structure of that particular universe remained a mystery to us, which allowed us to write our own explanation for them. You couldn't nitpick it apart and you could even feel a sort of mourning for the fact that you'd never know, since the library burned down and all the knowledge about the lion turtles was lost with them.

44 minutes ago, First of My Name said:

I'd count Zuko as deuteragonist, if that's the right word. He's not quite as important to the story as Aang but the fact that he has his ow storyline does sort of make him more important than Sokka and Katara.

 

 I get what you are trying to say, but I do have to disagree.

Spoiler

To me, ATLA as a whole should primarily be read as a battle for Zuko's soul. That's what the whole plot hinges around emotionally. Sure, there is the mechanical 'save the world plot' that has to be resolved, but without Zuko, Aang's quest is essentially doomed to fail. 

Just look at the finale for instance. Aang's fight against Ozaï is rather trite. A lot of flash without substance. Zuko and Katarra vs. Azula on the other hand, that's where the real drama lies. 

 

 

27 minutes ago, PetyrPunkinhead said:

Yeah, there were a couple of ATLA reunions or flashbacks I was really hoping to get in the LOK series that never happened. :/ And true that gangster vibe left mostly with S1, but that was arguably the best of all the seasons.

SEASON THREE FOR EVA 

EDIT: We should have gotten more 

Spoiler

Zuko. Cut the ghost of Iro out (the way they handled that was one of the worst part of LoK) and have him be that guy. And sacrifice someone from the old cast. That would have been great.

 

[First of My Name]

22 minutes ago, PetyrPunkinhead said:

 

Yeah, there were a couple of ATLA reunions or flashbacks I was really hoping to get in the LOK series that never happened. :/ And true that gangster vibe left mostly with S1, but that was arguably the best of all the seasons.

I get why they didn't want to reunite the entire old cast but goddamn would it have been sweet to see.

No it wasn't  Three is the best without a doubt.

[Ramsay B.]

19 hours ago, Kindly Old Man said:

If you're near NYC it's playing at the AMC in Times Square

Thanks. I'm not close enough to go there for a movie. I'll find it online somewhere, eventually.

2 hours ago, Astromech said:

Finally saw The Revenant. The acting and cinematography were wonderful, as was the scenery. However, I was bored in parts and the film was an hour too long. Felt like Terrence Malick at times.

Yeah. It's a good movie, but I just can't bring myself to watch it again. It did drag at many parts.

[Theda Baratheon]

ive been watching all the twilight movies the past few days and actually really enjoying them…i don’t think i ever PROPERLY watched any of them by myself before??? i really like the soundtracks to all of them tbh…and the acting really isn’t that bad!!!! i can’t believe i hated these movies so much just because it was ‘’cool’’ too. i hate the term ‘’guilty pleasure’’ why do we have to feel guilty for enjoying something ??

[Theda Baratheon]

like, okay. theyre not great movies but for teen movies the relationships are compelling enough, the cast looks good, and some of the background characters are really interesting !! 

also. there ARE a few select scenes that are genuinely..like..really good??? most of it is just silly melodramatic teen romance (whats so wrong with that really) and yeah the whole bella/edward relationships is kinda heaped with loads of problems lmao but theres this one scene in new moon i always remembered and it's genuinely beautiful and it makes me sad there weren't more moments like this which showcased a potential for genuinely good movies.

this is the scene: this scene is GORGEOUS !!! it actually makes my chest hurt a bit 

and the whole way bella's depression is handled and being with jacob makes her come back to life a bit is actually genuinely touching !!!! i can't believe im writing so much about TWILIGHT but fuck it im being myself lmao. 

 

[First of My Name]

19 hours ago, Veltigar said:

Korra as a whole was more mature and darker than ATLA. Throughout season three, they were really building up from that. When Zaheer 

  Hide contents

killed the earth queen, I was convinced LoK would finally live up to that full adult potential. In the end though, not one of the good guys was ever really in danger. They should have sacrificed someone (or several someone's) from Korra's entourage imo. It would have made her season four arc much more affecting, because we would have been able to put a face on her grief and PTSD. 

Another thing that disappointed me was Zaheer's transition from nuanced villain to someone who was just Evil-for-the-lols-of-it. One of the more interesting ideas at the heart of Korra was the fundamental imbalance of power between benders and non-benders. The figure of the Avatar, when you think of it, is really problematic because the power disparity is just so enormous.

I genuinely felt that it would have been a wiser move to treat Zaheer and Co's philosophical potential with more respect, because the showrunners should recognize that due to human nature, the "office" of Avatar would bring loads of problems with it, because avatars are human and as humans, we err in bigger ways than the ATLA and LoK tend to acknowledge.

 

Well, if you cut Mako out of the story, you could use the available screentime to develop Bolin's character beyond being a poor man's Sokka. If I had to adapt LoK, I would only keep Mako if I could sacrifice him later on. 

  Reveal hidden contents

He would have been a good candidate to off in the final showdown between Team Avatar and Team Zaheer. 

 

That doesn't really say anything though. The only thing that matters is the final product, doesn't matter when the idea of a character enters into an author's head. Patrick Rothfuss has written some wonderful things about the irrelevance of the moment of conception to the importance of a character or plot element for a story.

Absolutely hated pretty much all of it. I loved most of the aesthetic of those episodes, especially compared to the rest of that second season which looked like shit, but the origin story itself was purile drivel. Especially those idiotic kites. They looked pathetic and they made the age old fantasy mistake of allowing all the conflict to revolve around the battle between great evil personified vs. great good personified.

ATLA was such an interesting world because it was all about human beings. The humanity of the characters and how even fundamentally good characters did not always make the right choices despite their immens powers was always what made ATLA so special. By (partly) reducing the conflict to kite vs. kite combat, they lost some of what made this world so special. 

Not to mention that a lot of it didn't make sense. The way the world was constructed in the early past and the fact that the lion turtles could hand down powers were just stupid ideas. If you'd only have to fool some lion turtles to get all the avatar's powers, then some human being would have succeeded in doing that before and after Wan. 

It was much better when the lion turtles were a slightly alien element, like in ATLA. What they were and the way they fitted into the structure of that particular universe remained a mystery to us, which allowed us to write our own explanation for them. You couldn't nitpick it apart and you could even feel a sort of mourning for the fact that you'd never know, since the library burned down and all the knowledge about the lion turtles was lost with them.

 I get what you are trying to say, but I do have to disagree.

  Hide contents

To me, ATLA as a whole should primarily be read as a battle for Zuko's soul. That's what the whole plot hinges around emotionally. Sure, there is the mechanical 'save the world plot' that has to be resolved, but without Zuko, Aang's quest is essentially doomed to fail. 

Just look at the finale for instance. Aang's fight against Ozaï is rather trite. A lot of flash without substance. Zuko and Katarra vs. Azula on the other hand, that's where the real drama lies. 

 

SEASON THREE FOR EVA 

EDIT: We should have gotten more 

  Hide contents

Zuko. Cut the ghost of Iro out (the way they handled that was one of the worst part of LoK) and have him be that guy. And sacrifice someone from the old cast. That would have been great.

 

That's a fair point, and looking back I agree that that would have improved the story.

Spoiler

I would've had Ming-Hua or Ghazan kill Mako just before or during the final battle. It would be also be a way to develop Bolin.

I think the writers examined the troublesome nature of the Avatar's existence pretty well though, certainly more than I expected them to. I'd say that the main conflict of LoK is Korra struggling to find a place in the world as Avatar.

It means that Avatar was originally intended to be Aang's story. It's true that the intended product and the final product are two different things,

I both agree and disagree on the flashback - having characters symbolize good and evil is indeed a poor choice, so yes, it could have been better. But that doesn't automatically make it bad, I still enjoyed those episodes immensely.

Spoiler

I think that's mostly because Ozai is a rather undeveloped villain. Plus he and Aang had never even met before then, which doesn't really leave room for a lot of drama between them - that was what the Zuko/Azula fight was for, but that was not what the show had been building towards since the beginning, and what the entire plot revolved around. That is undeniably Aang vs. Ozai. Avatar could work as a story without Zuko (even if it's in a far inferior state), but you don't have a show without Aang (who also received way more screentime over the course of the show).

I'm not sure I could have handled watching Katara, Zuko or Toph die off-screen, and I'm not sure what it would have added, unlike with Mako's death. Whether it improves the show or not depends on the execution though, so I'd be open to the idea but not enthusiastic about it.

 

41 minutes ago, Theda Baratheon said:

this is the scene: this scene is GORGEOUS !!! it actually makes my chest hurt a bit 

and the whole way bella's depression is handled and being with jacob makes her come back to life a bit is actually genuinely touching !!!! i can't believe im writing so much about TWILIGHT but fuck it im being myself lmao. 

 

I agree that that's a surprisingly good-looking scene but knowing the context of their relationship still kind of hampers my enjoyment.

[Theda Baratheon]

Yeah, their relationship is unhealthy to the extreme but I almost forget all that on the strength of that scene. It's just gorgeous and really effective plus I honestly just really appreciate the way Bella's depression is handled. I've never been depressed from heartbreak before, but I've been depressed and the movie showed is so well with that montage of all the months going by and Bella staying the same. 

[Theda Baratheon]

I mean I actually don't like Edward at all, he's so strained and boring and not compelling as a character at all, but I actually like Bella. I like Jake and the werewolves a lot and the secondary vampire characters are really interesting. Rosalie's backstory, Jasper's and Alice's backstories, basically all their backstories except for Edward's are really neat concepts, not executed brilliantly in books or film but neat concepts nonetheless. And the volturi are so much fun to watch with Michael Sheen as the lead. 

[RedEyedGhost]

I'm finally getting around to Braindead, on episode 5, and it's excellent.  Highly rec'd.

ETA: Tony Shaloub's accent is extremely distracting.

[briantw]

The Shield is so good.  It's amazing how quickly I've burned through five seasons during my re-watch.  Seasons four and five are just tremendous television. 

[Channel4s-JonSnow]

On 9/16/2016 at 0:59 PM, Veltigar said:

Yeah, that element was the worst part of season one. It never gains the same prominence again.

Oh, keep watching, it will make sense in the end  

Yeah, Mads is perfect in this 

Don't mean to turn this into my very own personal Hannibal thread. But I'm now 3 eps into season 2 and I can say that the show has improved vastly. I think maybe you misremembered just what a big change the show has taken. It feels like NBC or whatever said to Fuller he can do what he wants after season 1, because s2 is more like a real, well thought out, piece of tv, as opposed to a poorly made CSI varient. The writing is almost a million miles better, and each episode is structured in a far more interesting way than previously. I'm actually enjoying it now, instead of feeling like I'm watching it because my GF likes it. 

[Channel4s-JonSnow]

Plus, I watched Dusk till Dawn again the other night, the movie, not the awful tv show version. I totally forgot just how much fun it was. Its an absolute delight, so few movies managed to be created for entertainment purposes in the way that movie was. Its a shame there aren't more movies like that.

[Mark Antony]

6 hours ago, briantw said:

The Shield is so good.  It's amazing how quickly I've burned through five seasons during my re-watch.  Seasons four and five are just tremendous television. 

Weird I'm watching it again as well. Really a tragic show. Lots of moments on rewatch are hard to get through knowing how it all plays out. Season five is just insane. 

[Davrum]

Watched Bogey and Bacall in The Big Sleep. 

Still a lot of fun, with a ton of top notch banter, and DAMN, what chemistry those two had. The TV was about to burst into flame a couple of times there, I swear it.

[briantw]

7 hours ago, Mark Antony said:

Weird I'm watching it again as well. Really a tragic show. Lots of moments on rewatch are hard to get through knowing how it all plays out. Season five is just insane. 

I personally think it has the best ending in TV history.  The fates of all the main characters, while tragic, is just perfect.  Vic's fate in particular is just brilliant.

[PetyrPunkinhead]

17 hours ago, Channel4s-JonSnow said:

Plus, I watched Dusk till Dawn again the other night, the movie, not the awful tv show version. I totally forgot just how much fun it was. Its an absolute delight, so few movies managed to be created for entertainment purposes in the way that movie was. Its a shame there aren't more movies like that.

Yeah, very fun movie. I wish Robert Rodriguez and Tarantino would make a sequel with Clooney in El Rey. It'll never happen, but it'd be great

14 hours ago, Mark Antony said:

Weird I'm watching it again as well. Really a tragic show. Lots of moments on rewatch are hard to get through knowing how it all plays out. Season five is just insane. 

Oh man, those first few seasons of THE SHIELD were some of the best TV. It never got bad, thankfully, but the intensity of those seasons up until the heist were crazy intense. Also, I agree what someone else wrote about the finale being one of the best. Such a perfect fate for Vic.

[briantw]

3 hours ago, PetyrPunkinhead said:

Oh man, those first few seasons of THE SHIELD were some of the best TV. It never got bad, thankfully, but the intensity of those seasons up until the heist were crazy intense. Also, I agree what someone else wrote about the finale being one of the best. Such a perfect fate for Vic.

Seasons four and five were my favorite because the show was always at its best when Vic was one step ahead of getting caught and going to jail for the rest of his life, and that's basically the case all through both seasons.

[Nictarion]

Burning through my rewatch of Curb Your Enthusiasm. Just finished S4. I love this show so much. Easily put it in my top 5 comedy shows. Really hope we get the long awaited S9 at some point. But like with the Deadwood movie, I'll believe it when I see it. 

[Nictarion]

South Park S20 is killing it so far. Love the Member Berries, and tonight had this little gem:

"Your daughter has a mustache. WTF is wrong with your ovaries you bitch?"