Iron Mother Posted August 4, 2016 Share Posted August 4, 2016 The Maggy prophecy said gold would be their crowns and gold their shrouds. This spoke of Cercei's children. Where does Myrcella fit into this? In the book, she is maimed (not killed) WHILE Ariane of Dorne is trying to get her to make a claim for the Iron Throne based on she is older than Tommen - and IN DORNE a female can rule before a man based on age. Of course, none of these people or things exist in the show, but the prophecy still does. It specifically showed Tommen's death shroud of gold in the show. The prophecy applies to Cercei's 3 children. In the book, you could still make a case for this because Myrcella (and Tommen) are still alive. In the show all 3 children are dead. How can this turn out in the show proper? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onion Hound Posted August 5, 2016 Share Posted August 5, 2016 She had 4 kids in the show. (The black haired beauty)...in will never be proper in the show...not even sure why they added it in. No volanquar, and everything about her kids is off...it won't ever make sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashes Of Westeros Posted August 5, 2016 Share Posted August 5, 2016 In the books Myrcella prepares to depart from Dorne (I'm reading ADWD now), so anything could happen to her on the way. In the show Cersei indeed mentioned a child who died, but nobody else spoke about this child anymore. Probably, she made up the story for Cat to show as if she cared about comatose Bran and understanded Cat's feelings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prince of the North Posted August 5, 2016 Share Posted August 5, 2016 I think interpreting the "gold will be their crowns" as referring to royal crowns of office is a mistake. I don't believe it actually refers to "crowns" worn by royalty but simply to the color of their hair. Because, in the books, their hair color is used as proof that they they are Lannisters, not Baratheons, and is a very important detail. Then, I believe the "and gold will be their shrouds" is a directly related follow-up on the color of Cercei's children's hair being gold. I think "and gold will be their shrouds" means that, despite all of Cercei's children actually being Lannister bastards born of incest, they will all die with the world believing them to be Baratheons (i.e. being placed under gold burial shrouds when they are laid to rest, not red). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lakin1013 Posted August 5, 2016 Share Posted August 5, 2016 4 hours ago, Prince of the North said: I think interpreting the "gold will be their crowns" as referring to royal crowns of office is a mistake. I don't believe it actually refers to "crowns" worn by royalty but simply to the color of their hair. Because, in the books, their hair color is used as proof that they they are Lannisters, not Baratheons, and is a very important detail...... Agree with this. I have always thought that the 'crown' could easily be the golden hair of Cersei's children. The Baratheon sigil is a black stag on a gold background. I have read elsewhere that the sigil can be interpreted as a gold shroud in that these 3 children will be buried the sigil of the Baratheon family. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prince of the North Posted August 5, 2016 Share Posted August 5, 2016 14 minutes ago, lakin1013 said: Agree with this. I have always thought that the 'crown' could easily be the golden hair of Cersei's children. The Baratheon sigil is a black stag on a gold background. I have read elsewhere that the sigil can be interpreted as a gold shroud in that these 3 children will be buried the sigil of the Baratheon family. Glad to see I'm not the only one! Also, another reason to doubt that "gold will be their crowns" refers to actually wearing royal crowns, I think, is that while an attempt was made to crown Myrcella in Dorne - it failed. Thus, she was never actually crowned and I seriously doubt another attempt will be made, let alone a successful attempt. So, in short, I doubt Myrcella will ever actually wear a crown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dsug Posted August 6, 2016 Share Posted August 6, 2016 Myrcella was still a Royal Princess, the King's daughter and then the King's sister. She was always royalty. She wore a metaphorical crown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkstream Posted August 6, 2016 Share Posted August 6, 2016 1 hour ago, dsug said: Myrcella was still a Royal Princess, the King's daughter and then the King's sister. She was always royalty. She wore a metaphorical crown. I think that both interpretations could work, however, I lean towards "gold will be their crowns" as referring to their hair color. This would give more weight to the prophecy, being that it foresees that Cercei's children are not true heirs to the throne, and is more connected to the events that will eventually lead to her downfall. At the time of the telling, Cersei is expecting to be married to Rhaegar, and would already think that her children will be royalty. Not much of a Prophecy, if it can only tell you something that you already know, or expect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Mother Posted August 6, 2016 Author Share Posted August 6, 2016 11 hours ago, Darkstream said: I think that both interpretations could work HI! They both could work if it's being timid with the resolution of the prophecy. "Shrouds" there is no doubt what that means. It means they will die. So then does the line "gold will be their crowns" just slide in as a nice way of rhyming it? Is it just meaningless except for the prose? Myrcella in the show is over. It never went in the direction of the book anyway. Joffrey and Tommen were both crowned (Iron Throne crowned). Are we willing to say that every single person in the 7 kingdoms of every royal family wears a "crown"? Blond hair... isn't that a bit meaningless in the scheme of the prophecy? Sure, it could work, but I'm not sure. So, in the book.......... the reason I made this thread......... Myrcella is caught up in a convoluted plot by Prince Doran's daughter Ariane... who believes her father wants to leave Dorne's rule to her brother instead of her (this is not a custom in Dorne). In Dorne, a woman can rule based on familial succession. This is recognized throughout the seven kingdoms. So, her logic is: "since Myrcella is betrothed to Trystane, and she is HERE IN DORNE (where women are allowed to rule) then the Iron Throne is rightfully hers because she is older than Tommen". But the books so far end with this plot being botched and Myrcella being maimed (but not killed). She still could wear the crown. I don't know, I am confused because of the 2 different versions - Book v Show: Dawn of Schism guess I don't like trivializing that line of the prophecy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkstream Posted August 6, 2016 Share Posted August 6, 2016 1 hour ago, Iron Mother said: Blond hair... isn't that a bit meaningless in the scheme of the prophecy? Sure, it could work, but I'm not sure. Why do you think this is meaningless? The first line refers to their deaths, and this line would allude to what essentially leads to their deaths. All of Cersei's children having blonde hair is an indicator that they are not true born children of the king, and trying to prevent this from becoming known is what instigates all of the events leading up to their deaths. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Mother Posted August 7, 2016 Author Share Posted August 7, 2016 5 hours ago, Darkstream said: Why do you think this is meaningless? The first line refers to their deaths, and this line would allude to what essentially leads to their deaths. All of Cersei's children having blonde hair is an indicator that they are not true born children of the king, and trying to prevent this from becoming known is what instigates all of the events leading up to their deaths. mmm.. it may not be meaningless, maybe i meant it just that line seems to require a lot of interpretation.... unless Myrcella ruled the Iron Throne at some point or even ruled Dorne(?) (no maybe not that either). I mean, "their crowns" why does that only refer to both Joffrey and Tommen both ruling the Iron Throne and leaving Myrcella out? I just have a hard time accepting that line in the prophecy is so vague or requiring such a random explanation as their blond hair. That's why I'm wondering if in the book it will happen. In the show, things are reversing from male to female power, woman rising, and the book also seems to be going that direction somewhat (we'll know more in the next book AND Myrcella is still alive in the books). You make a good point about the distinction The Maggy made between Robert's children and Cercei's children. So, that's a little more convincing. Being like "YOUR children (not Robert's children)" but even that doesn't address to me that 2 of the 3 "ruled" when Myrcella did not). Of course, she wouldn't understand that until much later (just like the whole prophecy in general. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Ghost of Someone Posted August 8, 2016 Share Posted August 8, 2016 Golden crowns - hair and crowns, princesses wear Tiara crowns too but if not, Golden hair. The base color of House Baratheon is Golden with a Black Stag. They were bastards shrouded in Gold of House Baratheon. Joff, Tommen and Myrcella were really "Hills" or maybe "Waters" (bastard names from the Westerlands or Crownlands) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AugustusTheGreat Posted August 8, 2016 Share Posted August 8, 2016 I still think that Gendry is the trueborn child of Robert and Cersei. She doesnt love Robert so why care for his child? Gendry + Podrick for the Iron Throne 2016. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Mother Posted August 9, 2016 Author Share Posted August 9, 2016 5 hours ago, AugustusTheGreat said: I still think that Gendry is the trueborn child of Robert and Cersei. She doesnt love Robert so why care for his child? Gendry + Podrick for the Iron Throne 2016. Cool! So manlove wins in the end. Podrick rules by Gendry's side works for me! What a totally new and refreshing take on the show direction. I love it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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